Power conditioners

[Bodywonderful]

Serious question, how many people have had audio/video equipment total failure from a power surge? Not being facetious, but I have not personally known anyone who has had this problem since I've been alive (whom has admitted it at any rate). I was wondering how common this is.

 

[Mark E. Long]

Serious question, how many people have had audio/video equipment total failure from a power surge? Not being facetious, but I have not personally known anyone who has had this problem since I've been alive (whom has admitted it at any rate). I was wondering how common this is.

Late last fall double lighting strike on our property took out Two carver TFM-35x 350 watt amps and damaged a third that I took out of service to be on the safe side . They are in the process of being sent away for rebuilds. So yes it does happen.

 

[Bodywonderful]

Late last fall double lighting strike on our property took out Two carver TFM-35x 350 watt amps and damaged a third that I took out of service to be on the safe side . They are in the process of being sent away for rebuilds. So yes it does happen.

Yikes! Sorry to hear that.
Thank you for the response.

 

[Mark E. Long]

Yikes! Sorry to hear that.
Thank you for the response.

Your welcome Sir the whole system is on its own 2-20 amp lines and power centers which I suspect my need replaced as well . The amps were due for rebuild’s anyhow but I never planned to do them all at once lol .

 

[Golfx]

I submitted this post couple of weeks ago.

“I did a deep dive a few months back on surge protection. You will not find “THE” definitive article or forum post on what to buy or use. So “they” (multiple forums or articles) summarized recommendations as whole house surge protection plus added suppressors (non sacrificing) for expensive devices.

I too have 20amp lines and bought zero surge https://zerosurge.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/2R-Series-01-24.pdf.

You can find cheaper ones that ”sacrifice” themselves but unless they smoke you will not know how much protection is still left after a surge.

Zero surge held the original patents which they licensed to brickwall and surgex and others. Seems like a minimal amount of money for protecting expensive AV devices.”

 

[Speedskater]

Late last fall double lighting strike on our property took out Two carver TFM-35x 350 watt amps and damaged a third that I took out of service to be on the safe side

What types of surge protection did your home have? Were the amps the only things that were damaged?

 

[Mark E. Long]

What types of surge protection did your home have? Were the amps the only things that were damaged?

I had or have two monster 1800 HD power centers with every thing hooked to them . Yes strangely yes it was just the amps it did mess with the AVR but a factory reset straightened it up . It was the weirdest thing the storm came up out of nowhere was watching something and lightning hit very close to and they instantly shut it all down it all rebooted just as the amps kicked on with in 5 or so seconds it hit again very close and then one amp I used for surround channels started to hum very loud the one I used for my front mains lost a channel and the one I had on the center keeps cutting a channel out so there toast everything else seems to have survived so far did loose a mid bass driver out of one jbl tower but I have spares for those as there older and it’s wise to at least keep a driver or two around when you can find them . They were do for a refresh as they are from the 90’s . Now iam just useing the AVR to power everything for now thank the gods it was unharmed it sounds ok but I did loose a lot of power and clearity and tons of head room for program material . 3 art 31 band eq’s were unharmed too . My guess is the amps were old enough to not take the surges that close together. The carver tech said they probably went into DC lock and the bias is out of spec what ever that means .

 

[Danzilla31]

Serious question, how many people have had audio/video equipment total failure from a power surge? Not being facetious, but I have not personally known anyone who has had this problem since I've been alive (whom has admitted it at any rate). I was wondering how common this is.

When we had the snowpacalypse here in Texas about 2 years ago it knocked out quiet a few things in my theater because of the rolling blackouts. My processor and some of the subs.

I was stuck at work at my hospital so no one could relieve me for days they couldn't make it in and my mother had a severe medical emergency and the rest of the family was at the hospital with her so noone was at the house to unplug the electronics

Nobody anticipated the grid failure we were going to have due to just snow so I knew when I got home later that week and theater and a lot of other appliances around the house were going to be fried and they were

 

[highfigh]

Serious question, how many people have had audio/video equipment total failure from a power surge? Not being facetious, but I have not personally known anyone who has had this problem since I've been alive (whom has admitted it at any rate). I was wondering how common this is.

I have known many people who said they lost equipment over the decades in AV, but I don't know the condition of the wiring, cabling, grounding, etc- some were from lightning and that's hard to prevent if special measures aren't taken but 'surge' needs to be defined- was it from a neutral lifting, vehicle hitting an on-ground or pole-mounted transformer or distribution point, an animal becoming the load across two hot cables...? We wrote up replacement cost estimats when I worked at the first stereo store- what the customers did with them was their choice but when people made it clear that they were going to do something shady, we refused because we didn't want to be a party to insurance fraud either individually, or as a company.

 

[highfigh]

I had or have two monster 1800 HD power centers with every thing hooked to them . Yes strangely yes it was just the amps it did mess with the AVR but a factory reset straightened it up . It was the weirdest thing the storm came up out of nowhere was watching something and lightning hit very close to and they instantly shut it all down it all rebooted just as the amps kicked on with in 5 or so seconds it hit again very close and then one amp I used for surround channels started to hum very loud the one I used for my front mains lost a channel and the one I had on the center keeps cutting a channel out so there toast everything else seems to have survived so far did loose a mid bass driver out of one jbl tower but I have spares for those as there older and it’s wise to at least keep a driver or two around when you can find them . They were do for a refresh as they are from the 90’s . Now iam just useing the AVR to power everything for now thank the gods it was unharmed it sounds ok but I did loose a lot of power and clearity and tons of head room for program material . 3 art 31 band eq’s were unharmed too . My guess is the amps were old enough to not take the surges that close together. The carver tech said they probably went into DC lock and the bias is out of spec what ever that means .

The manual shows "330 Volts (PLC Outlet-Supression Voltage is 400-500V max. Steady state clamping voltage is 330V"- not great for equipment designed for US powerline voltage of 120VAC. I would like to see what it's doing to the power going to the amplifiers- they don't usually connect to surge protection equipment unless it's specifically DESIGNED for it, as opposed to marked on the outlets.

WRT 'DC Lock'- it would have been good to ask for an explanation.

 

[Mark E. Long]

The manual shows "330 Volts (PLC Outlet-Supression Voltage is 400-500V max. Steady state clamping voltage is 330V"- not great for equipment designed for US powerline voltage of 120VAC. I would like to see what it's doing to the power going to the amplifiers- they don't usually connect to surge protection equipment unless it's specifically DESIGNED for it, as opposed to marked on the outlets.

WRT 'DC Lock'- it would have been good to ask for an explanation.

Further reading on my part is something to do with the voltage rails internally I’ve got no clue what that is either lol . Yes the amps were connected to outlets on the back that are specifically marked for main amps on the back of the units in question . The strikes were with in seconds of each others it was weird as was our weather last summer worst drought I’ve ever seen in my 68 years then in late summer we’d get these wild pop up storms. I swear this storm developed right on us split our maple tree in half first strike and hit a transformer on a pole in our front yard that took out a couple neighbors tvs and a couple Xfinity cable boxes which are trash anyhow and central air units on 3 homes close by . My home is on another pole and transformer than the one that was hit too which probably saved most of this rig . It was weird the first hit they shut down just like they were supposed to then just as everything was cycling back up band it hit again that’s when the whole thing went crazy all the red lights lit up on the units showing it protected what was running but the amps took the hit being they are from the 90’s era older designs I don’t know ‍

 

[highfigh]

Further reading on my part is something to do with the voltage rails internally I’ve got no clue what that is either lol . Yes the amps were connected to outlets on the back that are specifically marked for main amps on the back of the units in question . The strikes were with in seconds of each others it was weird as was our weather last summer worst drought I’ve ever seen in my 68 years then in late summer we’d get these wild pop up storms. I swear this storm developed right on us split our maple tree in half first strike and hit a transformer on a pole in our front yard that took out a couple neighbors tvs and a couple Xfinity cable boxes which are trash anyhow and central air units on 3 homes close by . My home is on another pole and transformer than the one that was hit too which probably saved most of this rig . It was weird the first hit they shut down just like they were supposed to then just as everything was cycling back up band it hit again that’s when the whole thing went crazy all the red lights lit up on the units showing it protected what was running but the amps took the hit being they are from the 90’s era older designs I don’t know ‍♂

I use a Panamax MR4000 because it shuts off below 90VAC and above 140VAC because limiting the line voltage to the equipment decreases the liklihood of damage and it has shut the system off when storms were coming, but no equipment has been damaged. Its reaction time is shown as a couple of nanoseconds but even that short time can cause damage.

If lightning hit the tree & transformer in your yard, the tree strike induced a surge and the transformer strike worked its own magic (more or less, depending on what the power company uses to suppress surges), there's very little you could have done to prevent damage, other than unplug your equipment.

 

[Mark E. Long]

I use a Panamax MR4000 because it shuts off below 90VAC and above 140VAC because limiting the line voltage to the equipment decreases the liklihood of damage and it has shut the system off when storms were coming, but no equipment has been damaged. Its reaction time is shown as a couple of nanoseconds but even that short time can cause damage.

If lightning hit the tree & transformer in your yard, the tree strike induced a surge and the transformer strike worked its own magic (more or less, depending on what the power company uses to suppress surges), there's very little you could have done to prevent damage, other than unplug your equipment.

Iam definitely going to replace the power centers I’ve read there protection is a one and done deal I’ve read but they both seem to be fine but really don’t want to chance them not being right when these amps are back inline . Both protection lights lit up red the second hit my thinking is they should have shut it all down the first hit out back but like you said the Magic definitely did the trick on the transformer hit . Not sure what the power company has or if it does anything . But it will be worth finding out .

 

[TLS Guy]

Serious question, how many people have had audio/video equipment total failure from a power surge? Not being facetious, but I have not personally known anyone who has had this problem since I've been alive (whom has admitted it at any rate). I was wondering how common this is.

We have had quite a few reports over the years. Local electricians are telling me serious problems are no longer rare. I am sure without out my protection with that direct hit I would have had trouble. In storms the line voltage can become very unstable and my UPS units switching to battery is common in bad storms.

My strong advice is to bring your house up to current NEC ASAP.

 

[Golfx]

Iam definitely going to replace the power centers I’ve read there protection is a one and done deal I’ve read but they both seem to be fine but really don’t want to chance them not being right when these amps are back inline . Both protection lights lit up red the second hit my thinking is they should have shut it all down the first hit out back but like you said the Magic definitely did the trick on the transformer hit . Not sure what the power company has or if it does anything . But it will be worth finding out .

You can do a deep dive on reading articles and forums. I did a few months ago. Learned that whole house does suppress majority of spikes but also lets lower level spikes through intentionally. At that point they additionally recommended “non sacrificial” surge suppressors for individual high value electronics. The original patents for non sacrificial suppressors are held by zero surge and licensed out to other companies like brick wall and surgex. I went with zero surge for my 20amp lines. https://zerosurge.com/20-amp-models/

BTW, you can buy much cheaper sacrificial surge suppressors that come with a deceptive replacement guaranty for your high value electronics. But reading real life examples of “how” to get the company to pay were eye opening. They require a licensed fire marshal to sign that a failure of their device allowed the damage to happen. It was intentionally formidable to receive a payment.

Was also warned about other outside pathways in to your equipment such as your internet modem/router connections. Mine are hard wired not WiFi. So proxicast makes lightning sacrificial arrestors that interrupt spikes on your cable line.

 

[highfigh]

Iam definitely going to replace the power centers I’ve read there protection is a one and done deal I’ve read but they both seem to be fine but really don’t want to chance them not being right when these amps are back inline . Both protection lights lit up red the second hit my thinking is they should have shut it all down the first hit out back but like you said the Magic definitely did the trick on the transformer hit . Not sure what the power company has or if it does anything . But it will be worth finding out .

How old are the Monster units? They used to have a $50K (?) warranty if equipment was damaged, but it almost took an act of god to get payment.

 

[highfigh]

The arcing in the video was caused by wind and the voltage between transformers isn't really extremely high- the towers near my house show the line voltage is around 22,600VAC and the cables are separated by at least 6'- someone I knew as a kid climbed one of those towers and was zapped. He lived, but he was badly burned & it really messed him up emotionally. At that voltage, contact isn't actually necessary- if he provided a good enough path to the tower, it was enough.

The distance bridged by lighting can be several miles- the voltage is immense and orders of magnitude higher; even a nearby strike can induce huge surges in the buildings' wiring.

If lights or other devices begin to act strangely, I would recommend checking their outlets and switches- if they were wired by 'back stabbing', the result is usually loss of spring tension in the clips and burning of the wire at the tiny contact area.

Current is conducted well when the contact area or wire gauge is fairly large but in small areas, burning of the metal is common. Back stabbing saves time, but it's a really bad practice and manufacturers of these parts should stop making it possible.

Dangers of Back Stabbing Electrical Outlets

Read about the potential dangers where your electrical outlets can backstab you and cause physical as well as financial harm. Know the solution to it.

asburyelectric.com

 

[Mark E. Long]

How old are the Monster units? They used to have a $50K (?) warranty if equipment was damaged, but it almost took an act of god to get payment.

Hard to say I got both when are local circuit city went belly up bought 2 100.00 bucks apiece and tons of monster cable rca’s several lengths for next to nothing still got some new in box

 

[highfigh]

Hard to say I got both when are local circuit city went belly up bought 2 100.00 bucks apiece and tons of monster cable rca’s several lengths for next to nothing still got some new in box

All surge protectors have a finite life- CC has been gone for a long time, so I would be hard-pressed to trust those.