The Audyssey MultEQ Editor app users thread (with facts and tips)

S

shkumar4963

Audioholic
You can try uninstalling the app and re-installing it but it sounds more like a network issue if you can find the Denon's ip address. So if re-installing the app doesn't work you should try and set up the Denon's internet connection again. If nothing helps then I guess you are going to have to reset the processor and start setup from scratch. Good thing you have the App otherwise after a reset you have to re-run Audyssey.
After the latest AVR update, my multEQ also has trouble finding the AVR.

Just keep trying and it will find it.

Some people say that moving the AVR from DHCP to static IP address solves this problem. But I have not tried that yet.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
S

shkumar4963

Audioholic
I run into that sometimes too. Uninstalling/reinstalling the app fixed it.

I spent this past weekend playing with ratbuddyssey to positive effect.

View attachment 37415

I think that's as good as I've ever seen from my system. I'm still using a MiniDSP from 90 hz and down, but used RB with the app editor above 90 hz. I found it tedious and time consuming, but effective. I don't think there's anything I couldn't do manually with the app that I can do manually with REW. I still prefer REW for ease of use and time involved, but I'm super tickled with what I was able to accomplish with RB and the app!

I officially love the app editor now and fully endorse it!
Did you use the close mic technique with REW as suggested by @Jon AA to get these results?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
S

shkumar4963

Audioholic
Thanks Peng!

I use DEQ as my house curve. RLO 10.

View attachment 37418

And I have options! For use here on the forums I labeled a couple more charts to illustrate effects of DEQ and the reference level offsets. Seems like it's come up a few times recently and these are a great visual.

View attachment 37419

View attachment 37420

It's also a great illustration of the 2 EQ settings with HSUs VTF series of subwoofers.
In the following graph the top line seems to be DEQ RLO 0. That is giving the max boost to bass. Is that correct.?

I thought that DEQ RLO 15 will give the max boost. Please comment.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
In the following graph the top line seems to be DEQ RLO 0. That is giving the max boost to bass. Is that correct.?

I thought that DEQ RLO 15 will give the max boost. Please comment.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
That is correct. 0 gives the max boost and 15 is the softest.

I used the 90° calibration file with my mic pointed up at the ceiling.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
I will add that, despite EQ 1 having deeper extension I prefer the higher output in the audible range with eq 2 for music. It just sounds better to me. More impact and chest thump.

06-22-20 DEQ RLO EQ2.jpg


RLO 10 for music and RLO 0 for movies. If it's a movie that I know has a lot of really deep bass then I might flip to eq 1 and plug a port just for fun.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
So I went ahead and got ratbuddyssey and played around a bit, but in doing that I've exposed an issue. Below is my theater room at full range. I wanted to play around (again) with flat vs. off and the results are below. Using reference got me pretty much the same results, but didn't correct the bump at 16khz.

Everything is measured hotter than you guys do so I'll correct that and show some better graphs, but I want advice for my apparent crossover issue.

The gold trace is with Audyssey off. Blue is the front R/L at full range with Audyssey Reference. Red is Audyssey flat.

As you can see I've got an issue with my crossover settings. Right now it's set at 100hz, but that doesn't look too good. All are with 1/12 smoothing.

My mains are in-walls on an outside wall and I didn't have time to build a box for them so bass is lacking quite a bit.

audyssey full range.jpg


Below is subs only crossed at 250hz so I can get a good measurement up to 200hz. That is with playing around with Ratbuddyssey. Decent results, but they taper off good before 20hz. These my get retired sooner than I had planned.

subs 250hz x.jpg


So, need some help from the experts on this one. Where should I start?
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
Adjustments made with rb/app editor don't affect the flat setting. Only reference for some reason, and you can see it in your first chart with the blue trace. Except where the bass drops off a cliff it looks to me like you made some improvements with the app on top of what Audyssey did.

A few questions;
What is the spl goal in those charts you're wanting to be +/- within? It looks like about 100 dB?
Are you tackling the whole frequency range from 10 - 20k or just dialing in your bass?
How about a sweep from 10 to 200 with both speakers and subs? How does that look?
What the hell happened with your bass in the blue trace? That's the one that shows the app adjustments.

I figured out that when my volume is at -20 that equates to 75 dB at the measurement position (with REW test tones- pc volume 100%), based on many sweeps. That's where I do my tweaking and aim for +/- 1 dB, which I never quite get, but hey... you can tell what Audyssey is aiming for when you look at the full sweep. Especially where cuts are made. That's how I determined 75 dB at my seat (again, with REW sweeps) with the dial at -20.

I haven't really played around above 300 hz with the editor yet. Measurements aren't too bad above that, tho there are some opportunities. I'm just not that eager to be bumping higher frequencies and risk pushing something into clipping when I turn it up every once in a while. I'm still exclusively using the mini with my subs, but did recently roll my sleeves up and get comfortable with ratbuddyssey. It works great for making tighter adjustments but man is it tedious.

I tweak the file on my pc, then email it to my tablet. How are you guys doing that? Getting the file from your pc to the editor? It's not a huge deal but the email step adds just that much more time to every adjustment for me.
 
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panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
Adjustments made with rb/app editor don't affect the flat setting. Only reference for some reason, and you can see it in your first chart with the blue trace. Except where the bass drops off a cliff it looks to me like you made some improvements with the app on top of what Audyssey did.

A few questions;
What is the spl goal in those charts you're wanting to be +/- within? It looks like about 100 dB?
Are you tackling the whole frequency range from 10 - 20k or just dialing in your bass?
How about a sweep from 10 to 200 with both speakers and subs? How does that look?
What the hell happened with your bass in the blue trace? That's the one that shows the app adjustments.

I figured out that when my volume is at -20 that equates to 75 dB at the measurement position (with REW test tones), based on many sweeps. That's where I do my tweaking and aim for +/- 1 dB, which I never quite get, but hey... you can tell what Audyssey is aiming for when you look at the full sweep. Especially where cuts are made. That's how I determined 75 dB at my seat (again, with REW sweeps) with the dial at -20.

I haven't really played around above 300 hz with the editor yet. Measurements aren't too bad above that, tho there are some opportunities. I'm just not that eager to be bumping higher frequencies and risk pushing something into clipping when I turn it up every once in a while. I'm still exclusively using the mini with my subs, but did recently roll my sleeves up and get comfortable with ratbuddyssey. It works great for making tighter adjustments but man is it tedious.

I tweak the file on my pc, then email it to my tablet. How are you guys doing that? Getting the file from your pc to the editor? It's not a huge deal but the email step adds just that much more time to every adjustment for me.
Blue trace is without subs. I'm going in the theater now to do some more measurements with subs only which is the bottom graph after adjusting. I was just concerned that the bump in the 16khz region was due to reference being used.

I'll do some checking and get the measurement db where you guys do it.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
Blue trace is without subs. I'm going in the theater now to do some more measurements with subs only which is the bottom graph after adjusting. I was just concerned that the bump in the 16khz region was due to reference being used.

I'll do some checking and get the measurement db where you guys do it.
That bump is weird. You said the gold trace is more or less pure direct?

*Edit: I'll be on for a bit so I'll keep an eye out for you if you have more questions.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
That bump is weird. You said the gold trace is more or less pure direct?

*Edit: I'll be on for a bit so I'll keep an eye out for you if you have more questions.
Ok. So here is to 200hz. Crossover is set to 200hz for testing. This is mains + subs. Purple is before tweaking with ratbuddyssey, gold after. Purple is audyssey off.

before and after ratbuddyssey.jpg


Minor improvements, but 140hz has a big dip I can't get rid of.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Ok. So here is to 200hz. Crossover is set to 200hz for testing. This is mains + subs. Purple is before tweaking with ratbuddyssey, gold after. Purple is audyssey off.

View attachment 37727

Minor improvements, but 140hz has a big dip I can't get rid of.
Is this your LR with the single sub? Or your HT with 4 subs?
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
Ok. So here is to 200hz. Crossover is set to 200hz for testing. This is mains + subs. Purple is before tweaking with ratbuddyssey, gold after. Purple is audyssey off.

View attachment 37727

Minor improvements, but 140hz has a big dip I can't get rid of.
That gold trace is looking pretty good. At least you're making some improvements! 200 hz seems awfully high for a crossover tho, and that dip at 140-ish is probably a room mode that won't be easy to fix with PEQ. Did you try giving it a bump with the editor?

You can also try moving stuff around a little to see if you can improve anything before running room correction or applying any eq. I did sweeps of my R and L mains individually, as well as my subs individually. That helped me zero in on a huge null on my right side. It's there with the both the speaker and sub on that side. I have a little bit of wiggle room so I moved the speaker 6" closer, take a sweep, moved it 6" the other way, 'nother sweep, repeat. Did that until I found a spot that wasn't too out of place and also gained me back just a couple dB. Didn't seem like much but when I ran Audyssey again it did a much better job.
 
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Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
It looks like 85 dB is your target? If so you can go through and make some cuts on those high spots and it'll make those dips look a lot better. Sometimes a cut can have positive effects up or downstream too. It can also have deleterious effects too tho, so that's why I only tweak one thing at a time. If you upload multiple adjustments and something goes south you don't know which tweak did what.

This is why I still keep my mini inline. It is so much faster to do a 10 second sweep and make an instant adjustment. No uploading and emailing files back and forth. I like that I have the editor tho, and ratbuddyssey definitely helped and is effective. I just wish it weren't so time consuming. Using it I spend more time staring at a black screen waiting for the upload to finish than I do measuring and adjusting.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
Is this your LR with the single sub? Or your HT with 4 subs?
Theater is down two subs so I've only got the ones at the front. Once I finish the new boxes that are sitting in the garage I'll be at full strength.

So this is LR with two subs at the front.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
That gold trace is looking pretty good. At least you're making some improvements! 200 hz seems awfully high for a crossover tho, and that dip at 140-ish is probably a room mode that won't be easy to fix with PEQ. Did you try giving it a bump with the editor?

You can also try moving stuff around a little to see if you can improve anything before running room correction or applying any eq. I did sweeps of my R and L mains individually, as well as my subs individually. That helped me zero in on a huge null on my right side. It's there with the both the speaker and sub on that side. I have a little bit of wiggle room so I moved the speaker 6" closer, take a sweep, moved it 6" the other way, 'nother sweep, repeat. Did that until I found a spot that wasn't too out of place and also gained me back just a couple dB. Didn't seem like much but when I ran Audyssey again it did a much better job.
I'm maxxed at 140 so like you said, not much to do there. I'm more concerned about the crossover because, like you said, 200 is really high. At 80 my sub 200hz response looks worse. I'm going to play around a bit more, but I need to get the rear subs done so I don't have to start over after a lot of work.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
It looks like 85 dB is your target? If so you can go through and make some cuts on those high spots and it'll make those dips look a lot better. Sometimes a cut can have positive effects up or downstream too. It can also have deleterious effects too tho, so that's why I only tweak one thing at a time. If you upload multiple adjustments and something goes south you don't know which tweak did what.

This is why I still keep my mini inline. It is so much faster to do a 10 second sweep and make an instant adjustment. No uploading and emailing files back and forth. I like that I have the editor tho, and ratbuddyssey definitely helped and is effective. I just wish it weren't so time consuming. Using it I spend more time staring at a black screen waiting for the upload to finish than I do measuring and adjusting.
I think a mini is in my future. No other way to really get things dialed in.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
I'm maxxed at 140 so like you said, not much to do there. I'm more concerned about the crossover because, like you said, 200 is really high. At 80 my sub 200hz response looks worse. I'm going to play around a bit more, but I need to get the rear subs done so I don't have to start over after a lot of work.
I feel you. The high crossover thing and big nulls were thorns in my side forever. It took a combination of all of the audio wizardry and knowledge I gained here to fix it. It really did. It took measurements, moving the mlp closer, moving that speaker all over the place, room correction and PEQ to tame that beast.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
I think a mini is in my future. No other way to really get things dialed in.
With ratbuddyssey in the picture now I think I can do almost anything with the editor I can do with the mini. It just takes a lot longer.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
I feel you. The high crossover thing and big nulls were thorns in my side forever. It took a combination of all of the audio wizardry and knowledge I gained here to fix it. It really did. It took measurements, moving the mlp closer, moving that speaker all over the place, room correction and PEQ to tame that beast.
Luckily I'm at the "dipping my toes in" phase just to see how everything works now that the fine tuning with audyssey. Now that I've got a better idea, I'll hopefully finish my other two subs and test some more. If there isn't a large improvement, I'll probably be looking at better subs and more locations for placement. I've got a ton of raw drivers and three partially built boxes I haven't had time to finish.

What that gives me is a lot of places to put things, but that's still 5 12" drivers and a 15" that isn't particularly suited for sub duty.

I'm toying with the idea of building two large subs that can dig DEEP and having some midbass modules to help with the above 80hz range.

Got space in the rack for two more amps so expansion is going to happen.

Gonna make some time to get this stuff done. Update my old build thread. Fun stuff.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I think a mini is in my future. No other way to really get things dialed in.
Did you try the procedure I posted? You should be able to flatten the curve within an hour. You should also aim for 75 dB instead of 85 because if that huge dip. I am sure the mini cannot do better than the app if you use Ratbuddyssey.
 

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