I Am a Ukrainian

[defmoot]

Some elderly ladies bought some RPGs or missiles at the local grocery store, I assume,” he posted on Twitter.

After the fall of the Soviet Union my father was traveling by car through Poland on a business trip. He and his associate/fixer came across a roadside stand with several large wooden tables stacked with goods for sale. Intrigued, they stopped to browse and found all manner of small arms, ammunition, and explosives at what were considered very good prices. Hand grenades as well.

 

[Ponzio]

After the fall of the Soviet Union my father was traveling by car through Poland on a business trip. He and his associate/fixer came across a roadside stand with several large wooden tables stacked with goods for sale. Intrigued, they stopped to browse and found all manner of small arms, ammunition, and explosives at what were considered very good prices. Hand grenades as well.

Must have been the annual Polish NRA ladies local auxiliary chapter gun swap & bake sale.

 

[Chu Gai]

No pierogis?

 

[Ponzio]

No pierogis?

Sorry, pierogi's are only served at the monthly pot luck social dinner; best served hot.

 

[defmoot]

No pierogis?

Sorry, pierogi's are only served at the monthly pot luck social dinner; best served hot.

Had 'em tonight as a matter fact. With garlicky kielbasa, flash cooked onion, and stir-fried cabbage with a touch of caraway seed.

Hopefully the good people in Ukraine had something decent to eat tonight, too.

 

[Ponzio]

Here's some good news.
Ukraine army regains control of Slavyansk | World news | theguardian.com

Putin got what he wanted [Crimea] and now it looks like he's gonna bail on his "comrades" in the east.
What a guy!

You have to give him credit though. He saw the riots in Kiev as an opportunity to grab back what was historically Russian and bolster his flagging popularity at home at that time, with minimal loses and a rallying card, if needed, in the future.

 

[rnatalli]

Yup, all he was ever interested in was the naval base in Crimea and a distraction back home. Took what he wanted, put on a show, and will now back off. One thing's for sure, he'll be back for something else likely outside of Ukraine in a few years or so.

 

[Ponzio]

One thing's for sure, he'll be back for something else likely outside of Ukraine in a few years or so.

Can you say Estonia-Latvia-Lithuania, followed by the Stan's (Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgystan)?

Long standing Russian paranoia of their north-western frontier, finely tuned after the Swedish invasion in the early 1700's by Charles XII and Hitler's use of those areas as staging grounds for Operation Barbarossa, during WWII, combined with the Russian navies limited access to fresh water ports, would point to Estonia, Latvia & Lithuania. And like the eastern section of Ukraine, they also have sizable Russian minorities that can be used for propaganda purposes to justify Russian aggressiveness. For now the Stan's are safe, based on the current Islamic insurgency in Chechnya and the sour taste it's left in their mouth trying to stamp it out. Plus they pose no threat tactically on their southern border.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Can you say Estonia-Latvia-Lithuania, followed by the Stan's (Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgystan)?

Long standing Russian paranoia of their north-western frontier, finely tuned after the Swedish invasion in the early 1700's by Charles XII and Hitler's use of those areas as staging grounds for Operation Barbarossa, during WWII, combined with the Russian navies limited access to fresh water ports, would point to Estonia, Latvia & Lithuania. And like the eastern section of Ukraine, they also have sizable Russian minorities that can be used for propaganda purposes to justify Russian aggressiveness. For now the Stan's are safe, based on the current Islamic insurgency in Chechnya and the sour taste it's left in their mouth trying to stamp it out. Plus they pose no threat tactically on their southern border.

The complicating factor there is their NATO membership.

 

[Ponzio]

The complicating factor there is their NATO membership.

Wiki excerpt: "Article Five of the treaty states that if an armed attack occurs against one of the member states, it should be considered an attack against all members, and other members shall assist the attacked member, with armed forces if necessary."

If? If? ... how could it not be necessary?

But article 5 has never been tested ... US membership is a factor ... no NATO country has been invaded so this all conjecture, treaty or not. Many nations, including the US, have broken treaties at will. Putin is getting grief from the oligarchs but he has tested the boundaries with NATO and gained Crimea and the bluffs overlooking Georgia. The next Russian leader or Putin just dissolves/bends the Russian parliament and rules by fiat, will continue to apply pressure in Ukraine-Estonia-Latvia-Lithuania with their Russian minorities. He's found his raison d'etre and he's going to ride that pony for all it's worth until someone stops him.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Wiki excerpt: "Article Five of the treaty states that if an armed attack occurs against one of the member states, it should be considered an attack against all members, and other members shall assist the attacked member, with armed forces if necessary."

If? If? ... how could it not be necessary?

But article 5 has never been tested ... US membership is a factor ... no NATO country has been invaded so this all conjecture, treaty or not. Many nations, including the US, have broken treaties at will. Putin is getting grief from the oligarchs but he has tested the boundaries with NATO and gained Crimea and the bluffs overlooking Georgia. The next Russian leader or Putin just dissolves/bends the Russian parliament and rules by fiat, will continue to apply pressure in Ukraine-Estonia-Latvia-Lithuania with their Russian minorities. He's found his raison d'etre and he's going to ride that pony for all it's worth until someone stops him.

Yeah, the response - or lack thereof - to Russia's actions in Ukraine has made the Baltic NATO members more than a little concerned. I would like to think that support for them by other NATO members will be more forthcoming. Otherwise, our credibility will be completely shot. If it wasn't for the Iraq/Afghanistan fiasco - and the resultant war weariness - there might have been a greater appetite for a more vigorous support for Ukraine.

 

[Swerd]

And now, those knuckleheads shot a civilian airliner down.

Malaysia Airlines Flight 17: Official says plane shot down over Ukraine

Malaysia Airlines Flight 17: Official says plane shot down over Ukraine - CBS News

(Edit: In case anyone is confused by the term knuckleheads, I mean the armed Russian Separatists in eastern Ukraine, and the damned fools who support them.)

 

[jinjuku]

I'm at a loss for words at the amount of total violence that needs to be visited upon the organization that did something that heinous.

 

[markw]

I just heard that there were 23 Americans on board that aircraft. So, the plot thickens...

But, hey, does anybody really expect anything from our government anymore?

 

[Ponzio]

But, hey, does anybody really expect anything from our government anymore?

Are you saying that "our" government could have prevented this? How? You're ready or were ready to put ground troops in the Ukraine before this incident? I haven't exactly seen this nation clamoring for a military response. I've said it before and I'll say it again, until Europe, specifically Germany, France, England and strategically Poland decide to take the lead on this, we should continue what we've been doing. We have enough irons in the fire as it is. It may sound harsh and for those trying to score political zingers, cowardly but the sad truth is that another war for this nation is counter-productive at this time. If Europe leads, trust me, we will be right behind them. This is not our fight.

Rant over.

 

[Ponzio]

He is truly a snake.

excerpt from the Guardian's blog on the incident:

Russian President Vladimir Putin has blamed Kiev for the crash, saying: "Undoubtedly, the government in whose air space this happened bears responsibility for this terrible tragedy," according to a Kremlin statement (Russian).

He also said "this tragedy would not have happened if there were peace in this land, or in any case, if [Kiev] had not renewed hostilities in south-eastern Ukraine."

He said that he has given "instructions to the military so that they have all the necessary help in the investigation of this crime", and that he's requested the government's civilian agencies to assist as best in can in the investigation. He added that "no one has the right" to make conclusions without comprehensive, "objective information about the incident".

Putin also reiterated his condolences for victims' families, and observed a moment of silence.

 

[markw]

No, he couldn't have prevented it. I don't even think the perps gave any thought to any Americans being on board.

What I'm saying is that whatever our leader promises to do, nobody will take him seriously. He didn't do anything when our ambassadors were attacked in Benghazi when he had inklings of trouble days and weeks ahead of time, and he still hasn't. All he did was stand behind the lie that it was a spontaneous reaction to some stupid video when everyone knew better than that.

We have no credibility with anyone anymore, and that's a da*n shame..

 

[Swerd]

No, he couldn't have prevented it. I don't even think the perps gave any thought to any Americans being on board.

What I'm saying is that whatever our leader promises to do, nobody will take him seriously. He didn't do anything when our ambassadors were attacked in Benghazi when he had inklings of trouble days and weeks ahead of time, and he still hasn't. All he did was stand behind the lie that it was a spontaneous reaction to some stupid video when everyone knew better than that.

We have no credibility with anyone anymore, and that's a da*n shame..

Cut it out Mark. Trying to tie this to the republican party message of the day makes about as much sense as Putin does when he said Kiev "bears responsibility" for the crash.

 

[markw]

I'm not trying to tie this to anything. I'm just stating what's obvious to the whole world. OK, I'm outta here if that's all right with everyone.

 

[markw]

OK, this isn't political.

but this does show to level to which our news reporting has sunk. ...but it's fully as all getout.

I guess they take anybody at their word and don't vet their sources anymore. Walter Cronkite, we miss you dearly.