2nd Impeachment of Trump

[lp85253]

You wrote "They [the military] can refuse orders if POTUS is considered incompetent", which is why I asked as that would seem very strange.

Not strange , it's a built in check in the system...nobody in the military is bound to execute orders from a madman...

 

[Trell]

Not strange , it's a built in check in the system...nobody in the military is bound to execute orders from a madman...

If the military can (legally) refuse an order because they think POTUS is incompetent there would not be any civilian control of the military, in practice.

 

[lp85253]

If the military can (legally) refuse an order because they think POTUS is incompetent there would not be any civilian control of the military, in practice.

Not true , you are thinking in absolutes... Trumps inanity is well documented, nuance is the key here.. Under normal circumstance the military is under civilian control.. Pence may actually be in charge now...

 

[lovinthehd]

Plenty of insanity and/or stupidity to go around

 

[Trell]

Not true , you are thinking in absolutes... Trumps inanity is well documented, nuance is the key here.. Under normal circumstance the military is under civilian control.. Pence may actually be in charge now...

Huh? The military is required to follow lawful orders, and if they don't there will be consequences for insubordination. This is part of what civilian control means.

 

[Paul DS]

Exposure and lies , backed up by "news" networks expounding the same lies.. No talent needed...

I think you are very, very wrong. The man is as dangerous as Hitler.

 

[lp85253]

Huh? The military is required to follow lawful orders, and if they don't there will be consequences for insubordination. This is part of what civilian control means.

What's so hard to understand? Lawful orders, is the key... He's insane.. Therefore unfit , therefore any order he gives can be viewed as unlawful...

 

[lp85253]

I think you are very, very wrong. The man is as dangerous as Hitler.

I didn't say he wasn't, hitler was a loser too, witness the invasion of Russia.. He turned his strongest ally into his worst nightmare....

 

[Hetfield]

What's so hard to understand? Lawful orders, is the key... He's insane.. Therefore unfit , therefore any order he gives can be viewed as unlawful...Edit : Hitler made 2 huge errors.. He declared war on the US and turned on Russia.. Both very foolish moves driven by ego...Trump's about as dumb

What if he says nuke california? I mean is anymore going to follow that order? Or Nuke Canada. Anyone going to follow that order?

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[highfigh]

You wrote "They [the military] can refuse orders if POTUS is considered incompetent", which is why I asked as that would seem very strange.

I don't mean that someone would say "I'm not doing it because he's incompetent, IMO", I mean in the sense that since just about everyone thinks the butter has slipped off of his noodles, a wild move on his part wouldn't be followed because there's no reason for it and it's not a response to some kind of attack.

 

[Paul DS]

What's so hard to understand? Lawful orders, is the key... He's insane.. Therefore unfit , therefore any order he gives can be viewed as unlawful...Edit : Hitler made 2 huge errors.. He declared war on the US and turned on Russia.. Both very foolish moves driven by ego...Trump's about as dumb

Hitler didn't declare war on the U.S. by choice. He was allied with Japan. When they bombed Pearl Harbor, Hitler was forced into a war he didn't want. He also never wanted a war with Britain. Hitler was one of the most brilliant strategists on the planet. If he had made a few different choices back then, we might be speaking German. I consider Trump to be a very dangerous man. He can wield enough people in this country to start a Civil War.

 

[lp85253]

Hitler didn't declare war on the U.S. by choice. He was allied with Japan. When they bombed Pearl Harbor, Hitler was forced into a war he didn't want. He also never wanted a war with Britain. Hitler was one of the most brilliant strategists on the planet. If he had made a few different choices back then, we might be speaking German. I consider Trump to be a very dangerous man. He can wield enough people in this country to start a Civil War.

That's certainly an opinion i don't agree with ... To declare war on the US he honored a treaty.. To declare war on Russia he violated one..the Russian move was suicide.. Brilliant he wasn't... Trump is dangerous.. Insane yes, smart ,in a limited way...he's all ego..

 

[highfigh]

The vandalism that took place at civil rights/BLM protests was completely counterproductive in my opinion. I understand some of it was a result of frustration at the lack of progress. But, I think most was simply gratuitous destruction and pillaging.

That said, comparing it with the insurrection in Washington is like comparing apples and oranges. One involved the localized destruction of property. The other was an attempted coup, resulting in the destruction of the country's democratic system of government. One may look physically worse, but the consequences of the other for the nation would be much, much worse.

When is that kind of destruction productive? Even if there's a legitimate reason for the anger, the destruction doesn't need to happen- better ways to get the point across exist.

The attempt could easily have been stopped.

How would you attempt to get rid of someone in office when you really hate them? By making a bad event seem to be their fault would be the easy answer. Nobody has seen all of the communications that happened leading up to it (I have seen that people were discussing the weaponry and possible damage that might come more than two weeks prior) and one video included something about the timeline and speed of the impeachment- this wasn't a wacko right-wing news outlet, either. I'll have to find it.

I'm not defending the guy, but I have to wonder how anyone else would have responded to six years of attacks and attempts to remove them.

"That's not thick skin, it's sheet metal!". Maybe the orange is actually rust.......

 

[lovinthehd]

It's all Rudy's fault now https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/13/politics/donald-trump-rudy-giuliani-legal-fees-white-house/index.html

 

[highfigh]

Hitler didn't declare war on the U.S. by choice. He was allied with Japan. When they bombed Pearl Harbor, Hitler was forced into a war he didn't want. He also never wanted a war with Britain. Hitler was one of the most brilliant strategists on the planet. If he had made a few different choices back then, we might be speaking German. I consider Trump to be a very dangerous man. He can wield enough people in this country to start a Civil War.

WHAT??????????? He invaded Poland on Sept 1, 1939, after lying to them about having no intention of invading. Britain and France declared war the next day because Poland was an ally. Germany was already bombing the poop out of England in Sept, 1940 and that blitzkrieg lasted for 57 days!

If he didn't want a war with Britain, he had a helluva strange way of showing it.

 

[Trell]

It's all Rudy's fault now https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/13/politics/donald-trump-rudy-giuliani-legal-fees-white-house/index.html

:snicker:

 

[lp85253]

WHAT??????????? He invaded Poland on Sept 1, 1939, after lying to them about having no intention of invading. Britain and France declared war the next day because Poland was an ally. Germany was already bombing the poop out of England in Sept, 1940 and that blitzkrieg lasted for 57 days!

If he didn't want a war with Britain, he had a helluva strange way of showing it.

Dudes been reading some alternate version of history... Hitler was a clown that got lucky, much like our current president.. Sh** happens sometimes...

 

[highfigh]

And no one condoned it. Every politician denounced it. The protests are not the same as the riots but you can keep conflating them. You can keep having a hissy fit and combine the two.

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EVERY politician? Not a chance. I meant Mayors, city councils and others who told the police to stand down and let the protesters go, which easily got out of hand. Letting CHAZ happen wasn't an accident- they let it happen. Then, they buckled and cut funding to the Police. That'll go well.

Protesting is absolutely fine but they didn't prepare for rioting, even though that pattern had existed for a long time- look at the events in Milwaukee, Chicago and other cities over the last ten years.

 

[lovinthehd]

EVERY politician? Not a chance. I meant Mayors, city councils and others who told the police to stand down and let the protesters go, which easily got out of hand. Letting CHAZ happen wasn't an accident- they let it happen. Then, they buckled and cut funding to the Police. That'll go well.

Protesting is absolutely fine but they didn't prepare for rioting, even though that pattern had existed for a long time- look at the events in Milwaukee, Chicago and other cities over the last ten years.

Protesting is one thing, insurrection led by the republicans and perhaps even LE, is simply criminal.

 

[highfigh]

Dudes been reading some alternate version of history... Hitler was a clown that got lucky, much like our current president.. Sh** happens sometimes...

After WWI, the German economy was a shambles and they were seriously suffering, which pissed the people off. Hitler seized this as an opportunity to do something and he scratched the scabs off of the peoples' wounds. The quickest way to do this was to make everything look like it was someone else's fault and the usually target for European/Middle Eastern anger for more than 1500 years was the Jews. He could have just waged war without trying to kill a whole population, but that wasn't enough for him. The general population not resisting shows that people are afraid to stand against something when they risk losing their lives. For someone "who didn't want war", he didn't seem to mind being responsible for the killing of tens of millions of people. Conspiracy theorists think he fled successfully to Argentina and in either case (if he fled or killed himself), it was only because he didn't want to be captured.