Electric Vehicles?

[Mikado463]

Does Anyone Even Want an Electric Car?

Deloitte’s new report forecasts a messy future.

finance.yahoo.com

 

[Trell]

Plug-in electric vehicles in Norway - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

>>>
The fleet of plug-in electric vehicles in Norway is the largest per capita in the world.[2][3][4] In December 2016, Norway became the first country where five in every 100 passenger cars on the road were plug-in;[5] attained 10% in October 2018,[6] and reached 22.1% in December 2021.[1]
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[pewternhrata]

As much as you may hate 'big oil' (to a certain degree I do as well) another point of interest will need to be played out......... infrastructure.

As less and less ICE vehicles inhabit the roads the revenue from fuel and the associated taxes derived to maintain roads and bridges will need to be addressed by the Fed and the States. Doing this without any Gov't boondoggle should be interesting !

Also to remember, current EV's weigh in most cases more than their ICE counterparts to which they compete and as such would account for more road/bridge repair.

Read something with the weight that got me thinking. On commercial use, semi trucks. Max load is 80k lbs, batteries currently would take up close to 10k lbs, now the trucks are hauling less cargo which in turn would cause those products to go up in price. So it's not even just the repair on roads that costs more, but efficiency of transportation will suffer too.

 

[Trell]

With diesel/gasoline much of the cost are externalized for others to suffer, like pollution.

Whether or not US companies can compete in making energy efficient vehicles remains to be seen.

 

[MaxInValrico]

Read something with the weight that got me thinking. On commercial use, semi trucks. Max load is 80k lbs, batteries currently would take up close to 10k lbs, now the trucks are hauling less cargo which in turn would cause those products to go up in price. So it's not even just the repair on roads that costs more, but efficiency of transportation will suffer too.

Have you considered/factored how much a Semi's drive train weighs?

 

[ryanosaur]

How Much Does a Semi Truck Weigh?

Here is a brief guide on how much a semi-truck weighs and the methods employed to determine these figures.

www.jdpower.com

Tesla says Tesla Semi electric truck's weight is on point, and that's crucial

Tesla made a rare comment about the Tesla Semi electric truck’s weight, which is going to be crucial to the...

electrek.co

A little interesting insight about weight of Semi Trucks...

 

[jhaider]

Ok, we got off track on the EV discussion. So to get back in that direction would the hybrid vehicle be the smart answer at this juncture ?

Hybrid was the smart answer a decade ago. Today, why mess with the extra complexity and storage loss?

We’ve been all in on modern cars for a about a year now. My wife ordered a Model 3 (long range RWD, a configuration no longer offered) the day of Musk’s keynote and it was delivered in the summer of 2018. I followed suit with a Model Y (7 seat long range AWD). I’m glad to drive an American car, something I never thought I’d be able to say - everything out of the other US automakers has been hot garbage for as long as I’ve been alive.

The only thing I don’t love about either car is the wide turning circle. We’ve done road trips in both cars, and the Supercharger network is great.

At this point in time I couldn’t imagine spending real money on a legacy-mobile. A beater to tide you over until the price gap between moderns and legacies comes down, maybe. But spending a lot on a legacy car is just getting a boat anchor that will depreciate like a surround processor without immersive. (I recently saw an Anthem D2v on sale for hundreds, not thousands, of dollars.)

We’re all in on Tesla but there are now others in the game. Mach-E may be the best Big Three thing ever. Hyundai/Kia just introduced some really nice ones. So far I’m less enamored of the German ones that aren’t Taycan or i3 (a near perfect urban commuter car), but they will be coming along. It’s worth looking around.

 

[Mikado463]

Hybrid was the smart answer a decade ago. Today, why mess with the extra complexity and storage loss?

We’ve been all in on modern cars for a about a year now. My wife ordered a Model 3 (long range RWD, a configuration no longer offered) the day of Musk’s keynote and it was delivered in the summer of 2018. I followed suit with a Model Y (7 seat long range AWD). I’m glad to drive an American car, something I never thought I’d be able to say - everything out of the other US automakers has been hot garbage for as long as I’ve been alive.

The only thing I don’t love about either car is the wide turning circle. We’ve done road trips in both cars, and the Supercharger network is great.

At this point in time I couldn’t imagine spending real money on a legacy-mobile. A beater to tide you over until the price gap between moderns and legacies comes down, maybe. But spending a lot on a legacy car is just getting a boat anchor that will depreciate like a surround processor without immersive. (I recently saw an Anthem D2v on sale for hundreds, not thousands, of dollars.)

We’re all in on Tesla but there are now others in the game. Mach-E may be the best Big Three thing ever. Hyundai/Kia just introduced some really nice ones. So far I’m less enamored of the German ones that aren’t Taycan or i3 (a near perfect urban commuter car), but they will be coming along. It’s worth looking around.

While I get your gist, I disagree on the hybrid thing ten years ago because ones choices were very limited, can you say fugly looking Prius ! Regardless, I'll probably be replacing my '17 X5 in a couple of years and for me I'm thinking one more ICE ........

 

[jhaider]

While I get your gist, I disagree on the hybrid thing ten years ago because ones choices were very limited, can you say fugly looking Prius !

Well…my previous car was a 2012 Lexus CT200h - basically a Prius mk 2 in more conventional hatchback format. Lexus also had an RX line hybrid at the time. Honda had a few as well.

 

[Mikado463]

Well…my previous car was a 2012 Lexus CT200h - basically a Prius mk 2 in more conventional hatchback format. Lexus also had an RX line hybrid at the time. Honda had a few as well.

Glad to see you owned a Lexus when they were much better looking !

 

[jhaider]

Glad to see you owned a Lexus when they were much better looking !

No joke! From ca. 2014 on they really started beating their cars hard with the ugly stick.

 

[highfigh]

Plug-in electric vehicles in Norway - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

>>>
The fleet of plug-in electric vehicles in Norway is the largest per capita in the world.[2][3][4] In December 2016, Norway became the first country where five in every 100 passenger cars on the road were plug-in;[5] attained 10% in October 2018,[6] and reached 22.1% in December 2021.[1]
<<<

Any indication of the average trip distance or daily total?

 

[Trell]

Any indication of the average trip distance or daily total?

No, I'm not aware of that. Most buying those vehicles lives in cities so I would think they are mostly used for shorter daily commute and errands.

 

[cpp]

No, I'm not aware of that. Most buying those vehicles lives in cities so I would think they are mostly used for shorter daily commute and errands.

What's interesting in Norway " Car buyers don’t have to pay taxes imposed on traditional internal combustion engine vehicles when they buy an EV. ". In 2021, the country’s federal government missed out on approximately $3.41 billion in tax revenue .

And on another note, Cold temperatures can reduce an unplugged EV’s range by about 20 percent, according to testing by the Norwegian Automobile Federation, and recharging takes longer than in warm weather. So I guess its the distance you plan to drive and the charge mileage your car has.

 

[Trell]

What's interesting in Norway " Car buyers don’t have to pay taxes imposed on traditional internal combustion engine vehicles when they buy an EV. ". In 2021, the country’s federal government missed out on approximately $3.41 billion in tax revenue .

Cars are heavily taxed in Norway.

And on another note, Cold temperatures can reduce an unplugged EV’s range by about 20 percent, according to testing by the Norwegian Automobile Federation, and recharging takes longer than in warm weather. So I guess its the distance you plan to drive and the charge mileage your car has.

Absolutely, there are many places on Norway I would not drive an EV winter time, if only for safety reasons.

 

[cpp]

if only for safety reasons.

Agree, the same thing in the states, but not about the cold but safety in the event of a breakdown. When we had our model S , we would stay on the main roads, just in case of breakdowns as the tow is really a load up on the back of a truck BED and then its the mileage to your nearest Tesla dealer which can be a LONG LONG tow in some states and cost $$$$. .

 

[Mikado463]

No joke! From ca. 2014 on they really started beating their cars hard with the ugly stick.

It's just that front grill that gets to me, the rest of the vehicle I like.

 

[cpp]

It's just that front grill that gets to me, the rest of the vehicle I like.


Some of the telsa models remind me of the old Corvair front end.

 

[Mikado463]

another EV perspective .......

Putting the brakes on EV folly - CFACT

End electric vehicle mandates!

www.cfact.org

 

[jhaider]

another EV perspective .......

Putting the brakes on EV folly - CFACT

End electric vehicle mandates!

www.cfact.org

Looks like an astroturf corporate shill vehicle.

Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT)

Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT) Background The Washington-DC-based Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT) is a tax-exempt 501(c)(3) organization founded in 1985 by David Rothbard and Craig Rucker to pursue a free-market approach to environmental issues. CFACT describes their...

www.desmog.com