Bought new Onkyo TX-NR6050, hope I won't regret

[Trebdp83]

Why that is the case only Onkyo and Dolby can say. Like I mentioned earlier, IMAX DTS did the same regarding channel behavior. Perhaps Onkyo thought everybody at some point would use an Apple TV 4K for streaming and never watch broadcast TV or play discs ever again with dolby 5.1 signals. “What does that have to do with anything?” you ask. Here we go.

The Apple TV 4K converts everything to LPCM by default but retains Atmos metadata(Dolby MAT) for processing by a receiver when getting an Atmos/DD+ 7.1 track from a stream. Anything in 5.1 gets sent as LPCM and the receiver simply recognizes the signal as MULTICHANNEL PCM. Since there is no Dolby signal flagged in the receiver, an Onkyo receiver specifically, it will output surround channel information into the surround speakers in DIRECT or straight MULTICHANNEL PCM sound modes with a 7.1 configuration.

One could work around the issue with PCM conversions in disc players for 5.1 but TVs and streamers will convert down to two channel PCM. They could also change the configuration from 7.1 to 5.1 for those dolby signals. Hey, they have to go into the Setup to turn on Center Spread anyway. It is what it is and is an understandable deal breaker. Just do the homework on these things before making any deals. The good stuff is in bold print. The bad stuff is hidden away here and there.

 

[snakeeyes]

I don’t know the history of “bleeding up-mixers of 2.0 sources” but I’m guessing that stuff arrived around the time of the “virtual heights” feature in 2018 or so? How did they solve that one?

7.1, never did that. Had 6.1 back in the day but eventually that back speaker annoyed me and went back to 5.1. Then went to 5.1.4 a few years ago and haven’t looked back.

 

[Mike Up]

Surprisingly, the Denon AVR-S960H has setup menus very similar to the Onkyo TX-NR6050. That's a good thing because it keeps it very simple. I guess gone are the days of my AVR-2312ci confusing menu system.

Another thing when I play a Dolby Vision movie, the volume display and info turns from blue to pink/magenta, just like the Onkyo. What's different about Denon from the Onkyo in regards to this, is that the Denon actually tells you in the manual about the color change when using Dolby Vision!

Many more options/features and much better audio video input/output information and so far, the speaker channel info goes to the correct speaker. My receiver is far past the 70001 need for 8K bug correction. It's in the 90000s.

While the Denon is 21 lbs and the Onkyo is 21.6 lbs, the Denon case is much smaller being a few inches shorter. However the Onkyo case is full of voids while the Denon is compact with little room left. Also the Onkyo uses a fan for the HDMI board, the Denon does not.

Havent' done any listening yet, just setup. I'll comment more later.

 

[Bald Italian]

While the Denon is 21 lbs and the Onkyo is 21.6 lbs, the Denon case is much smaller being a few inches shorter. However the Onkyo case is full of voids while the Denon is compact with little room left. Also the Onkyo uses a fan for the HDMI board, the Denon does not.

Havent' done any listening yet, just setup. I'll comment more later.

How warm does the Denon run? Because the Onkyo stays pretty cool all day long.

 

[Mike Up]

How warm does the Denon run? Because the Onkyo stays pretty cool all day long.

The Denon does get hot while the Onkyo stayed cool. The Denon does not use a fan like the Onkyo does, on the HDMI board. That fan has a space gap so it will help with any heat the receiver is putting off.

Interesting, while the Denon AVR -S960H and AVR-X2700H have no fans, the AVR-3700H has 2 and an extra heat sink! That thing must throw a lot of heat. Never really checked my AVR-2312ci as it doesnt have any fans and is the predecessor to the AVR-X3700H.

 

[Mike Up]

The Denon sounds great! But so did the Onkyo.

The Denon fixed an issue that bugged me on my 2313ci and 3803, being if any speaker levels were adjusted over 0db, it would subtract that off of the overall volume max. The S960H still keeps its +18 db max volume with surround speaker levels at +6 db!

 

[Mike Up]

The Denon is pretty cool in offering DD+ only playback from ATMOS or the straight ATMOS playback. The Onkyo couldnt do that.

 

[Bald Italian]

The Denon does get hot while the Onkyo stayed cool. The Denon does not use a fan like the Onkyo does, on the HDMI board. That fan has a space gap so it will help with any heat the receiver is putting off.

Interesting, while the Denon AVR -S960H and AVR-X2700H have no fans, the AVR-X3700H has 2 and an extra heat sink! That thing must throw a lot of heat. Never really checked my AVR-2312ci as it doesnt have any fans and is the predecessor to the AVR-X3700H.

Thanks! I'll stick with the "fanned" Onkyo 6050. I even added 2 AC Infinity MULTIFAN S5, Quiet Dual 80mm USB Fans to insure that my 6050 stays cool. I had an older Integra preamp that had failing chips due to the heat.
Even beyond all of the technical talk on this thread, I will still maintain "bragging rights" on the sonic qualities of the 6050. It goes above and beyond just being a mid-priced receiver with the sonics it projects.
Transparency and sound staging that I guarantee beats the pants off of the Denon. I can assure that because I came from high-end separates & this thing brings a whole new level to the "listening party".

 

[Bald Italian]

The Denon is pretty cool in offering DD+ only playback from ATMOS or the straight ATMOS playback. The Onkyo couldnt do that.

Not a deal breaker at all in my 5.1 system.

 

[Trebdp83]

While Denons are famous for getting very warm, the S760H I had and tortured a bit with 5 4ohm speakers didn't get as hot as the Yamaha RX-V6A which nearly left a mark when I touched it. The Onkyo ran cooler than the other two. I don't think the S960H will have any issues unless driven at absurd levels for long periods of time.

In other news, information concerning surround channel information going to surround back speakers in 7.1 configurations with Dolby 5.1 signals has come in from Onkyo and is as was suspected. Apparently, if the support rep is to be believed, Dolby is directing this behavior concerning Dolby 5.1 signals and 7.1 speaker configurations and there will be no firmware update to change it. Dolby may have assumed anybody buying a new Onkyo seven channel receiver with Atmos and DTS:X capability would surely use it in a 5.1.2 configuration and never have to deal with the strange behavior. I don't have to deal with it in my 5.1 setup but am feeling like I should show some solidarity here and denounce Dolby and Onkyo both for it.

 

[Trebdp83]

The Denon is pretty cool in offering DD+ only playback from ATMOS or the straight ATMOS playback. The Onkyo couldnt do that.

Please elaborate on this feature. It doesn't sound quite right as no AVR can change an incoming signal. What is the content info, source device and output settings and the Denon's selected sound mode?

 

[Bald Italian]

Does the volume level on the Denon always look that small or can you adjust that on the display?

 

[Mike Up]

Please elaborate on this feature. It doesn't sound quite right as no AVR can change an incoming signal. What is the content info, source device and output settings and the Denon's selected sound mode?

It's a streaming Atmos/DD+ soundtrack. DD+ EX with flag set, is in the Pacific Rim: Uprising soundtrack. I bought the Digital Movie from the VUDU app. The Denon info screen told me all of this through it's screen in the setup menu.

You have the option to listen to DD+ sound mode or Atmos/Dsurround sound mode. Obviously Atmos sound mode plays the atmos soundtrack but DD+ sound mode retrieves the DD+ 5.1 EX soundtrack inbedded in the Atmos Soundtrack. This imbedded DD+ 5.1 EX soundtrack is what my Denon AVR-2312ci would use since it's not Atmos compatible.

I think it's pretty cool I can choose which soundtrack to use although the Atmos would be the best with 7.1 support instead of an EX Matrix.

I also found out that DTS 5.1 is outputting 7.1 in straight DTS mode, just like the Onkyo. This is what I expected as since there is no more surround back speakers option, it obviously allows DTS to choose it's recommended surround rear channel option. I believe it's a matrixed channel, opposed to what neural X would do. HOWEVER, in Direct mode, you stick with only the 5.1 channel output with the surround rear speakers off. The Onkyo did the same thing.

The only thing the Onkyo did different with Dolby was flip surround speakers for surround rear speakers, which doesn't work the best in my setup. It would had been nice if Onkyo would had put an option in have surround channel info to the chosen surround speakers instead of forcing that info to go just to the surround back speakers.

Also the Denon Direct mode acts like a Direct mode where the Onkyo Direct mode still manipulated where the surround channel info was directed.

I'm really liking the Denon over the Onkyo and the $100 ($200 for me with discounts) more seems justified from all the confusion brought on by the Onkyo design and poor documentatioin.

 

[Mike Up]

Does the volume level on the Denon always look that small or can you adjust that on the display?

The Volume bar is much larger than the Onkyo volume bar, plus when you hit the info button, the volume display is very large.

 

[Bald Italian]

The Volume bar is much larger than the Onkyo volume bar, plus when you hit the info button, the volume display is very large.

On the unit itself or on the television?

 

[Mike Up]

In other news, information concerning surround channel information going to surround back speakers in 7.1 configurations with Dolby 5.1 signals has come in from Onkyo and is as was suspected. Apparently, if the support rep is to be believed, Dolby is directing this behavior concerning Dolby 5.1 signals and 7.1 speaker configurations and there will be no firmware update to change it.

I don't know if I believe that rep. because the "2" reps I talked to at Onkyo thought the surround channel info should stay in the surround channel speakers and not the surround back channel speakers. Then I found the info in the NR5100 and NR7100 manuals. I've yet to get a call back from them with a resolution! Great support.

I don't have to deal with it in my 5.1 setup but am feeling like I should show some solidarity here and denounce Dolby and Onkyo both for it.

That's up to you, but it didn't sound that good coming from just the surround back speakers. Hek, they should had just put the surround channel info into all 4 surround and surround back speakers. That would had been better for sure. But also keep the Direct mode a "DIRECT" mode and keep the surround channel info steering correct!

 

[Trebdp83]

I don't know if I believe that rep. because the "2" reps I talked to at Onkyo thought the surround channel info should stay in the surround channel speakers and not the surround back channel speakers. Then I found the info in the NR5100 and NR7100 manuals. I've yet to get a call back from them with a resolution! Great support.



That's up to you, but it didn't sound that good coming from just the surround back speakers. Hek, they should had just put the surround channel info into all 4 surround and surround back speakers. That would had been better for sure. But also keep the Direct mode a "DIRECT" mode and keep the surround channel info steering correct!

I'm in agreement with you on it. Their reps aren't very good and the fact that the issue only applies to Dolby signals puts the light right on Dolby.

 

[Mike Up]

On the unit itself or on the television?

The On-Screen Display. I rarely look at the front display of the receiver as it's a good 14' away.

 

[Bald Italian]

The On-Screen Display. I rarely look at the front display of the receiver as it's a good 14' away.

Thanks. I'm only 9' away and I constantly looking at the display info on the receiver when I change volume settings because the volume display doesn't show up on every input with my setup.

 

[Mike Up]

Dolby Digital 5.1 EX does not contain Atmos metadata. While different services offer Atmos tracks with their

That Atmos signal has to be backward compatible with non-Atmos receivers. That's the soundtrack for non-Atmos receivers.

I'm in agreement with you on it. Their reps aren't very good and the fact that the issue only applies to Dolby signals puts the light right on Dolby.

I believe it's their processing hardware. I believe it may be more limited than Denon and Yamaha. I've never, ever, heard of changing the channel info steering without an option to do so.

On a side note, the AVR-S960H and AVR-S970H both still have the AKM DACs as the 960 was before the AKM fire and the 970 was a year after the AKM fire. The Onkyo 2021 models had to go to the Texas Instrument Burr Brown DACs because those models were being built when the fire affected AKM's production.

While it's most likely not even within the threshold of hearing, the AKM DACs do measure much better than the Texas Instrument DACs.