2010 Audioholics $1k Floorstanding Loudspeaker Faceoff

[callas01]

Do your shootouts only include US based speakers?

For instance would there be a Focal, Dynaudio, Totem and Dali shoot out? Or Energy, PSB, Paradigm, Monitor Audio and B&W?

 

[haraldo]

I purposely limited the shootout to 4 brands to make it manageable. We don't really have a solid contact at Polk. Definitive Technology's marketing director made it clear he would never send us product for review, especially for a faceoff such as this.

Next time we will include all different brands and will try to get in Polk. We did have Polk included in our 2007 Bookshelf faceoff.

Have you ever looked into Danish brand "System Audio"? Are they available in US too?
To me they are sensational speakers providing very high value at $1k and upwards

But possibly, shipping and other charges make them less viable in US, anyways, these speakers are well worth a listen

http://www.systemaudio.dk/_en-GB

 

[cornelius]

Thanks Gene, for putting on the $1K speaker review. I know it's hard to do, but I hope you do more of them.

Sholling brings up some interesting points, which is why I've had problems with professional reviews. I used read a great review, then hear the product and get very confused. You really have to read between the lines.

I'd be interested to hear the real reasons why certain speaker designers don't want their speakers included in this type of test. Some might feel that these reviews are not being conducted properly, some might be used to the cushion of a pro review...

When I was first getting into more serious gear, I found the publications overseas would often pan something that was reviewed favorably in the US. I've read that some of the British magazines, who use a panel of reviewers, use blindfold reviews.

 

[Seth=L]

Definitive Technology's marketing director made it clear he would never send us product for review, especially for a faceoff such as this.

That's odd, I would think they would have done well in this price bracket.

 

[haraldo]

Finally got the time to read the whole speaker shootout today and found it very interesting and valuable.

Thanks Gene for an excellent piece of work, very interesting and as always, competent and thorough when it comes from your hands

 

[AJinFLA]

I've read that some of the British magazines, who use a panel of reviewers, use blindfold reviews.

I've read similar rumors on many audiophile websites about Brit Mags, but as usual, par for the course, without evidence.
We can eliminate Hi-Fi Plus, as the Editor, Alan Sircom admits here it was all a sham, to give the believers the false hope that there was some scientific validity to their faith based choices.
True, statistically valid controlled perceptual testing is a complex undertaking and has no place in magazines for those with audiophile disorder, as nulls will be rejected in lieu of false positives.

cheers,

AJ

p.s. you don't actually wear a "blindfold" for "blind" testing .
...though I suppose you could...

 

[cornelius]

Actually for the $1K shootout, blindfolds would have been a good idea, instead of the lossy grille...

 

[gene]

RE: EMP Woofer Upgrade

I'm getting a lot of PM's about the EMP woofer upgrade so I called EMP directly to get the scoop.

The new woofers will lower the resonance frequency of the driver to help provide a bit more bottom end but there is a trade off in how punchy or snappy the midbass will be as a result. Thus if you're planning on using a sub with the system then you shouldn't be too concerned about the slightly modded woofers.

 

[gene]

Do your shootouts only include US based speakers?

For instance would there be a Focal, Dynaudio, Totem and Dali shoot out? Or Energy, PSB, Paradigm, Monitor Audio and B&W?

No we have included B&W, and Dali in prior faceoffs.

 

[PENG]

I purposely limited the shootout to 4 brands to make it manageable. We don't really have a solid contact at Polk. Definitive Technology's marketing director made it clear he would never send us product for review, especially for a faceoff such as this.

Next time we will include all different brands and will try to get in Polk. We did have Polk included in our 2007 Bookshelf faceoff.

Would you even consider conducting similar tests on receivers and amps? If you won't, I understand as I trust you guys are professionals so the truth may (or may not) hurt your sales of amps/receivers.

 

[PENG]

If all goes well, I will be able to do some blind listening at Axiom this September. I'm really looking forward to the experience.

While you are there, any chance you can do the same with different amps but same speakers. I mean they must have the set up to do such things without too much trouble.

 

[gene]

Would you even consider conducting similar tests on receivers and amps? If you won't, I understand as I trust you guys are professionals so the truth may (or may not) hurt your sales of amps/receivers.

Its too difficult to do those type of comparison tests in this fashion. Its more practical to bench test the receivers and compare features.

 

[PENG]

Its too difficult to do those type of comparison tests in this fashion. Its more practical to bench test the receivers and compare features.

I thought it wouldn't be too difficult if the goal is to see if in fact ordinary people can hear those often claimed "huge/day and night" difference between mid range receivers and amps when they cannot use their eyes. Again, I understand for a variety of reasons it can't be done but let's see more bench tests that allow us to compare apple to apple. Thank you in advance.

 

[Nuance AH]

Thank you Audioholics mods for taking the time to perform this shootout. Well done!

 

[tsteves]

Thanks Gene, you and Audioholics, always do excellent work using blind and then sighted reviews of this sort which makes for very interesting reading!

Of course I always complain about the speakers reviewed, so why stop now, eh? I know you guys are at the mercy of manufacturers to "man up" and actually send you something for a shootout, and chickens that they are, a lot of the good ones don't. They are idiots in that regard, I'd say, since you guys really do try to be honest and "un-fluffy" like the major rags. There are tons of manufacturers who are very well thought of as "bang for the buck" manufacturers. I mean Paradigm, Magnepan, Monitor Audio, even B&W has competitive models if you are interested in general sound quality rather than full range response.
What bothers me is that Klipsh won?! (no disrespect to the "real" klipsch speakers). No, I have not done a blind test of a Klipsch model like this, but I have listened to lots of speakers, Klipsch included. I'd much rather have a non full range Paradigm reference series (or other brands) at $1K over this lot. Just sayin'.

 

[3db]

Good write up to the test. Very imformative and I see teh work involved in these tests. I did not read thru this thread yet as I post my opinion. I'm a little perplexed at the conclusions reached during teh sited tests. If the cloth does acoustically alter the sound of the tests in such a dramattic fasion as you suggested (as a possibility), then this whole test was in vain. I think that maybe blindfoding your listeners maybe the best approach as awkward as that maybe. The other thing you can't get around is personal prejudism during sited listening which I suspect played the biggest role in changing up the order compared to that of the non sighted tests. Also, It was interesting to read the differences between trained and casual listeners. Good job guys!!.

 

[tn001d]

No paradigm? = no real contest

 

[fredk]

While you are there, any chance you can do the same with different amps but same speakers. I mean they must have the set up to do such things without too much trouble.

Pretty much what Gene wrote.

Also, the blind testing has been done and it was shown that you can't hear the difference. Alan Loft of Axiom was there for the tests.

 

[PENG]

Pretty much what Gene wrote.

Also, the blind testing has been done and it was shown that you can't hear the difference. Alan Loft of Axiom was there for the tests.

Thank you Fred, I didn't know Mr. Loft had been in such tests.

 

[mtrycrafts]

....
I just spent the last 3 days at Axiom undergoing their blind tests which they did a fabulous job setting up. The grille cloth they use is much less lossy even when not taut. I will be using this in my next round. I also love how they provide the user the ability to switch between speakers and adjust listening level to their preference which affects all speakers under test proportionally so the levels are always matched. This is a huge advantage and I will be incorporating this type of testing scheme next time around.

Is Axiom set up to rotate the speakers into position, or are they side by side as yours were? That may be noticeable too that the speakers have changed positions.