Thoughts and prayers for Paris, France.

[markw]

I understand those problems but it is legal and not mandatory to have it done.
I have lots of problems with lots of things that are legal.

Agree.

Federal law prohibits federal tax dollars paying for it. Perhaps that also covers state taxes, not sure.
Been like this for a good while.

And yet, they do. Loopholes abound.

You are doubting they don't do such counseling?
Why wouldn't planning go astray? Not much in life is foolproof. Rape is not planned for. Insest is not planned for. Rubber/latex breaks. And on it goes what else may alter all the planning in the world.

I didn't think I needed to say it but rape, incest and health issues warrant an abortion. As for their counseling, if it were more effective then abortion would be needed for only those three reasons. Not to remedy the effects of careless, unprotected sex. For that, they should pay for their own mistakes.

 

[Alex2507]

You do realize that the majority of what Planned Parenthood does is NOT abortion related right?

That's just like the majority of what serial killers do is NOT killing related right?

 

[gene]

My only problem with them is the abortions. Now, if our tax dollars didn't pay for them, I'd not have a gripe. And, if they really helped "plan" parenthood, abortion s wouldn't be needed. That's more like unplanned parenthood.

And, no. It doesn't matter what they were there for and didn't deserve to die. Who ever suggested they did? Please, don't stoop to trying to put words in my mouth. That's a liberal debating tactic and I thought we were above that. They just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

What DOES matter is what they were NOT there for, which is a connection to planned butcherhood. So, planned parenthood may have not been a target. If so, their people would have died. Logical?

As for the media picking and choosing what to report on, did you see this mentioned anywhere?

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/three-dead-lafayette-louisiana-movie-theater-shooting

or this?

http://washingtonweeklynews.com/there-was-just-a-giant-mass-shooting-nobodys-talking-about/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

Yeah, I guess if they can't tie it to a conservative cause and/or a crazy white guy with a gun so they can cry "more gun control" they really just try to bury it. One quick mention and it's history. Strange. Both these occurred in Louisiana. I guess they are all crazy there, eh?

It's kind of hard to cover the sheer number of mass shootings these days that the media is afraid to call domestic terrorism which is EXACTLY what it is. While the bulk of the mass shootings do seem to be disgruntle psychotic white men/teens, it doesn't mean they are the only ones.

It's naive to think this particular mental case didn't target the Planned Parenthood clinic and just happened to go in there and start shooting especially given his rants against abortion. Seriously you really don't see the connection?

As for Government funded abortions, Planned Parenthood actual abortion spending represents about 3% of their total budget according to this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/08/12/for-planned-parenthood-abortion-stats-3-percent-and-94-percent-are-both-misleading/

I personally don't think its our right to judge or deny woman who need this service as its better for them to get it done through the proper channels than by some hack or worse they try it themselves. I won't argue the merits of abortion with you but I think we can both agree that as men, we should shut up about this topic since we shouldn't be dictating reproductive rights of others, especially those of the opposite sex.

As for Gov't spending, I get far more bent out of shape about how much we waste on military spending and contracts. I witnessed this personally since I've been in the military defense industry.

I suggest watching this little video:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1100908993255029

 

[gene]

I didn't think I needed to say it but rape, incest and health issues warrant an abortion. As for their counseling, if it were more effective then abortion would be needed for only those three reasons. Not to remedy the effects of careless, unprotected sex. For that, they should pay for their own mistakes.

Really, and what are the stats for the reasons abortions are being conducted at Planned Parenthood clinics.

I agree if a person is an adult and wants an abortion for reasons other than rape, incest, or health issues, they should be responsible using their healthcare provider insurance. But, if they have no insurance, and don't have the economic means to pay for it, then they are stuck having the baby and either giving it up for adoption or going on welfare (which I am sure you hate since it further wastes Gov't money).

So what do we do with people of poor economic means? Sterilize them? No. Planned Parenthood attempts to educate and hopefully reach these people so they can make better decisions.

 

[markw]

It's kind of hard to cover the sheer number of mass shootings these days that the media is afraid to call domestic terrorism which is EXACTLY what it is. While the bulk of the mass shootings do seem to be disgruntle psychotic white men/teens, it doesn't mean they are the only ones.

And yet, the government has a specific agenda and the media plays along with it. Did you know the DOJ is going to prosecute it's first knock-out case, but as a hate crime?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/dec/26/federal-authorities-charge-white-knockout-suspect-/

Now, if you search on "knock-out crimes, you'll see virtually all are black on white. Yet, the DOJ chooses to prosecute a white kid. No, no agenda here, and the MSM won't touch this. Google it, you'll see more than one reference, but not in any of the MSM channels. Strange, no?

It's naive to think this particular mental case didn't target the Planned Parenthood clinic and just happened to go in there and start shooting especially given his rants against abortion. Seriously you really don't see the connection?

Then why did he start at a nearby bank and not kill, or harm, anyone associated with PP? He was just a nut with a gun, no better or worse than those two I linked to in my previous post. What was their motivation?

As for Government funded abortions, Planned Parenthood actual abortion spending represents about 3% of their total budget according to this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/08/12/for-planned-parenthood-abortion-stats-3-percent-and-94-percent-are-both-misleading/

Then they won't miss the funding, will they? Let abortion clinics operate on their own. I don't want to pay for them.

I personally don't think its our right to judge or deny woman who need this service as its better for them to get it done through the proper channels than by some hack or worse they try it themselves. I won't argue the merits of abortion with you but I think we can both agree that as men, we should shut up about this topic since we shouldn't be dictating reproductive rights of others, especially those of the opposite sex.

I don't judge women who have abortions. That's between their conscience and whatever higher power they believe in, Again, I just don't want to pay for them. You don't seem to understand that, do you?

As for Gov't spending, I get far more bent out of shape about how much we waste on military spending and contracts. I witnessed this personally since I've been in the military defense industry.

I suggest watching this little video:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1100908993255029

Now, government spending is another issue. How many $$ were spent on "green" companies that went bankrupt months after getting multi-million government grants, and awarding of contracts to insiders, like Pelosi's husband?

 

[herbu]

While I don't like to stereotype... Trump is a prime example of this rhetoric getting out of hand and fueling stupid people

Priceless!

 

[mtrycrafts]

...Again, I just don't want to pay for them. ...

Well, there are many things government spends my tax $$$ on that I don't agree with either. We live in a representative republic and live with it.

 

[markw]

Well, there are many things government spends my tax $$$ on that I don't agree with either. We live in a representative republic and live with it.

think about this: How would you feel if your single, young daughter who lives with you, asked you for money to pay for a hotel room so she could sleep with a guy you despised?

 

[mtrycrafts]

think about this: How would you feel if your single, young daughter who lives with you, asked you for money to pay for a hotel room so she could sleep with a guy you despised?

Wouldn't like that either and in that case I do have control over my money. $$$ stays in pocket and she'd get a good advice, get a job, both of you.
On the other hand, I don't have the same control over the government spending my $$$, any government, city, state or feds.

In the end, you have the right not to like the way government spends your tax $$$ but lack positive control just like me.

 

[markw]

Wouldn't like that either and in that case I do have control over my money. $$$ stays in pocket and she'd get a good advice, get a job, both of you.
On the other hand, I don't have the same control over the government spending my $$$, any government, city, state or feds.

In the end, you have the right not to like the way government spends your tax $$$ but lack positive control just like me.

I seems you really are against the idea due to personal convictions.
.
Ah, but that begs the question: If she could go to a government agency, say Planned Parenthood or some such, and they would provide gher with the funds to do what she wants, would youy still be so cavalier, or would you tru to put a stop to it.

No, this doesn';t mean bombing or some such. Just seeing about getting funds withheld from such an organization.

 

[Bizarro_Stormy]

...If she could go to a government agency, say Planned Parenthood... and they would provide her with the funds to do what she wants...

This is a flawed hypothetical question...

Planned Parenthood is not a Gubbermint agency...
Planned Parenthood is non-profit organization...

They get reimbursed for some services rendered, through Medicaid and the like...

So, while they accept money from some Gubbermint agencies, it is a fallacy to say Planned Parenthood is a part of the Gubbermint...


You say "toMAHto"...
I say "GROSS..! I HATE TOMATOES..!"

 

[Chu Gai]

Here's an article that looks to give an overview of PP. I'm not sure what family planning is. I do know when my wife and I were first married, I think we used PP as source of relatively inexpensive birth control - the pill. Eventually we stopped using it.

WRT the videos that have been released, I think what got me was the cavalier way aborted fetuses were discussed. Like going to your butcher (I mean no direct analogy here) and looking to get an 8 lb. top round roast. Or getting just the right size granite slab for your kitchen. One from column A and two from column B. It was so matter of fact. Some of the light hearted jokes.

Like many of you, I have kids. I still have the sonograms and today they're much more detailed. We knew damned well that bundle of cells could not survive outside of the womb. We also knew it was affected by everything my wife experienced. Stress, the kinds of foods, any trauma, etc. For us and maybe for you it was a life waiting for a name, a chance to carry on a name, to play ball, to fall in love.

I also know that for those who didn't want to be pregnant, it was a problem no matter what the reason. Rape, incest, deformed, danger to the mother, or whatever, there were people for whom this fetus wasn't right. Some believe it has a soul or a destiny to be fulfilled. Others just the opposite. We all have to live with the choices we make. There will be those who aborted a fetus and wished they hadn't. Those that gave birth to a child who becomes a monster and wished they had.

I'm not your typical conservative leaning person. I'd just leave PP alone other than to give people there some sensitivity training. Those people who don't inform authorities about cases of rape and molestation, they should be fired and brought up on charges.

Anyways, that's me.

 

[markw]

View attachment 17060

This is a flawed hypothetical question...

Planned Parenthood is not a Gubbermint agency...
Planned Parenthood is non-profit organization...

They get reimbursed for some services rendered, through Medicaid and the like...

So, while they accept money from some Gubbermint agencies, it is a fallacy to say Planned Parenthood is a part of the Gubbermint...


You say "toMAHto"...
I say "GROSS..! I HATE TOMATOES..!"

Sorry, they do receive government funding and yes' they do make a profit. Otherwise they wouldn't be doing it.

86% of their income comes from abortions.

http://www.redstate.com/2015/09/30/cecile-richards-abortion-86-planned-parenthoods-revenue/

And, if they really don't receive much from the government, then thy can do without and live with their profits.

But, if they concentrated more on preventing pregnancies and less on aborting them, perhaps then my attitude towards them might change.

 

[Bizarro_Stormy]

86% of their income comes from abortions.

I couldn't find where it said that...
I did find a rather hard to understand sentence...

"Yesterday, under questioning by Representative Rep. Cynthia Lummis (R-WY) 81%, Richards admitted that a staggering 86% of non-government revenue and revealed Planned Parenthood for what it is: an organization devoted to increasing the number of abortions in the United States."

The last bolded part is opinion...

In fact, the whole article is cherry-picked opinion masquerading as fact...
It only links to the same agenda-driven sites to back itself up...

If you read what I wrote above...
PP is not funded by the Gubbermint...
It receives reimbursement for services rendered from some Gubbermint agencies...

There is a difference...

 

[markw]

"Combined federal, state, and local government funding (of Planned Parenthood) has increased from $203 million (30 percent of Planned Parenthood’s consolidated revenue) during its fiscal year 2000–2001 to $528 million (41 percent of revenue) during 2013–2014.[11] Planned Parenthood’s annual report does not provide a breakdown of federal versus state funding or the exact government grants, contracts, and reimbursements it receives."

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2015/09/disentangling-the-data-on-planned-parenthood-affiliates-abortion-services-and-receipt-of-taxpayer-funding

It's kind of a hard read but it's a great example of creative accounting.

 

[mtrycrafts]

I seems you really are against the idea due to personal convictions.
.
Ah, but that begs the question: If she could go to a government agency, say Planned Parenthood or some such, and they would provide gher with the funds to do what she wants, would youy still be so cavalier, or would you tru to put a stop to it.

No, this doesn';t mean bombing or some such. Just seeing about getting funds withheld from such an organization.

Well, I am against your specific narrow example of me funding that specific case that I have control over.
While the comparison is bizarre, I would not try to stop the funding. And in reality PP doesn't fund such
cases. I see nothing wrong with what they are doing, any of it. Their existence is crucial.

 

[markw]

Well, I am against your specific narrow example of me funding that specific case that I have control over.
While the comparison is bizarre, I would not try to stop the funding. And in reality PP doesn't fund such
cases. I see nothing wrong with what they are doing, any of it. Their existence is crucial.

Again, "planned" parenthood means, to me, preventing pregnancies in the first place, not doing mop up work after it has taken place.

If they did what their title implied, I would have no problem with government funding.

 

[mtrycrafts]

86% of their income comes from abortions.

http://www.redstate.com/2015/09/30/cecile-richards-abortion-86-planned-parenthoods-revenue/

...

Let's be clear on this, 86% of the NON-government revenue. Government doesn't fund abortions, other sources do. Is that why they should be defunded??? Your tax dollars do not pay for abortions. Not sure what you are objecting to. Perhaps that they perform a legal procedure that you do not agree with?

The question to ask then, is how much revenue there is from government reimbursements of other treatments and how much from other sources.
Perhaps that 86% is peanuts in the whole picture.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Again, "planned" parenthood means, to me, preventing pregnancies in the first place, not doing mop up work after it has taken place.
If they did what their title implied, I would have no problem with government funding.

Oh, they do try to prevent. Unfortunately it doesn't work a 100% of time or cases. And I bet many "mop up" cases may not have been to patients seeking prevention in the first place.

Again, government is not funding the "mop op" operation.