NSW 21" or SI HST 18"?

[cameron paterson]

Would this 21" NSW outperform the SI HST 18" if they were both tuned at 17hz in the proper box for each?

Eminence NSW6021-6 21

Note: This is a Single 6 Ohm driver (the Dual 2 Ohm version is a different product). SPECIFICATIONS 5,000 Watts continuous program power capacity (RMS) 6.0-inch copper voice coil 21.0 mm xmax @ 1/3 gap; 27.3 mm usable excursion @ 2/3 gap 33.6 mm peak excursion (damage point is even higher)...

shop.gsgad.com

Does this subwoofer actually handle 5000 watts RMS?

 

[ryanosaur]

It won't play low. Its a pro driver... it just isn't really built for that. In a Devastator, I've seen models that will have it down to the low 20s, but the output drops as you push it lower, and it requires more and more power to force the excursion necessary.
Will it handle peaks of 5000w. Yes. Not sustained. Max peaks.

I know I've asked this before, but here we are again...

What are you looking to achieve?

 

[lovinthehd]

Eminence shows it slightly differently. If indeed 97dB sensitive does it matter?

 

[ryanosaur]

I was getting it confused with the B&C and LaVoce's that also get used in Devs.
That said, tuning it low greatly changes it's output efficiency where it is strongest.

It is, by all accounts, an absolute beast of a driver... but like the other pro drivers, it has its drawbacks for HT and HiFi Home reproduction. It's all about compromise and what the designer is going for.

The Pro Drivers are best applied for their mid-bass efficiency rather than anything lower. I have seen designs where this has been pushed to a 16Hz tune, but it requires a huge box and the output is far from even. If tuned to 22Hz in a Dev with a stepped horn, it is a very different monster, and will have a pretty impressive output across it's band.

 

[lovinthehd]

As to which sub, I'd rather have the HST-18 plus I like supporting Nick.

 

[ryanosaur]

Here's a sample from RedFives latest design of a stepped Devastator.

It uses the NSW and may be one of his best designs yet.

 

[cameron paterson]

What about the GSG Devastator with the B&C 21" driver? It's 4 ohms so I can get more power to it with a Crown XLS 2500? The B&C 21" gets close to the same SPL as the NSW21 in the Devastator enclosure. Since the B&C sub is 4ohms and the NSW21 is 6ohms the B&C will be louder. Can the B&C handle 2500 watts RMS without a problem? In the Devastator will it dig to 19hz no problem as well?

B&C 21DS115 21

SPECIFICATIONS 3,400 Watts continuous program power capacity (RMS) 116 mm (4.5-inch) split winding copper voice coil 60 mm peak-to-peak excursion before damage 15.6 mm xmax @ 1/3 gap; 20.3 mm usable excursion @ 2/3 gap Neodymium magnet allows a very high force factor and linear excursion Double...

shop.gsgad.com

Here is a link to the SPL for each subwoofer in each enclosure:

PERFORMANCE COMPARISON TABLE

IMPORTANT NOTE: The performance table below is provided to give potential buyers a rough idea of how the various Cabinet/Driver/Amplifier combinations will work. Please don't use this table for comparisons to other performance tables, measured or modeled results, or other manufacturer's...

shop.gsgad.com

 

[Danzilla31]

What about the GSG Devastator with the B&C 21" driver? It's 4 ohms so I can get more power to it with a Crown XLS 2500? The B&C 21" gets close to the same SPL as the NSW21 in the Devastator enclosure. Since the B&C sub is 4ohms and the NSW21 is 6ohms the B&C will be louder. Can the B&C handle 2500 watts RMS without a problem? In the Devastator will it dig to 19hz no problem as well?

B&C 21DS115 21

SPECIFICATIONS 3,400 Watts continuous program power capacity (RMS) 116 mm (4.5-inch) split winding copper voice coil 60 mm peak-to-peak excursion before damage 15.6 mm xmax @ 1/3 gap; 20.3 mm usable excursion @ 2/3 gap Neodymium magnet allows a very high force factor and linear excursion Double...

shop.gsgad.com

Here is a link to the SPL for each subwoofer in each enclosure:

PERFORMANCE COMPARISON TABLE

IMPORTANT NOTE: The performance table below is provided to give potential buyers a rough idea of how the various Cabinet/Driver/Amplifier combinations will work. Please don't use this table for comparisons to other performance tables, measured or modeled results, or other manufacturer's...

shop.gsgad.com

Have you thought about contacting GSG? I have those guys are great. If you tell them your room size intended use and size requirements for the sub they will give great advice on which pack to buy and which driver to use.

If you buy from them they will give you great advice even if your building your own enclosure

 

[cameron paterson]

Just looking at different setups for fun right now I probably won't be building one for awhile. But I want to be ready when I do build one. I will contact GSG as well.

 

[lovinthehd]

Or just get @JasonGSG to comment....

 

[cameron paterson]

What about the B&C 21" subwoofer in the devastator? I like the B&C because its 4ohms instead of 6 or 8ohms. Will the devastator with the B&C perform as well as the HST 18" if both had a 19hz tune?

 

[cameron paterson]

Can the B&C 21" in the devastator box actually compete with the HST 18" at 19hz? Not lower than 19hz but at 19hz. I would think the 18" would win with its extra xmax and being the much heavier of the 2. The 18" is 90 pounds and the B&C 21" is like 36 pounds I think?

 

[cameron paterson]

The NSW 21" says it only digs to 25hz here:

Home

Eminence NSW6021-6 21" Professional Neodymium Tour Grade Subwoofer DriverIf you need more bass, a lot more, then Eminence's NSW6021-6 is the driver for you. This massive 21" professional subwoofer is the ultimate of combination of efficiency and displacement making it one of the highest output...

www.parts-express.com

The B&C 21" says it only digs to 30hz here:

Home

B&C 21DS115-4 21" Professional Neodymium Subwoofer 4 OhmB&C's 21DS115 21" subwoofer is the next evolution in high output subwoofer design. Using a new, longer, four layer aluminum voice coil to produce more energy in the gap, higher sensitivity, lower distortion, and better overall performance...

www.parts-express.com

Can these actually dig to 19hz with authority in a devastator enclosure?

 

[ryanosaur]

The Devs rely on the ported Back Enclosure for thier extension. The lower the tuning of that part of the enclosure, the greater the negative effect on the mid bass output (to a certain extent). If you read the Dev Threads at AVS you will begin to understand the tradeoffs in low tuning vs. mid bass efficiency.

Consider a 6 ohm Driver as being less than a 4 ohm Driver is foolish. You do not take into account the motor strength and excursive capabilities at all.

This information is out there, readily available, if you want to learn about it.

 

[cameron paterson]

The NSW 21" actually weighs 62 pounds right?

 

[lovinthehd]

The NSW 21" actually weighs 62 pounds right?

Not according to the Eminence specs I linked earlier.....that's more than even the shipping weight.

 

[ryanosaur]

What does the weight matter?

You can't judge the quality of a Driver by the items you seem to be fixating on.

 

[cameron paterson]

I just thought bigger motor and higher xmax more output?

 

[ryanosaur]

I just thought bigger motor and higher xmax more output?

Neo vs ferite magnets, depending on what you are looking at and comparing... each will have their own benefits and compromises. The Suspension also plays a part. It is not just the weight of the Driver, or just of the magnets.

 

[cameron paterson]

So will the NSW 21" in the Devastator match or outperform at 20hz the output of my TC Sounds LMS- R Ultra 5400 18" which is tuned at 20hz in an 8ft3 enclosure? I would use my Crown XLS 2500 amp for the NSW which is the amp pushing my TC Sounds 18".