PSA subwoofers. I talked with Tom

[William Lemmerhirt]

I knew it wouldn't be long before someone brought up portnography...

Lmao. I think you just created a new topic category!!!

 

[lovinthehd]

Lmao. I think you just created a new topic category!!!

First I'd seen the term myself, it's perfect. LOL

 

[tinman143]

The v1812s are now being sold as ev1812s. Tom said it would be awhile before the website gets updated. I did ask about the 2112 and he said it was not quite 2 of the 1812 as far as output goes. I will be getting a second 1812 in the future or returning and getting the 2112. The tv1812 didn't make since to get for me as height was the issue not width or depth. I didn't know how my better half would like the 21 or I would have bought that now ha. Thanks for your time and input as well.

Edit to add - Tom did say that they have sold 50 or so of the new ev model and none have been returned. He seemed confident that I would be happy.

Interesting that the eV is tuned lower than their predecessor. When are they arriving? Can’t wait to read your impressions.

 

[Hanks38]

I don't know if anyone is aware, but Tom Vodhanel started SVS and designed every subwoofer they sell. Sold SVS and started PSA.

 

[lovinthehd]

I don't know if anyone is aware, but Tom Vodhanel started SVS and designed every subwoofer they sell. Sold SVS and started PSA.

He's been out of SVS for a long time....don't think they still have him design their more recent subs....

 

[Hanks38]

Yes, he sold out a good while ago. I'm pretty sure all the designs above $1k are his. From the Ultra on down. In fact, I think the first sub SVS sold was the water heater design he had been making people for years.

 

[lovinthehd]

I'm pretty sure all the designs above $1k are his. From the Ultra on down.

Why would they still be in partnership? I don't believe it was a particularly amicable split from what I've seen. Why would he design his competitor's subs?

 

[ryanosaur]

I agree with Lovin'... I don't know when he left SVS, but I would be very surprised if he designed a single product for them after he left... and since I started paying attention in 2018, they have revamped many of their designs.

But hey, I'll take one for the team and google it for us:

A little research shows he left SVS "3.5 years ago" as of 9/11/11. He also claimed to have signed a non-compete agreement lasting 3 years.

16-ultra series looks to have been released in 2016.
4000 series in 2018.
3000 series in 2019.

Based on what I saw, it was not necessarily a happy situation, and to be fair, he quite politely said he would not comment on the circumstances beyond what I posted above.

 

[Hanks38]

Those may have been a new iteration(different parts), but the Ultra was a big deal when he first released it. He most certainly not design anything for them after he left. Yes, the designs they sell today were done long ago.

All of that really doesn't matter. They guy has the bone fides in the bass department.

 

[lovinthehd]

Those may have been a new iteration(different parts), but the Ultra was a big deal when he first released it. He most certainly not design anything for them after he left. Yes, the designs they sell today were done long ago.

All of that really doesn't matter. They guy has the bone fides in the bass department.

So amps and drivers and boxes and dsp etc are all the same since Tom was there? Sure....

 

[Timforhifi]

Last sub he designed was first generation ultra 13, back in 2008 era.

 

[Pw3669]

This might get blocked for this. And let me start out by say two things before posting. 1) Shady J’s subwoofer reviews are the gold standard IMO 2) I own two PSA subwoofers.

I seem to remember seeing some disagreements between Tom V and Shady J in the past, on one of these forums.

At the time I purchased my subs I had my heart set on some Monolith 15s but ended up going with PSA v1510s for two reasons. First was price. Nearly the same amp power and driver size as the monoliths for quite a bit less money. The monoliths were no doubt better performers but I figured in my normal sized room the performance differences would likely go unnoticed, but the cost savings was meaningful. It frustrated me not to see third party test data for the PSAs, but I figured most 15” subs with decent design and power seem to perform relatively in the same ballpark (at least for us normal folks). The second was customer support. I saw multiple posts about amp failures with the monoliths and one thing that seemed to be unanimous about PSA was their followup support. I can vouch for their responsiveness. It scared me seeing amp failures on such a large purchase and possibly having to call a large company that doesn’t focus primarily on subwoofers if something went wrong. The PSAs so far measure and sounds very good in my room.

 

[Timforhifi]

Why would this get you blocked?

 

[vader540is]

This might get blocked for this. And let me start out by say two things before posting. 1) Shady J’s subwoofer reviews are the gold standard IMO 2) I own two PSA subwoofers.

I seem to remember seeing some disagreements between Tom V and Shady J in the past, on one of these forums.

At the time I purchased my subs I had my heart set on some Monolith 15s but ended up going with PSA v1510s for two reasons. First was price. Nearly the same amp power and driver size as the monoliths for quite a bit less money. The monoliths were no doubt better performers but I figured in my normal sized room the performance differences would likely go unnoticed, but the cost savings was meaningful. It frustrated me not to see third party test data for the PSAs, but I figured most 15” subs with decent design and power seem to perform relatively in the same ballpark (at least for us normal folks). The second was customer support. I saw multiple posts about amp failures with the monoliths and one thing that seemed to be unanimous about PSA was their followup support. I can vouch for their responsiveness. It scared me seeing amp failures on such a large purchase and possibly having to call a large company that doesn’t focus primarily on subwoofers if something went wrong. The PSAs so far measure and sounds very good in my room.

The V1510 was one of my 1st PSA subs.

Awesome subwoofer.

 

[Pw3669]

Why would this get you blocked?

When I wrote that first line I was anticipating the post going a bit differently. It sort of morphed while I wrote it and I forgot to remove the “get blocked” line.

I was thinking some might not appreciate bringing up an old beef between Tom V and Shady J, which I believe got pretty contentious at one point. Since this thread is asking about about PSA, I thought it was worth noting that the mod/subwoofer reviewer for Audioholics has some negative history with PSA’s owner that could potentially add a degree of bias. That said, none of the posts I’ve seen from Shady J in this thread have been anything less than cordial and professional.

 

[digital911]

When I wrote that first line I was anticipating the post going a bit differently. It sort of morphed while I wrote it and I forgot to remove the “get blocked” line.

I was thinking some might not appreciate bringing up an old beef between Tom V and Shady J, which I believe got pretty contentious at one point. Since this thread is asking about about PSA, I thought it was worth noting that the mod/subwoofer reviewer for Audioholics has some negative history with PSA’s owner that could potentially add a degree of bias. That said, none of the posts I’ve seen from Shady J in this thread have been anything less than cordial and professional.

Any idea why there are no measurements for the PSA TV2112?
Any idea why audioholics don't mention PSA subs? Is it something to do with what you wrote about the beef with JL and TV?

I'd love to see some measurements on PSAs subs especially their top tier subs.

 

[Danzilla31]

Any idea why there are no measurements for the PSA TV2112?
Any idea why audioholics don't mention PSA subs? Is it something to do with what you wrote about the beef with JL and TV?

I'd love to see some measurements on PSAs subs especially their top tier subs.

If there was drama I think it was squashed long ago. Tom has kindoff mellowed out over the years I've noticed. He used to get into some spats on forums he's a lot chiller these days. He's always been super cool with his customers I had a great chat with him about some gear I was thinking about getting super great experience

As far as measurements Tom's not real big on reviews in the AVS forums you can hear him speak about it. He has his feelings about that. His products sell and he has a loyal customer base so it's not like he needs to put his stuff out they're.

i would like to see a couple reviews on his products just to see what the reviewers can verify that they can do but that's not Tom's thing It just is what it is I guess

The only review of a sub of his I ever saw was on Youthmans channel on YouTube. The sub was very impressive.

 

[lovinthehd]

There are some older PSA sub reviews on data-bass.com but that's all I've seen.

 

[ryanosaur]

Any idea why there are no measurements for the PSA TV2112?
Any idea why audioholics don't mention PSA subs? Is it something to do with what you wrote about the beef with JL and TV?

I'd love to see some measurements on PSAs subs especially their top tier subs.

Tom V. doesn't seem to care. *shrugs
I've heard he claims to be busy enough with out any 3rd party proof. Which is a shame. A good 3rd party review to prove he's doing it right would be nice.

Here's the catch:
The Pro Woofers he's using, with a high Fs, require gobs of power to perform where he is counting on making his sales... which is down low. His Amps are apparently capable of performing down there, but there is no Compression Test offered on any of his gear, much less CEA-2010 Bursts or Distortion tests.
While some Pro Drivers can deliver (still lookin' at that Eminence NSW6021-6 as the benchmark for many DIYers) in many aspects, performance in Infrasonic territory is NOT their primary goal.
I have a strong suspicion that while PSA Subs can perform down low through brute force alone, it may not be a pretty picture. Our ears are not so sensitive to distortion down there.

I would much rather spend the money on a Harbottle Sub that is designed and built specifically to perform down to 5Hz than on a guy using Pro Drivers with a high Fs claiming his sh!t works down to 12-14Hz... WITH NO PROOF!

This industry is rife with people making claims about gear: "Step up and prove it," is all I have to say to the lot of them.

Until then, I say "shop Harbottle!"

 

[lovinthehd]

Tom V. doesn't seem to care. *shrugs
I've heard he claims to be busy enough with out any 3rd party proof. Which is a shame. A good 3rd party review to prove he's doing it right would be nice.

Here's the catch:
The Pro Woofers he's using, with a high Fs, require gobs of power to perform where he is counting on making his sales... which is down low. His Amps are apparently capable of performing down there, but there is no Compression Test offered on any of his gear, much less CEA-2010 Bursts or Distortion tests.
While some Pro Drivers can deliver (still lookin' at that Eminence NSW6021-6 as the benchmark for many DIYers) in many aspects, performance in Infrasonic territory is NOT their primary goal.
I have a strong suspicion that while PSA Subs can perform down low through brute force alone, it may not be a pretty picture. Our ears are not so sensitive to distortion down there.

I would much rather spend the money on a Harbottle Sub that is designed and built specifically to perform down to 5Hz than on a guy using Pro Drivers with a high Fs claiming his sh!t works down to 12-14Hz... WITH NO PROOF!

This industry is rife with people making claims about gear: "Step up and prove it," is all I have to say to the lot of them.

Until then, I say "shop Harbottle!"

So Funk/Harbottle provides full measurements these days? I just looked at the Harbottle tab on the Funk sub page and didn't see any...