Exploring Subs for Theater post-2020 in the $2k range

[jinjuku]

I keep coming back to HSU VTF-3 Mark 5's

Easily a good choice.

 

[ryanosaur]

So is this just a typical slotted port design or something different? The air path almost has a sorta TL look, but with only 1 bend.

Just a ported sub... not a TL.

 

[MalVeauX]

I'm not sure what size the room will end up being. The plan is converting a 2 car garage at build time into a finished great room and that will be the media room that this will go into. A typical 2 car garage is commonly around 22~24 feet x 17~22 feet give or take. I will take the largest I can get as this will be a shared space for the family and it will be for theater, music, gaming. So not a huge room, but not tiny either. Since it's a finished space with a single door access, it's not an "open plan" like most living rooms, which is good. I think two VTF-3 Mark 5's will handle this space, maybe not with absolute authority, but it would probably work well. I know two Mini-Martys would be overkill for the space with a lot of headroom. We do not listen super loud for music or games, but for movies, we do run it a little hotter usually.

So considering a room space like that, do you all think two VTF-3 Mark 5's could handle a standard height room that is 22~24 feet x 17~22 feet approximately?

Very best,

 

[shadyJ]

I'm not sure what size the room will end up being. The plan is converting a 2 car garage at build time into a finished great room and that will be the media room that this will go into. A typical 2 car garage is commonly around 22~24 feet x 17~22 feet give or take. I will take the largest I can get as this will be a shared space for the family and it will be for theater, music, gaming. So not a huge room, but not tiny either. Since it's a finished space with a single door access, it's not an "open plan" like most living rooms, which is good. I think two VTF-3 Mark 5's will handle this space, maybe not with absolute authority, but it would probably work well. I know two Mini-Martys would be overkill for the space with a lot of headroom. We do not listen super loud for music or games, but for movies, we do run it a little hotter usually.

So considering a room space like that, do you all think two VTF-3 Mark 5's could handle a standard height room that is 22~24 feet x 17~22 feet approximately?

Very best,

Two VTF-3 mk5s will rock that place.

 

[MalVeauX]

Two VTF-3 mk5s will rock that place.

I'll probably start there then. I have a toddler in the house, so it's rare to be able to really push it up loud right now anyways for a while and with COVID, they're always, always, home.

Very best,

 

[jinjuku]

So considering a room space like that, do you all think two VTF-3 Mark 5's could handle a standard height room that is 22~24 feet x 17~22 feet approximately?

You should be very happy given those dimensions. My 17X23X9.5 foot room rumbles with my setup. Audyssey has the trim set back by -6dB to hit the target response curve.

 

[MalVeauX]

You should be very happy given those dimensions. My 17X23X9.5 foot room rumbles with my setup. Audyssey has the trim set back by -6dB to hit the target response curve in my room.

Thanks, so plenty of headroom! Great!

Very best,

 

[Kleinst]

I'll probably start there then. I have a toddler in the house, so it's rare to be able to really push it up loud right now anyways for a while and with COVID, they're always, always, home.

Very best,

That's what I don't know. Shady you have said before that if you aren't pushing your subs to the max you won't notice too much of an improvement upgrading. I would love to head what a $3-$4K JTR or PSA sub would sound like compared to my setup PRIOR to spending $3K-$4K

I'm just not sure for normal listening I'd even leverage such a purchase.

I have a strange setup in my main room with Dual Stacked Klipsch 115SWs behind the TV. Then nearfield Martin Logan 1500x and 1000x in separate spots across the room. All dialed in as best I could with mini dsp HD. Not sure upgrading the stacked klipsch would make that big a difference as I have a lot of room to turn up the bass. Who knows. Still want to find someone throwing away some PSA double deckers for cheap. haven't seen em here for a while.

Point is that I bet those HSU's would do you great especially if you arean't maxing them out.

 

[shadyJ]

That's what I don't know. Shady you have said before that if you aren't pushing your subs to the max you won't notice too much of an improvement upgrading. I would love to head what a $3-$4K JTR or PSA sub would sound like compared to my setup PRIOR to spending $3K-$4K

Those subs would have deeper bass extension and maybe a bit more headroom, but a single sub would have a worse frequency response. It would be a downgrade overall. The single most important thing is a smooth frequency response. That should be the first aim for any sub setup. After that is met, everything else is gravy, but listening tests have shown that the most important criterion for sound quality in bass frequencies is a smooth response, and you don't need super-subs to achieve that.

 

[i_max]

Just a heads up Hobie (director for the Monolith line at monoprice) announced that they will do amp swaps now in addition to replacement’s if anyone prefers that.

Edit: Fixed autocorrect stuff.

 

[Kleinst]

Those Marty Sub boxes are really interesting looking. If they made a double 18 inch box similar to the larger Monolith (M-215) or some of the PSA subs it would be interesting., Wonder what one of those could be made for compared to the $2K to $3K offerings and how they would sound compared to those (with external amp of course). Anyone heard the 18" Dayton in one of these?

I'm pretty sure I would screw it up somehow.

 

[shadyJ]

Those Marty Sub boxes are really interesting looking. If they made a double 18 inch box similar to the larger Monolith (M-215) or some of the PSA subs it would be interesting., Wonder what one of those could be made for compared to the $2K to $3K offerings and how they would sound compared to those (with external amp of course). Anyone heard the 18" Dayton in one of these?

I'm pretty sure I would screw it up somehow.

I have heard a few Martyboxes, including one with the UM18. It's a fine sub. You need a lot of power to get the most out of it. I definitely wouldn't be interested in doubling the size of one. There would be hardly any way to move such an enclosure. I would be more interested in a multiple smaller sub system that is tuned to a low frequency.

 

[ryanosaur]

Those Marty Sub boxes are really interesting looking. If they made a double 18 inch box similar to the larger Monolith (M-215) or some of the PSA subs it would be interesting., Wonder what one of those could be made for compared to the $2K to $3K offerings and how they would sound compared to those (with external amp of course). Anyone heard the 18" Dayton in one of these?

I'm pretty sure I would screw it up somehow.

If you have the tools available to you (Clamps (Lots and Lots of Bar and Pipe clamps), Table Saw, Rotary Saw, Plunge Router) and all you have to do is buy MDF or Baltic Birch... The Driver and Amp, its not that big of a deal.

UM18 $340
NX3000 $260 -OR- NX3000D $350
MDF .75" x 4'x8' ~$40 per sheet -OR- Baltic Birch Plywood .75" x 5'x5' ~$70 per sheet
Adhesive and Finishing $-varies.

Devastators are supposed to be doable on 2 sheets of MDF, 3 sheets of Baltic Birch. Cabinet sizes are not that different for a Full Marty.
You DO NOT want to build a dual 18" in a Full Marty. Basically, double the weight and cabinet size. Rather build two cabinets or more and spread them around. Same with Devs. Red Five is the OP for the Dev Index at that other site, was working on a Dual 21" Dev: I do not recall seeing that it ever came to fruition... It was BBIIGG!

Regarding weight: from MDF, these cabinets are in the neighborhood of 150-180#. Without the Driver.
MDF weighs about 1# per square foot more than Baltic Birch. (Roughly 3.5# to 2.5# per sq.ft.)

 

[Kingnoob]

I've read of people having to return the entire sub rather than swap out an amp with Monolith/Monoprice. Seems they don't have any service options in their US facility from what I've read (or know if they're working with someone particularly....haven't seen mention of that at least).

As to finishing the mdf on the Marty I think you can do a fairly nice duratex in basic black finish easily enough....I did on a couple of mine (I just stained the ply on the others, haven't actually built with mdf) and just read up on how to thin/brush technique and did it. I've got no WAF to deal with and rarely sell any gear, so diy works well for me.

Shipping probably costs a ton on those flat packs. Mini Marty seemed interested for smaller rooms .
that monolith or full Marty I could not even move due to back issues .
I’d be happy if I ever get money for hsu 15” duels .I may not even go over output of sealed uls.
I wanted 18” ultimax but $200 for a sealed flat pack or $500 for mini Marty seems like more cash then possibly . Plus driver shot up to $339 no sales barely save anything on kit .

 

[panteragstk]

I have heard a few Martyboxes, including one with the UM18. It's a fine sub. You need a lot of power to get the most out of it. I definitely wouldn't be interested in doubling the size of one. There would be hardly any way to move such an enclosure. I would be more interested in a multiple smaller sub system that is tuned to a low frequency.

Got any examples of some DIY stuff that fits the bill? I've got 4 small subs in each corner, but tuned low they are not. I've been thinking the marty route for a bit, but am open to other suggestions.

 

[shadyJ]

Got any examples of some DIY stuff that fits the bill? I've got 4 small subs in each corner, but tuned low they are not. I've been thinking the marty route for a bit, but am open to other suggestions.

You could just use sealed subs using drivers that have a low Fs. Or maybe sonotube subs tuned to a low frequency like 16Hz.

 

[Pogre]

You could just use sealed subs using drivers that have a low Fs. Or maybe sonotube subs tuned to a low frequency like 16Hz.

Are cylindrical subs inherently a better design than a cube? Intuitively it seems like they would be.

 

[shadyJ]

Are cylindrical subs inherently a better design than a cube? Intuitively it seems like they would be.

They are better in that the sidewall are very stiff yet they are lighter subs. It also makes a long port very easy to install, no bends needed. It's a more elegant solution, but it doesn't really offer better performance per litre, only the same performance.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Are cylindrical subs inherently a better design than a cube? Intuitively it seems like they would be.

Yeah what shady said.
Maaaaybe, you need an LLT sonosub project... mwahahahahaha
Don’t, I mean DONT google search it. Just don’t....lol

 

[panteragstk]

Yeah what shady said.
Maaaaybe, you need an LLT sonosub project... mwahahahahaha
Don’t, I mean DONT google search it. Just don’t....lol

He can live vicariously through me on this one. Feel free to save me some google time and throw out a link or two.

You could just use sealed subs using drivers that have a low Fs. Or maybe sonotube subs tuned to a low frequency like 16Hz.

So, new driver, new box. Should be easy enough. Too bad they don' t make those crazy low Fs in a 12" driver. I could just do a swap and be done with it. LMS or whoever used to was my plan at one point.

Why does noone ever talk about IB (infinite baffle) subs here? That go out of style?