Sanity check: Bad Sub ? (REW Sweep results)

TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
Unless I'm misremembering Erin's measurements, the Q 11 Meta's port tuning is 35 hz or so. Their response is dropping like a stone below 30 hz. Feeding them the lfe channel seems pointless and potentially risky.
It could be for movies, but in music there is little content below 30 Hz. I run my rig with all speakers except the ceiling speakers full range. I have never had a problem. I highly doubt his left and right speakers will be damaged though. Minimizing the crossover settings improves the transient response. When I use crossover to all the speakers, it is unquestionably a downgrade. The crossover from the mid lines to the bass lines is acoustic, and the LFE added. After all before this bass management craze we always ran our speakers full range, and I never had a problem, which is most of my life. I run my family room speakers full range and push them hard at times. Mind you, KEF B 139s are really robust and capable speakers. Falcon acoustics are producing them again, and reporting brisk sales. That driver goes back to 1969. I don't think a modern driver of that size, and many that are larger, can compete with them.
 
L

Linwood

Audioholic
...common sense is a much better starting point. Just because it is a fancy program with a name given by an ad. exec, it does not mean it is right by a long shot. So don't slavishly trust them ever.
Thanks. My current mode is first I have to figure out what it is doing before I start undoing anything.
 
L

Linwood

Audioholic
Crossovers:

So I've listened to hours or videos and read a bunch of writeups and I honestly do not know how crossovers work.

Some (and google's AI) say that you set them in the manual section of speaker setup before using Dirac Art, but other indications are the closest you get is using the F Support Low which is a cutoff at which that speaker does not provide "support" (which is the cancellation of standing waves as I understand it), but it is not clear that's the traditional crossover point, and certainly it doesn't indicate it matters where you start.

I listened to one Direct Engineer discuss some related things, like subwoofer phase, and his reaction was "doesn't matter, it will figure it out and do the right thing". Though he did say the support cutoffs needed some attention.

So to the original question: I have no idea how it's set, and whether the setting before you start matters (because it's painful otherwise as I don't know how you get back into that setting if you wanted to change it shot of some kind of reset).

I am starting to understand ART's philosophy, though there's so much contradictory advice out there (e.g. whether or not to let the center support other speakers; the Dirac Engineer seemed to say for all speakers they should provide support unless the speaker is already too close to running out of capacity just to play).

And another mystery to me is that ART is supposed to understand the acoustic structure of the space in the room, where standing waves will interfer or re-inforce so it can act on them at different frequencies, and to do this at different locations -- but there's nothing in the measurements that provide precise location information. Is the space to the left at 2', 3', 1.5'... the system doesn't know. All the measurements seem relative locations, not quantitative distances.
 
Kingnoob

Kingnoob

Audioholic Samurai
It could be for movies, but in music there is little content below 30 Hz. I run my rig with all speakers except the ceiling speakers full range. I have never had a problem. I highly doubt his left and right speakers will be damaged though. Minimizing the crossover settings improves the transient response. When I use crossover to all the speakers, it is unquestionably a downgrade. The crossover from the mid lines to the bass lines is acoustic, and the LFE added. After all before this bass management craze we always ran our speakers full range, and I never had a problem, which is most of my life. I run my family room speakers full range and push them hard at times. Mind you, KEF B 139s are really robust and capable speakers. Falcon acoustics are producing them again, and reporting brisk sales. That driver goes back to 1969. I don't think a modern driver of that size, and many that are larger, can compete with them.
With my avr to to run mains full range, I think I have to select double bass or the sub won’t get that lfe channel the mains are doing ? My icons only go down to 35hz or so I run them at 60. Ancient onkyo.
Dirac Art cost a lot you need a new avr that supports it and multiple subs ?
 
L

Linwood

Audioholic
Dirac Art cost a lot you need a new avr that supports it and multiple subs ?
The Denon x3800h supports it, and getting two SVS PB-1000's, second coming tomorrow.

From a lot of reading and watching I'm convinced (a) I have a terrible room setup but don't intend to fix it, and (b) it does the most to fixing bad rooms. Not that it can be a complete fix.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Crossovers:

So I've listened to hours or videos and read a bunch of writeups and I honestly do not know how crossovers work.

Some (and google's AI) say that you set them in the manual section of speaker setup before using Dirac Art, but other indications are the closest you get is using the F Support Low which is a cutoff at which that speaker does not provide "support" (which is the cancellation of standing waves as I understand it), but it is not clear that's the traditional crossover point, and certainly it doesn't indicate it matters where you start.

I listened to one Direct Engineer discuss some related things, like subwoofer phase, and his reaction was "doesn't matter, it will figure it out and do the right thing". Though he did say the support cutoffs needed some attention.

So to the original question: I have no idea how it's set, and whether the setting before you start matters (because it's painful otherwise as I don't know how you get back into that setting if you wanted to change it shot of some kind of reset).

I am starting to understand ART's philosophy, though there's so much contradictory advice out there (e.g. whether or not to let the center support other speakers; the Dirac Engineer seemed to say for all speakers they should provide support unless the speaker is already too close to running out of capacity just to play).

And another mystery to me is that ART is supposed to understand the acoustic structure of the space in the room, where standing waves will interfer or re-inforce so it can act on them at different frequencies, and to do this at different locations -- but there's nothing in the measurements that provide precise location information. Is the space to the left at 2', 3', 1.5'... the system doesn't know. All the measurements seem relative locations, not quantitative distances.
It's a fairly simple concept, just where high pass filter and low pass filter slopes "cross" so as to create a relatively flat response. Then there are different slopes and approaches to automated setting of ideal crossover (even if slope is limited, so....).
 
Kingnoob

Kingnoob

Audioholic Samurai
The Denon x3800h supports it, and getting two SVS PB-1000's, second coming tomorrow.

From a lot of reading and watching I'm convinced (a) I have a terrible room setup but don't intend to fix it, and (b) it does the most to fixing bad rooms. Not that it can be a complete fix.
yeah I meant it’s not cheap for Dirac Art I can probably get my room sounding good without fancy eq and measurements. Can’t afford a $1500 receiver right now.
Ahh I wish I could get better subs but only able to afford a single if I got one. Would be a mismatch with my other sub. If I could just bring down my larger sub my issues would be solved.
I need a laptop more so but ehh can’t get much for under $600. /700.. might even up going another year.
 
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