Truthslayer

Truthslayer

Full Audioholic
Game represent game... I'm old enough... barely... but I remember. ;)
Telly... Or Krugman as Quincy? Perhaps some Starsky and Hutch? Or maybe some right proper old school CHiPs!
Yep, back in the good old days. When it was safe to turn on the tv and the whole family could turn to any channel and watch anything without the fear of some of the vile things on today.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
Game represent game... I'm old enough... barely... but I remember. ;)
Telly... Or Krugman as Quincy? Perhaps some Starsky and Hutch? Or maybe some right proper old school CHiPs!
Cheesy/dumb tv is what I grew up with for the most part....was just watching a documentary on The Monkees :)
 
Truthslayer

Truthslayer

Full Audioholic
Cheesy/dumb tv is what I grew up with for the most part....was just watching a documentary on The Monkees :)
Yep, some of it was definitely cheesy. But at least back then parents didn't have to worry about how they were going to explain to their kids what they just watched. I guess you could say- it was safe tv.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
My favorite was the old Neil Diamond song:
I still have my vinyl Best of the Monkees! My favs are that one as well as Last Train to Clarksville and (I'm Not Your) Steppin' Stone. The documentary was a bit more revealing from what I knew, tho. Interesting bunch of guys....did you know Michael Nesmith's mom invented Liquid Paper? (I'm an old office dude so quite familiar with it :) ).
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
Yep, some of it was definitely cheesy. But at least back then parents didn't have to worry about how they were going to explain to their kids what they just watched. I guess you could say- it was safe tv.
What is the value of "safe" tv? Why aren't the parents watching what their kids are and engaging about it? That's the dumb part if they're not....
 
Truthslayer

Truthslayer

Full Audioholic
What is the value of "safe" tv? Why aren't the parents watching what their kids are and engaging about it? That's the dumb part if they're not....
Why? Good question, it's whole different world. A lot of parents today just give their kids a laptop, iPhone and throw them in front of the tv. Having no idea all the crap their exposed to, or they just don't seem to care anymore.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
Why? Good question, it's whole different world. A lot of parents today just give their kids a laptop, iPhone and throw them in front of the tv. Having no idea all the crap their exposed to, or they just don't seem to care anymore.
Or send them to schools as babysitters and not engage with them on that either. It shows here in the US these days. Most sperm should be locked up :)
 
Truthslayer

Truthslayer

Full Audioholic
Or send them to schools as babysitters and not engage with them on that either. It shows here in the US these days. Most sperm should be locked up :)
Bad thing about it, seems like many don't even care to make sure their kids get to school. Then blame the system on their lack of education and turn around and want free college. I feel bad for the teachers K-12 now a days, all the hell they have to put up with. Makes it easy to see why so many of the good ones (teachers), end up leaving and moving on to a different career.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
Bad thing about it, seems like many don't even care to make sure their kids get to school. Then blame the system on their lack of education and turn around and want free college. I feel bad for the teachers K-12 now a days, all the hell they have to put up with. Makes it easy to see why so many of the good ones (teachers), end up leaving and moving on to a different career.
My parents were both teachers, my dad had to quit early on to raise a family due the poor pay/benefits. My mom died a teacher (and the tributes her students paid her at the school's services were truly heart melting). Paid for education can only benefit us I think, mostly I think our education system has been screwed up by politics, particularly those that still support idiocy like creationism. Mostly it's the poor pay....compared to idiots in marketing making millions selling stupid crappy audiophile products.
 
Truthslayer

Truthslayer

Full Audioholic
My parents were both teachers, my dad had to quit early on to raise a family due the poor pay/benefits. My mom died a teacher (and the tributes her students paid her at the school's services were truly heart melting). Paid for education can only benefit us I think, mostly I think our education system has been screwed up by politics, particularly those that still support idiocy like creationism. Mostly it's the poor pay....compared to idiots in marketing making millions selling stupid crappy audiophile products.
Teachers back in the day, worked hard and were definitely underpaid. Today, the pay may not be great, but it's not bad.( My sister teachers 1st grade). As far as the politics being taught or discussed, I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing, if it's taught with accuracy and how the system (government) actually works, but not with a one sided political VIEW. Religion, however never should be in the schools, to many different beliefs and faiths, leads to nothing but trouble. Then that also creates those debates over creationism vs evolution. Nothing but trouble.

I have no issue with K-12 being funded (free). But when it comes to funding college, im sorry but no. If you have to pay for something, most of the time you will work harder to get out of it what you've put in. And some of these college courses are just ridiculous things (subjects, studies, etc). When it comes to, Doctors, lawyers, engineers, etc. hell yes get a degree. Otherwise most of them would be better off with a trade school or just on the job training.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
Teachers back in the day, worked hard and were definitely underpaid. Today, the pay may not be great, but it's not bad.( My sister teachers 1st grade). As far as the politics being taught or discussed, I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing, if it's taught with accuracy and how the system (government) actually works, but not with a one sided political VIEW. Religion, however never should be in the schools, to many different beliefs and faiths, leads to nothing but trouble. Then that also creates those debates over creationism vs evolution. Nothing but trouble.

I have no issue with K-12 being funded (free). But when it comes to funding college, im sorry but no. If you have to pay for something, most of the time you will work harder to get out of it what you've put in. And some of these college courses are just ridiculous things (subjects, studies, etc). When it comes to, Doctors, lawyers, engineers, etc. hell yes get a degree. Otherwise most of them would be better off with a trade school or just on the job training.
So you're against scholarships?
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
If you use external amplification, you can run the Denon (either model) in ECO mode and that will drop the temperature of the AVR by roughly 10 degrees F!
Ah, but will Eco mode also drop the Pre-out Voltage to 1V or something? :D
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Warlord
Ah, but will Eco mode also drop the Pre-out Voltage to 1V or something? :D
Nope!
Fortunately, D & M has always maintained good pre-out levels!
It was Yamaha that compromised pre-out levels! I still don't get that...how much did they save?
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Warlord
Kew, I don't think i recommended one over the other.
Seriously? WTF?

I know some wont quiver about the 3500, but I wouldn't take it even if it were for free.
But even if i did somehow unwittingly recommend one vs the other. What's the problem with that?
I have absolutely no problem with that, my intent was to add more information with my post.
Note that I said "I wouldn't" be too quick to recommend one over the other (on the basis of the cooling system) without more information!
If I had said "You shouldn't" I would better understand where your post was coming from!

Here is my entire post:
The 3500 is a 7.2 AVR and the 3600 is a 9.2 AVR. You will note that not only did the 3600 use different heat sinks, but it also adds a built-in fan!
I would not be too quick to recommend one over the other without more info (unless you really need the extra 2 channels!). The 3500 was packed and I could see how they would have to go to extremes to accommodate the additional heat of 2 more amps. In this era, when AVR's are designed with a lifespan of 8 to 10 years, you don't have the luxury of believing better heat sinks will buy you another decade of service.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Nope!
Fortunately, D & M has always maintained good pre-out levels!
It was Yamaha that compromised pre-out levels! I still don't get that...how much did they save?
Gene has been saying recently that he believes most AVRs (Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, etc.),not just Yamaha, have issues (even when using external amps) if the volume is high enough because they don't have a "separate preamp mode" that separates the internal amps from the preamp section.

That's only true if the volume level isn't high enough to clip the internal power amps.This is a problem I'm finding in most AV receivers including Denon and Marantz without a poweramp disconnect mode.
@PENG I would assume that in "ECO" mode, the power and voltage would drop even more than normal mode?

So if someone were going to use a 300W external power amp, I would assume they would not want to use ECO mode?

Or did I miss the lecture day on ECO mode? :D
 
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KEW

KEW

Audioholic Warlord
Gene has been saying recently that he believes most AVRs (Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, etc.),not just Yamaha, have issues with Pre-out voltage because they don't have a "separate preamp mode" that separates the internal amps from the preamp section.

@PENG I would assume that in "ECO" mode, the power and voltage would drop even more than normal mode?
It was Gene's review that stated that the ECO mode would not compromise sound quality if you used external amplification. He may have learned more since then.
I would like to see the measurements showing this on D&M if you can provide a link!
I certainly am no expert on this, but my understanding is the power and voltage changes from ECO mode would be at the amplifier level, not at the pre-amp level!
 
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