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JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Yep, and I believe that the FBI chose the Winchester PDX1 165-grain round after an evaluation of various ammunitions.
Winchester has the current contract to supply ammo.

I think the .40 SW's depiction as "short and weak" is a mis-characterization of the ammo (it has about the same FxM as a .357 and, in my opinion, better stopping power); just as I think the evaluation of the 10mm as unreliable (based on field tests with modified 1911 .45s, which were never designed for the muzzle pressure of a 10mm) are flawed.

As to pics for the monkey, I should be able to put some up tonight. As I said: I don't have a camera at work.

Pics of my speakers? They should look the same as last month. An air leak was fixed: but there's nothing left but programming; and that hasn't started. The last needed amp, delayed by snow, is supposed to arrive at the shop today.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
At least ones that leave junky SUVs parked on the street. :D

Well, or ones that have pool builders tear up their neighbor's lawn. :p
No it's not limited. Just make sure they don't have friends in the good ole boy network. If they do welcome to death row. ;)

And they better not be a woman or a kid. You're really gonna get it then.
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Here's the 23. Behind is part of the bedroom system.

A picture for the monkey.
 

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JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
So Chris: any updates? How do they look with all the wires attached? Inquiring minds want to know.
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
I think you're the only one who cares... :p
I think you're correct sir...:p
Not quite guys. I care. I like pic's in general but I have been clamoring for progress pic's on these when they were mine and I would still like seeing progress pic's on these and on Randy's speakers too.

That makes at least 3 of us who care.

Me and Jerry, we're tight now. :)
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Live and learn. Lube.
Back in your crate :D

Actually, a different question for Chris (who is hopefully off programming my crossovers right now), regarding Rany's speakers.

You basically made a box of birch, then put a layer of absorbant,t hen glued in Oak. What about the gaps that appear in the pics of the oak. Is the effect of air moving between those gaps to the birch underneath a non-issue? Is there something you are going to do to close those gaps?
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
A picture for the monkey.
I guess conceptually I maybe think guns are cool but looking at the pic does not inspire me to want to take hold of that thing and pull the trigger to make the bullets come out ... real fast.

I'd much rather strangle someone ... in self defense. :confused: :rolleyes:
 
R

randyb

Full Audioholic
Back in your crate :D

Actually, a different question for Chris (who is hopefully off programming my crossovers right now), regarding Rany's speakers.

You basically made a box of birch, then put a layer of absorbant,t hen glued in Oak. What about the gaps that appear in the pics of the oak. Is the effect of air moving between those gaps to the birch underneath a non-issue? Is there something you are going to do to close those gaps?
Excellent question- Chris?
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
Excellent question- Chris?
I'm not Chris nor have I ever played Chris on TV but the closer you get to the corners the better the stiffness becomes due to the adjacent wall acting as a brace. The flex and resonant behavior need to be addressed where they happen ... in the middle of the panel.

Even if I'm wrong you guys should thank me because Chris will be powerless to resist the urge to correct my mistakes on his motives. I can hear him running to his keyboard now. :D

j/k ... good luck fellas. ;)
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
You are mostly right Alex.

In addition to the stiffness being increased due to brace proximity, the small surface area of unweighted/braced material is relatively insignificant and unable to resonate audibly especially because the dampening methods pictured are so effective. Think of it this way, if you did the "knock test" on the heavily braced side of the speaker, it would sound and feel like you were knocking on a brick (rather than some hollow wood on a typical speaker). If you did the same on one of these air gaps, there might be a change in behavior, but the change would be very virtually unnoticeable because the energy created would quickly be absorbed by the high mass object (found in the adjacent bracing/constrained layers).

Do remember that these resonances come from multiple sources, for example: driver backwaves and direct transfer of energy from the driver to the cabinet. The heavy bracing and constrained layers primarily affects energy transfer from the driver while judicious use of rockwool in the cabinet is used to prevent backwaves from creating resonances. Combined it is a non-issue. The end goal is not to have a cabinet with zero resonance, that is not really feasible, rather the goal is to attenuate resonance below audibility thresholds.
 
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JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Really?

It seems like the 1/2" of peel-n-seal is intended as an insulator, and that the insulator works both ways.

In other words: the amount of bracing on a "knock test" of the outer (MDF) cabinet would not be significantly changed by the inner (concrete) panels because of the isolation caused by the flexible layer in-between.

As I understood his design, this was pretty deliberately so as it means that what vibration does occur in the inner panels is not transferred to the outside because the vaso-something layer (peel-n-seal) converts the vibration to heat.

If my understanding is correct (the inner layer is an absorber mechanically isolated from the outer layer) than these gaps give the soundwaves in the cabinet a direct route to the outer shell (hence my question).

That said, Chris has not been online in many days it seems. I'm becoming worried about my ability to go get my gear next week (timlines are always a danger), though I cannot imagine actual programming takes more than a day to complete.
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
Really?

It seems like the 1/2" of peel-n-seal is intended as an insulator, and that the insulator works both ways.

In other words: the amount of bracing on a "knock test" of the outer (MDF) cabinet would not be significantly changed by the inner (concrete) panels because of the isolation caused by the flexible layer in-between.

As I understood his design, this was pretty deliberately so as it means that what vibration does occur in the inner panels is not transferred to the outside because the vaso-something layer (peel-n-seal) converts the vibration to heat.

If my understanding is correct (the inner layer is an absorber mechanically isolated from the outer layer) than these gaps give the soundwaves in the cabinet a direct route to the outer shell (hence my question).
There seems to be a misunderstanding about this design, specifically how the peel-n-seal works. It acts as a viscoelastic constrained layer, not as a decoupling layer. By adhering two relatively high mass materials between a third material this design (viscoelastic constrained layer) is able to efficiently turn energy into heat - through high mass and the created shearing force between the two materials and the peel-n-seal, which is an asphalt polymer that is fairly efficient at converting energy to heat and then dissipating this heat.

In contrast, a decoupling layer (what you are thinking of) would effectively remove interaction between the outer shell and inner shell of a speaker. To do this effectively, all physical transfer of energy from outer to inner shell must be eliminated (a pain to achieve properly and clearly not the case in this design). Such a design can be effective, but as far as I know, the inner shell would still require heavy bracing. Such bracing may not be necessary on the inner shell, but I am unaware of any studies that test the transfer of resonance to a driver from the cabinet which may be a factor in such a case.

Quick summary: The peel-n-seal design is specifically created to effectively attenuate resonances while a decoupling design renders them inaudibly by eliminating the chance of transfer to a cabinet sharing space with the listener.

edit: For a simple idea of what a decoupled system would look like think of a box floating in another box - not physically coupled in any way. The drivers would be mounted to the inner box, but form an airtight seal to the outer box, again without any way to physically transfer energy.
 
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J

jamie2112

Banned
Sup Andrew long time no see here.Once again a great explanation.....
 
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