Please help with designing a box for this amp and these woofers ( :

[isolar8001]

@TLS Guy and @isolar8001 since I find the three of us equally annoying I figured we'd make good friends in real life and I should heed your advice. In truth, I'm thankful you both took the time to write what you did as I can't see anybody using their energy like that unless they really thought I was making the wrong choice. And, remember, I've been out of audio a LONG time, I've never had anything larger than a 12" so I liked the idea of an 18" subwoofer but I had no good reason for that.

I put in a call and email to cancel the HT18 so your opinions were impactful.

This started as me wanting the amp and figuring I could find a cheap 10" Amazon Resale deal for a DIY box. Then I figured I'd move up to a 12" for some added base. I wanted to keep the cost super low but you know how it goes, "for $10 more I can" until the end of time. Realistically, I would like a 12" or a 15" and I have a strong preference for a sealed box. I would also prefer to keep the subwoofer budget to $100, $150 if I'm really stretching. I like deal and value hunting on things like that.

Thoughts?

Thanks also.
TLSGuy is correct. You need to up the budget a bit and build the design he has given you.

The result should be in the vicinity of an 800 dollar or so prebuilt sub...if not better.

Your limiting factor is going to be that Parts Express amp...I have one of their 300 watt BASH plate amps in an old BICF12 sub in my closet. It's kind of weak and surely unsuited to driving a sealed sub to any satisfactory result. It barely drives that very efficient BIC driver/box.

 

[TucsonAZ]

@TLS Guy Happy new year over there! So, been thinking and thinking about this because I really just wanted to keep it all nice and simple and low cost when I started. I also am not doing a ported box but everything you've said makes complete and total sense and I've been listening to you and @isolar8001 on this.

I ended up getting two of the EARTHQUAKE Slaps 10" passive radiators (allows me to put them on opposing sides). This will allow me to run a 12" high extension sub and get some good results and a small enclosure. I have a $120 budget for the subwoofer, any thoughts on which one to get?

 

[TLS Guy]

@TLS Guy Happy new year over there! So, been thinking and thinking about this because I really just wanted to keep it all nice and simple and low cost when I started. I also am not doing a ported box but everything you've said makes complete and total sense and I've been listening to you and @isolar8001 on this.

I ended up getting two of the EARTHQUAKE Slaps 10" passive radiators (allows me to put them on opposing sides). This will allow me to run a 12" high extension sub and get some good results and a small enclosure. I have a $120 budget for the subwoofer, any thoughts on which one to get?

You have bought another nonsense product. A passive radiator just replaces a port. So you have to model a passive radiator design just like a ported one. So you have to model the box the same. The problem for the home constructor is that you can't design and build your passive radiator. With a port you can set the diameter and port length to your design.

If you just build a box buy a driver and slap on one or two passive radiators it is not going to work. Everything has to match PRECISELY or it will not work. Even small errors stop the design working.

Your budget is far too low and you have no clue what you are doing or how a sub works. In short you are an absolute time waster.

 

[NINaudio]

@TLS Guy Happy new year over there! So, been thinking and thinking about this because I really just wanted to keep it all nice and simple and low cost when I started. I also am not doing a ported box but everything you've said makes complete and total sense and I've been listening to you and @isolar8001 on this.

I ended up getting two of the EARTHQUAKE Slaps 10" passive radiators (allows me to put them on opposing sides). This will allow me to run a 12" high extension sub and get some good results and a small enclosure. I have a $120 budget for the subwoofer, any thoughts on which one to get?

I get that you're enthusiastic, but how about you ask in here before you go buying stuff that isn't all that great. Earthquake is in general an absolute crap, bottom of the barrel, brand.

Also, you want your passive radiators to have twice the surface area of your active sub, so two 10" passives would mate with a 10" sub. A 12" sub would require two 12" passive radiators.

 

[NINaudio]

The Dayton sub that TLS is recommending to you has passive radiators that are designed to work with it that you can buy from parts express:

https://www.parts-express.com/Powered-Dayton-Audio-12-with-Dual-Passive-500-Watt-Subwoofer-Kit-with-Built-In-DSP-300-7154?quantity=1

I know that kit includes an amp and the box as well, but if you talk to parts express/look at their website you should be able to get just the sub and passive radiators from them as well as box dimensions, so you can build it yourself that way.

 

[isolar8001]

My God....next we we be hearing about a 24 inch Kraco sub or 10 pairs of Kraco 6 by 9's powered by a 3000 watt Kraco equalizer. ( I actually had a customer do the 6 by 9 thing ! )
Don't overlook Audiovox !

 

[highfigh]

My God....next we we be hearing about a 24 inch Kraco sub or 10 pairs of Kraco 6 by 9's powered by a 3000 watt Kraco equalizer. ( I actually had a customer do the 6 by 9 thing ! )
Don't overlook Audiovox !

You forgot Sparkomatic, which bought Altec-Lansing in 1992.

But since you mentioned Audiovox, I assume you're familiar with VOXX, right? Check the brands.

VOXX International

www.voxxintl.com

 

[isolar8001]

But since you mentioned Audiovox, I assume you're familiar with VOXX, right? Check the brands.

VOXX International

www.voxxintl.com

Audiovox was a cheapy brand like Kraco and Sparkomatic.
Voxx is irrelevant in this instance...why even bring up such a comparison ?

 

[TLS Guy]

The Dayton sub that TLS is recommending to you has passive radiators that are designed to work with it that you can buy from parts express:

https://www.parts-express.com/Powered-Dayton-Audio-12-with-Dual-Passive-500-Watt-Subwoofer-Kit-with-Built-In-DSP-300-7154?quantity=1

I know that kit includes an amp and the box as well, but if you talk to parts express/look at their website you should be able to get just the sub and passive radiators from them as well as box dimensions, so you can build it yourself that way.

This bloke is an especially irritating type of "twot" isn't he?

You only use an ABR when the box is too small for the required port. It still aligns very similar to a ported enclosure. You have to match the mass, compliance, and essentially the T/S parameters of the ABR to the design. In addition ABRs are far more costly than ports. There is one further downside, in that an ABR design rolls off sixth order below F3 which is 36 db per octave rather than 24 db per octave of a port. This gets the guy further away from his goal of deep bass. He can easily cover a port. Port grills are easily obtained on the Net. That should keep his vile crawly reptiles out of his sub.

I think his basic problem is that he can't afford a decent sub even if he builds it. As you all know getting a sub down to 20 Hz is a very costly affair, however you approach it.

 

[NINaudio]

My God....next we we be hearing about a 24 inch Kraco sub or 10 pairs of Kraco 6 by 9's powered by a 3000 watt Kraco equalizer. ( I actually had a customer do the 6 by 9 thing ! )
Don't overlook Audiovox !

Don't forget Pyle either!

 

[isolar8001]

Don't forget Pyle either!

I used to sell Pyle back in the late eighties....they actually had some good products back then.

I'm surprised the OP hasn't mentioned/bought any new Pyle woofers since he keeps bringing up car equipment as home equipment. (which is why I joked about that a few posts ago)

 

[TucsonAZ]

I always had higher end stuff for the home, Cornwall, Forte, Carver, Sunfire, Denon and the list goes on. I'm not cheap on my audio equipment and even in the car last time I had a system I was running Zed Audio. People are going to have different goals and this is just a fun project for me not something I'm taking super seriously. Just trying to add some low end to the KRKs which are about $600 a pair so they're fine for the 3-4 movies I watch a month.

The PRs can be tuned, I know a lot of people haven't used them much and opt for a cheap port to save on money so they don't understand them but you add weight to tune them @TLS Guy. I hate ported enclosures for many reasons and my favorite Klipsch speakers used the same nonsense products, I like the advantages of them.

@NINaudio they need to have move twice the air not twice the surface area, the two 10" Slaps have more than double the air displacement.

Please keep something in mine, I have a lot of costly hobbies, A2, astronomy (I have eyepieces that cost $500), reptiles (my eastern indigos were $2,500), my sim racing rig just cost me $1,300 and sometimes a budget I set is based on a goal other than financial or it's just that I have other areas I want to put my money, like a new F1 wheel for the sim rig.

You've all given a lot of great advise and I've listened to it but you really haven't been willing to problem solve or think outside the box on how to build something that fit my needs without a port. I would honestly rather not have a subwoofer than run the risk of hearing port noise. I think I'll just make the box and see what it sounds like if it's not something any of you think is possible.

@TLS Guy I think you mixed that up, you don't size it and treat it like a ported box you treat it like a sealed box for sizing which is one of the points of the passive radiators if I'm not mistaken.

 

[TLS Guy]

I always had higher end stuff for the home, Cornwall, Forte, Carver, Sunfire, Denon and the list goes on. I'm not cheap on my audio equipment and even in the car last time I had a system I was running Zed Audio. People are going to have different goals and this is just a fun project for me not something I'm taking super seriously. Just trying to add some low end to the KRKs which are about $600 a pair so they're fine for the 3-4 movies I watch a month.

The PRs can be tuned, I know a lot of people haven't used them much and opt for a cheap port to save on money so they don't understand them but you add weight to tune them @TLS Guy. I hate ported enclosures for many reasons and my favorite Klipsch speakers used the same nonsense products, I like the advantages of them.

@NINaudio they need to have move twice the air not twice the surface area, the two 10" Slaps have more than double the air displacement.

Please keep something in mine, I have a lot of costly hobbies, A2, astronomy (I have eyepieces that cost $500), reptiles (my eastern indigos were $2,500), my sim racing rig just cost me $1,300 and sometimes a budget I set is based on a goal other than financial or it's just that I have other areas I want to put my money, like a new F1 wheel for the sim rig.

You've all given a lot of great advise and I've listened to it but you really haven't been willing to problem solve or think outside the box on how to build something that fit my needs without a port. I would honestly rather not have a subwoofer than run the risk of hearing port noise. I think I'll just make the box and see what it sounds like if it's not something any of you think is possible.

@TLS Guy I think you mixed that up, you don't size it and treat it like a ported box you treat it like a sealed box for sizing which is one of the points of the passive radiators if I'm not mistaken.

I did not mix anything up. A passive radiator box is very similar to a ported box. It is a resonant system just like a ported box. You will NOT here any port noise or chuffing with my designs ever. That is because I never let the port velocity go above 20 m/sec, as that keeps the port air velocity linear and NOT turbulent.

 

[TucsonAZ]

@TLS Guy I know you are incredibly fond of your subwoofer and if it wasn't ported I would be all in on it. I don't want a ported subwoofer, I know you couldn't figure out a solution to that issue but I'm thankful for offering and your responses. And, there's always room for us all to learn, I mean, you didn't even know you can tune PRs with weight. I've done a ton more research, (the thing I was hoping to avoid) and found there are a lot of PR fans so I was able to find somebody to help me figure out something based on my needs versus something they already built.

I'm sure your sub is great for a lot of people and a lot of applications but I hate the possibility of chuffing and I hate parasitic noise through the port. I would rather deal with the PR and was only avoiding it due to cost. I'll do some experimenting and see what I think, maybe it sucks, maybe it's great, I'm just going to have fun with it and thankfully there are others curious enough about the outcome to help a little with the design.

Thanks again to all for the help!

 

[TLS Guy]

@TLS Guy I know you are incredibly fond of your subwoofer and if it wasn't ported I would be all in on it. I don't want a ported subwoofer, I know you couldn't figure out a solution to that issue but I'm thankful for offering and your responses. And, there's always room for us all to learn, I mean, you didn't even know you can tune PRs with weight. I've done a ton more research, (the thing I was hoping to avoid) and found there are a lot of PR fans so I was able to find somebody to help me figure out something based on my needs versus something they already built.

I'm sure your sub is great for a lot of people and a lot of applications but I hate the possibility of chuffing and I hate parasitic noise through the port. I would rather deal with the PR and was only avoiding it due to cost. I'll do some experimenting and see what I think, maybe it sucks, maybe it's great, I'm just going to have fun with it and thankfully there are others curious enough about the outcome to help a little with the design.

Thanks again to all for the help!

Of course I knew you could add weight to an ABR, but that is only one of the parameters. Lastly ports on my designs will NEVER EVER chuff and that is by design. So that fear is nonsense.

 

[highfigh]

Audiovox was a cheapy brand like Kraco and Sparkomatic.
Voxx is irrelevant in this instance...why even bring up such a comparison ?

Did you look at the VOXX brands? Doesn't seem so.

I have sold audio since 1978- VERY well aware of what those brands were and could dredge up several other cheapo brand names. My point was that big names were bought by companis that were considered 'crap'.

Is Klipsch irellevant? Voxx International owns them and other brands.

 

[isolar8001]

Did you look at the VOXX brands? Doesn't seem so.

I have sold audio since 1978- VERY well aware of what those brands were and could dredge up several other cheapo brand names. My point was that big names were bought by companis that were considered 'crap'.

Is Klipsch irellevant? Voxx International owns them and other brands.

What on Earth are you going on about ?
Maybe still hungover ?

 

[isolar8001]

Of course I knew you could add weight to an ABR, but that is only one of the parameters. Lastly ports on my designs will NEVER EVER chuff and that is by design. So that fear is nonsense.

Like you have said....this TucsanAZ guy is a "twot"
I'm done with him also.

 

[highfigh]

What on Earth are you going on about ?
Maybe still hungover ?

I don't drink- did someone piss in your Wheaties?

 

[NINaudio]

@NINaudio they need to have move twice the air not twice the surface area, the two 10" Slaps have more than double the air displacement.

Double the air displacement of what? You haven't even chosen a driver yet.

Everyone on here who has done any speaker design knows you can tune PR's by adding/removing weight.