When is justice to be served?

haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
But let me drive. I know the area. :D

Actually, Newark is the preferred airport. It's closer to Manhattan than either Kennedy of LaGuardia. ...about 15 minutes. ..less in a Ferrari.
2 million thanks, from the air it' looks like it's easy to get lost

A rented Ferrari is always quicker.....
Can you believe that Michael Schumacher gets millions just to drive a Ferrari 456 as a private car?

I would have done it for free.....

Harald, you should make it to Florida at some point. First round's on me. :D
If any of you should visit Bergen or the West coast of Norway I'll show you around....
Bergen harbor is voted the third most beautiful in the world, just beaten by Rio de Janeiro and Sydney
 
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Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
stratman

stratman

Audioholic Ninja
Good one Tarub - I'll see your post and raise you one. Together for anyone who still has doubts that the sovereignty of our country is in jeopardy:

http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/m/montebello-flag.htm

hablas espanol? y tu?
I'm sure some folks are happy about that. I'm sick of yelling at the top of my lungs: ignorance, p.c., laxapathy and the enemy within will bring this once proud and noble country to it's end and those that decry the right as alarmists, bigoted, war-mongering and un-caring will be leading the parade, while burning the flag, all in the name of free speech. What's ironic, in the former Soviet countries even after years of brutal oppression no citizen burns their flag, in the middle east no one burns their flags, only here in the land of dumb and blind it's considered freedom of speech. People have long confused freedom of speech with rebellious treachery. And before you accuse the forefathers about being rebellious to England, remember that England was a monarchy, which is still a form of dictatorship benign or not. And our forefathers had the courage to follow through with their intent, something the cowards who hide behind the veil of "freedom of speech" will never dare, no they rather work behind the scenes, start at the root and slowly kill the tree. Well we're here, I feel sorry for my kid and his kids, what they're going to inherit will be an abomination.
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
Seriously Joe, you should stop trying to dig yourself further into the hole...
I have never started. You are merely wrong (wrong in a mundane, boring sort of way, rather than anything to get excited about.)
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
And, why do you single out Iraqis? Do they look different from Saudis, Iranians. Lebanese or any other middle-eastern nationality?
Once again, you are rather hopelessly confused. I have not singled out anybody, merely pointed out the fact that many others do. You are also reinforcing my point, as all the peoples you listed have become targets for violence by bigots and abuse by authorities. (The way that those of middle eastern appearance are treated in the US today is similar to the way that Japanese and those of oriental appearance were treated here during WWII.)
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
The troubling thing is that they are very smart, clever and know that we are looking for the above descriptions - hence, they may be walking among us and we don't even know it.
Precisely. Which is why fighting an idiotic war will do nothing to slow them down. The next 9/11 is likely to be by people who "homeland security" never noticed at all.
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
Oh, and just to be clear, I absolutely support our troops. It is the idiots in Washington sending those troops to die for no reason that I will never support.
 
Davemcc

Davemcc

Audioholic Spartan
You are also reinforcing my point, as all the peoples you listed have become targets for violence by bigots and abuse by authorities.
It might seem odd to you Joe, but I haven't read any newspaper articles, seen any newscasts or otherwise come across any indication that Islamic persons have been subject to physical violence or threats in the United States. Surely Ted Turner would have any such incident figured prominently in all his various media outlets to highlight such a situation. Perhaps you could link me up a credible news story that refers to such an incident.
 
Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
I'm sure some folks are happy about that. I'm sick of yelling at the top of my lungs: ignorance, p.c., laxapathy and the enemy within will bring this once proud and noble country to it's end and those that decry the right as alarmists, bigoted, war-mongering and un-caring will be leading the parade, while burning the flag, all in the name of free speech. What's ironic, in the former Soviet countries even after years of brutal oppression no citizen burns their flag, in the middle east no one burns their flags, only here in the land of dumb and blind it's considered freedom of speech. People have long confused freedom of speech with rebellious treachery. And before you accuse the forefathers about being rebellious to England, remember that England was a monarchy, which is still a form of dictatorship benign or not. And our forefathers had the courage to follow through with their intent, something the cowards who hide behind the veil of "freedom of speech" will never dare, no they rather work behind the scenes, start at the root and slowly kill the tree. Well we're here, I feel sorry for my kid and his kids, what they're going to inherit will be an abomination.
As always Strat - spot on, and I agree 200%. I fear that two generations from now (your kid's children), the common public will have been so dumbed down and mislead that they won't even realize the actual abomination (in your words) that they have inherited. Hell, the present generation more or less fails to recognize the trend analysis.

On the flip side of the coin however - and I've done tons of thinking on these matters, perhaps every generation has felt that the next two generations are doomed. Sure, we have come a long way since the Revolutionary era - we have abolished slavery, we have created infrastructure from coast to coast, we have leveled the playing field for both white/black and male/female, we have proven that the "Democratic Experiment" is a success, we helped stop Hitler in the 1940's, we defeated the Soviet Union without a single shot fired - all of these overwhelming positive things.

George Washington himself was a man who felt that America's only focus was westward progression, and that we should keep ourselves removed from the global dynamic - let what happens outside, stay outside, etc. As great as the man was, this was one of the fundamental flaws in his reasoning. Fortunately the other Founding Fathers recognized that as we grew as a country, became more powerful, a.) we would have to play a significant role in the world market, b.) we would indeed not be immune from further conflict, c.) natural resources would have to be an equity from which we would need to develop strong relationships and diplomatic processes to avoid polarizing the planet betwee those who have and those who do not, d.) when the west was conquered and there was nothing left but ocean, where do we go from there? There is obviously more to the list, but you get the point...

It's the equivalent of placing a 900 pound lion in a small room with a bunch of hens and expecting neither lion nor hen will notice.

And of course - what has become all too familiar - two events (Pearl Harbor and 9/11) helped remind us that we cannot quietly keep to ourselves in this world, that eventually (not if, but when, disaster will strike at the hands of sworn enemies, even if we didn't have the capacity to foresee them as such before it was too late.

So our mission is plain and simple - it is both domestic and abroad, like it or not. The only alternative to not playing our part on the world stage is by discontinuing the nation of America as we know it. And I cannot turn this over to my children, or their children anymore than I would expect anyone else to.

Joe, I think you have failed to notice that I am not preaching pro-Bush, pro-Right wing rhetoric here - this is the down to the nitty-gritty guts, bones and flesh that makes America what it is: Red or Blue, black or white, male or female, light skinned, dark skinned, green skinned, short and fat, tall and slender, blonde or brunette, Democrat or Republican. It is time we as a nation come together for once, throw away our party affiliations and concentrate on the reality of our existence on this planet in 2008 and beyond...
 
Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
It might seem odd to you Joe, but I haven't read any newspaper articles, seen any newscasts or otherwise come across any indication that Islamic persons have been subject to physical violence or threats in the United States. Surely Ted Turner would have any such incident figured prominently in all his various media outlets to highlight such a situation. Perhaps you could link me up a credible news story that refers to such an incident.
Don't hold your breath for that one... ;)
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
It might seem odd to you Joe, but I haven't read any newspaper articles, seen any newscasts or otherwise come across any indication that Islamic persons have been subject to physical violence or threats in the United States. Surely Ted Turner would have any such incident figured prominently in all his various media outlets to highlight such a situation. Perhaps you could link me up a credible news story that refers to such an incident.
It is not through news stories that I hear about these incidents, but through word of mouth. Usually from rednecks who think it is funny.:(
Also, more than actual violence is involved. It is common for me to hear people muttering "g*dd@mned raghead", even when the target of their bigotry is a fellow employee.
Perhaps it is worse where I live than in the rest of the country. If so, that is good news.
 
Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
It is not through news stories that I hear about these incidents, but through word of mouth. Usually from rednecks who think it is funny.:(
Also, more than actual violence is involved. It is common for me to hear people muttering "g*dd@mned raghead", even when the target of their bigotry is a fellow employee.
Perhaps it is worse where I live than in the rest of the country. If so, that is good news.
Yeah, I think you have a very narrow perspective on things Joe - you're referring to the common Bubba, who is still so backwards in his thinking that he believes it should be legal to beat their wives and hang black people from trees. Why don't you try a little harder, please... Those kinds of idiots are around, and they will always be bigoted, but their credibility (or lack thereof) speaks for itself.
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
Joe, I think you have failed to notice that I am not preaching pro-Bush, pro-Right wing rhetoric here - this is the down to the nitty-gritty guts, bones and flesh that makes America what it is: Red or Blue, black or white, male or female, light skinned, dark skinned, green skinned, short and fat, tall and slender, blonde or brunette, Democrat or Republican. It is time we as a nation come together for once, throw away our party affiliations and concentrate on the reality of our existence on this planet in 2008 and beyond...
That kind of unity would be great, but it isn't going to happen during an inherently divisive war, or with a president that half of us despise (either half.)
 
stratman

stratman

Audioholic Ninja
I might be wrong, but it seems that generations ago kids were different, people were different, yes I know that everyone says we look back with rose colored glasses, BUT and it's a big Oprah sized BUT, civics have changed in this country, start at smallest denominator: kindergarten, we were required to say our pledge of allegiance to the flag every morning, we had roughly 30 seconds of silence, we addressed our teachers as Mr. or Mrs., man that was basic civil courtesy. You say today Pledge of ALLEGIANCE and kids stare at you with blank eyes! There's no ALLEGIANCE, that's been taken out of public school, 30 seconds of silence and good heavens forbid a silent prayer?!!!! I'm more than convinced kids are slowly being conditioned to accept a PC, non-patriotic, pragmatic view of the US. Patriotic fervor is downplayed as insensitive to other cultures. What we fought for, One Country, ALL AMERICANS, has been twisted out of context. I can't believe I'm going to say this, one of the most surprising things I heard came from the mouth of Whoopi Goldberg: "I'm' not an African American, I'm a black American." Today people are labeled Italian-Americans, Irish-Americans and so forth, this flies in the face of what this country stands for, first and foremost we are Americans, then we can discuss our familial roots, but never forget to put this country's interests first, this is our home and there's nothing worse than a person disrespecting and bad-mouthing his home. The 60's hippies who now run Hollywood and "grace" the halls of Washington, demonstrate what happens to a generation bent on hedonistic destruction, they lack a moral compass, have no sense of duty or patriotism, yet point this out and they quickly and fiercely point out how patriotic they really are and how some of their ancestors fought in some war, I guess that's to atone for their misguidance.
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
Patriotism means wanting what is best for the country. That is why opposing the war is patriotic.
Resistance to the pledge centers around the line "under god". Take that out, and nobody will have a valid reason to object to it.
 
Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
That kind of unity would be great, but it isn't going to happen during an inherently divisive war, or with a president that half of us despise (either half.)
Well, as I said before - Bush is on his way out, so all you have to tolerate is another 7.5 months. Point being is that Bush is not the focal point of this discussion. What I'm talking about transcends Presidential terms and revolves around a common sense of decency, pride and patriotism that makes this country what it is. You take away these elements and we fall like a house of cards, no matter who is currently sitting in the Oval Office. The war in divisive only because the majority of the public has been led astray by liberal anti-American sentiment. There is a tremendous force working within our system/culture that is bent on our self-destruction and it's easy enough for me to see how easily the leftist liberal masses are buying right into it, and also how flimsy the Right wing methods have become in formulating a protocol to respond. Hopeless? Certainly seems so, at least until more people start waking up to reality in this country.

So go ahead Joe - take another sip of the Kool-Aid.
 
Halon451

Halon451

Audioholic Samurai
Patriotism means wanting what is best for the country. That is why opposing the war is patriotic.
Resistance to the pledge centers around the line "under god". Take that out, and nobody will have a valid reason to object to it.
Who is so upset over this?? I mean that rhetorically - this is part of the problem, everyone has to get so freaking out of whack over tiny little PC issues like this, when it doesn't even matter. I am not a religious person myself, but if I recite the Pledge of Allegiance I speak the line "under god" with no hesitation, because that is simply part of the Pledge that has come to be in this nation. I have absolutely no qualms about it.

People are so da**ed sensitive these days, and cry and whine and piss and moan over every little tiny detail that comes along that they don't agree with. Well, a little news flash for you - a Utopian existence where every single man and woman is 100% satisfied with 100% of every detail is never going to happen. So you do what's best for the majority, you try and find compromise where you can, you keep the nation focused on the major issues at hand, and it's up to the people themselves to understand the dynamic of the situation and respect the parts they don't agree with, especially if it's trivial. A society where every man and woman has his/her way is not a society - that is called anarchy.
 

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