New Dayton B-652 with AMT Tweeter

zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
Looks like Dayton has upgraded their popular (to some) speaker series.
Dayton Audio B652-AIR 6-1/2" Bookshelf Speaker Pair with AMT Tweeter

The woofer still seams to be the same - and same size box - they seem to
have added a resister to the high pass cap.

Looks somewhat interesting - however, I wished they would have upgraded
the woofer as well.

I may still buy them, to toy with them and find another woofer.

In one review, if you reverse the polarity of the tweeter - it will help to take
away that null - that was still there around the 5 khz region
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
I have a pair arriving this afternoon. I've already worked up a fix for the original version with the dome tweeter. I'm guessing PE didn't add a low pass circuit for the woofer (and its absence is the main problem with these speakers) or improve the single-cap tweeter circuit, so I should be able to keep my mod for the woofer and just redo the tweeter circuit. I'll post some measurements this weekend. I couldn't find the review with the tweeter polarity suggestion--the link just took me to the Audioholics home page.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Got the email blast about these too and was curious, but I wasn't really excited about the previous ones enough to pick up a pair even at those prices. Will wait on these ones to see what Dennis has to say about them :)
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
I have a pair arriving this afternoon. I've already worked up a fix for the original version with the dome tweeter. I'm guessing PE didn't add a low pass circuit for the woofer (and its absence is the main problem with these speakers) or improve the single-cap tweeter circuit, so I should be able to keep my mod for the woofer and just redo the tweeter circuit. I'll post some measurements this weekend. I couldn't find the review with the tweeter polarity suggestion--the link just took me to the Audioholics home page.
Here is the link of the subjective review - and look inside
Dayton B652 AIR Review
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
Oops PE was tardy in shipping, so I won't get mine until Monday. That was a good review. Looks like they've fixed the woofer breakup, which would make things a lot easier. I think the main issue is whether the little AMT will have enough low-end extension to mate well with the woofer.
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
Oops PE was tardy in shipping, so I won't get mine until Monday. That was a good review. Looks like they've fixed the woofer breakup, which would make things a lot easier. I think the main issue is whether the little AMT will have enough low-end extension to mate well with the woofer.
Will be waiting for your response next week
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
Will be waiting for your response next week
Well, the PE Air Jordans arrived today. I was very interested to see whether PE had really fixed the woofer breakup by building more inductance into the woofer voice coil, as another reviewer (No Audiophile) had claimed on the link zieglj01 had posted. And, of course, I wanted to see how the new amt tweet sounded and measured. The results were a little frustrating. First, there has been no change to the woofer. It still has a big honking peak at 3900 Hz. Since there's no crossover on the woofer, there's nothing to suppress the ringing breakup mode. As for the new mini AMT tweets--will the real new tweet please stand up? My pairs didn't match at all well. When mated with the woofer, one sample had a huge dip at 5 kHz, which didn't really sort of flatten out until 7 kHz, above which the response was a little ragged but acceptable. The second sample filled in much better, although it was also pretty bumpy. I hate it when that happens, because now I don't know which sample is more representative, and I can't develop a revised crossover that will perform consistently across samples. Despite all this, does the AMT version sound better than the original dome version? A little. The AMT, or at least one of the AMT's, has a bit more output down low, and that tends to distract attention from the woofer peak. But my corrected version of the original sounds much better than either of the stock versions, so I'll probably still with a mod of the original. There's not much bass coming out of the sealed woofer, but it sounds a lot more balanced with a real low pass crossover that provides some baffle step correction. All that said, I suspect a lot of people will be very happy with the new stock AMT version given the price. It's voiced bright, which is exacerbated by the woofer peak, but it doesn't honk at you and sounds pretty darn good on simple program material.
 
N

noaudiophile

Audiophyte
How did you get the peak to show up? I have not seen it with these newer woofers, or maybe I've lost my mojo.

I'm open to any tips I can get to be able to put better information in my reviews.
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
How did you get the peak to show up? I have not seen it with these newer woofers, or maybe I've lost my mojo.

I'm open to any tips I can get to be able to put better information in my reviews.
I think your reviews are great. But my woofers don't measure anything like your results. If you want to send an e-mail to my info@philharmonicaudio.com site, I'll send you my measurements and the response for my modded version of the original.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
zieglj01 - instead of betting on dark horse, why not go with existing proven alternative for the ultra cheap bookshelf - Micca mb42x?
Maybe Dennis could revise the crossover based on these finds here: Micca MB42x Bookshelf Speakers

After some DSP the output looks near ruler flat
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
zieglj01 - instead of betting on dark horse, why not go with existing proven alternative for the ultra cheap bookshelf - Micca mb42x?
Maybe Dennis could revise the crossover based on these finds here: Micca MB42x Bookshelf Speakers

After some DSP the output looks near ruler flat
I know about that review - and have read other reviews - they still look suspect to me.

However I may check them out and see, if they have that thin nasal, congested and boomy sound.
They still look and seem lacking in resolution even with DSP (nothing personal against the reviewer).

I do expect some needed DSP with cheapy below $100 speakers, wherever they come from. However,
I would like one that will sound pretty good straight out of the box - like the Cambridge S30 or the
Pioneer BS22 - And, that tends to be rare.

Maybe, I will buy both and send the loser back - and the winner to Dennis, if he and I can figure out
where I live.:)
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
Looks like it may be quality control problems again.

I was also looking at the Audax tweeter for the regular speaker
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/audax-soft-dome-tweeters/audax-tw010f1-10-mm-polymer-dome-tweeter/

I may have to look at that Monoprice 2-way 5.25 inch speaker now.
I think the stock dome tweeter is acceptable with the right high pass filter. And the Goldwood woofers need a much bigger cabinet. Plus, the cabinet's so cheap, no one is going to be willing to pay what it would cost to buy new drivers. I wish I could post the 652 air's FR, but it's too big for me to upload from my computer given the forum's tight file size limitation.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Means manufacturing process isn't well controlled IMO, and they don't measure the speakers or even sample speakers after they're built. That's why they're cheap :)
 
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