Might be evacuating soon

lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Years follow but are not necessarily similar. I wouldn't be so pessimistic.

Of course, it's very likely that we will eventually have other summers as bad and possibly worse. We might be gone then.

But I am just upset about the future of my great grandchildren. I have four.
I hope I'm wrong but seems we're just facing the beginnings of climate change. Glad I don't have children.
 
-Jim-

-Jim-

Audioholic Chief
BC has had 1,555 Wildfires this year so far- with 17 new ones this week! Wildfires burned 861,267 Ha. or 2,128,237 Acres (about 3,325 Square Miles) with over half in the Kamloops Fire District. There's 243 active fires right now, and the active season typically ends with Fall Rains, as they never can seem to put them all out without help from Mother Nature.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
FWIW we were taken off the level 1 alert status late Aug 31, altho I just noticed that today on a local FB group post :). Really smoky today in any case so still an issue with air quality. Areas closer to the current Gales Fire are still subject to evac levels and large chunks of the forest remain closed.....
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
I hope I'm wrong but seems we're just facing the beginnings of climate change. Glad I don't have children.
But the climate has ALWAYS changed wildly, in irregular cycles. The Thames River froze last in 1815, near the end of The Little Ice Age- that was caused by the Maunder Minimum of solar activity and the Sun is nothing that we can control. Look at solar activity to see how it relates to temperature swings.

However, I'm not saying that humans aren't responsible for many of the changes- let's look at it from various angles:

Animals metabolize food (every one of the billions which are living now), which causes them to lose heat- that, alone, contributes to warming of the atmosphere. Even after death, their decomposition releases heat and Methane (another 'greenhouse gas'). Plant decomposition releases the same and when that's added, it's hard to see how we could reverse the upward temperature trends, unless some kind of external force lends a hand (like decreased Solar activity).

Using fuel to heat anything causes the atmosphere to warm through radiation and CO2 release.

Idiots burning things that don't need to be burned- lots of heat & CO2 release.

Paving roads with asphalt- the difference in temperature on two sides of one street can be more than 10°F, just from the difference between concrete and asphalt paving.

Bad forest and water management are huge problems- people need to accept the fact that they can't control everything when the planet has its own ideas. The only organisms that care about this is humans- the planet heals itself over time, but the problem for humans is that it takes too much time for our survival outlook. Many will survive, even if it reaches truly critical levels because they will have moved to more moderate climate, become self-sufficient & nomadic and live a more more basic life. People need things, so manufacturing isn't likely to stop but they can operate more cleanly.

I watched a documentary with a climate scientist and he said that he's frequently asked how much the CO2 released by volcanoes increases the global temperature- his answer was "Not at all". He didn't offer more than "the dust and smoke clouds block sunlight and actually cool the Earth, but if the idea that CO2 acts like a blanket on the lower atmosphere, I would like to see data, not opinion in light of the fact that Kilauea has been erupting to some degree continuously since 1983. I do know that the average global temperature was lower for two years, just because of Mount Pinatubo but it seems counter-intuitive to think the heat and CO2 didn't matter, especially when more than 50 volcanoes were active at one time, like this year.

We need to let go of the idea that we should constantly live in absolute comfort. If we're cold, we can put on a sweater. If we're hot, take a dip in a cool bath. Cut down on energy use, when possible.

However, wacko politicians need to listen to people who actually understand science before they come up with some cockamamie plan for fixing the climate. For the record, I'm not impressed by the automakers' lack of progress WRT fuel economy and their pandering to people who 'feel the need for speed' on a mass-production basis. If people want more powerful cars and trucks, let them do it on their own time and on their own dime, not through the automakers seeing dollar signs selling cars to idiots whose only criterion for buying muscle cars is "I want it, I can pay for it, so I should have it". People who buy muscle cars, pickups and big SUVs to go to the grocery store and shuttle their kids to school need to go off and pound sand- commuter cars don't need to be bi and powerful, they need to have space for whatever needs to be transported and to get everything/everyone to the destination without getting in the way of everyone else. Mass transit is great, for people who don't need to make several trips in a day while carrying more than an armful of things- that's just not a practical means of travel for a lot of people but it does allow many people to move around at a low cost.
 
Last edited:
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
But the climate has ALWAYS changed wildly, in irregular cycles. The Thames River froze last in 1815, near the end of The Little Ice Age- that was caused by the Maunder Minimum of solar activity and the Sun is nothing that we can control. Look at solar activity to see how it relates to temperature swings.

However, I'm not saying that humans aren't responsible for many of the changes- let's look at it from various angles:

Animals metabolize food (every one of the billions which are living now), which causes them to lose heat- that, alone, contributes to warming of the atmosphere. Even after death, their decomposition releases heat and Methane (another 'greenhouse gas'). Plant decomposition releases the same and when that's added, it's hard to see how we could reverse the upward temperature trends, unless some kind of external force lends a hand (like decreased Solar activity).

Using fuel to heat anything causes the atmosphere to warm through radiation and CO2 release.

Idiots burning things that don't need to be burned- lots of heat & CO2 release.

Paving roads with asphalt- the difference in temperature on two sides of one street can be more than 10°F, just from the difference between concrete and asphalt paving.

Bad forest and water management are huge problems- people need to accept the fact that they can't control everything when the planet has its own ideas. The only organisms that care about this is humans- the planet heals itself over time, but the problem for humans is that it takes too much time for our survival outlook. Many will survive, even if it reaches truly critical levels because they will have moved to more moderate climate, become self-sufficient & nomadic and live a more more basic life. People need things, so manufacturing isn't likely to stop but they can operate more cleanly.

I watched a documentary with a climate scientist and he said that he's frequently asked how much the CO2 released by volcanoes increases the global temperature- his answer was "Not at all". He didn't offer more than "the dust and smoke clouds block sunlight and actually cool the Earth, but if the idea that CO2 acts like a blanket on the lower atmosphere, I would like to see data, not opinion in light of the fact that Kilauea has been erupting to some degree continuously since 1983. I do know that the average global temperature was lower for two years, just because of Mount Pinatubo but it seems counter-intuitive to think the heat and CO2 didn't matter, especially when more than 50 volcanoes were active at one time, like this year.

We need to let go of the idea that we should constantly live in absolute comfort. If we're cold, we can put on a sweater. If we're hot, take a dip in a cool bath. Cut down on energy use, when possible.

However, wacko politicians need to listen to people who actually understand science before they come up with some cockamamie plan for fixing the climate. For the record, I'm not impressed by the automakers' lack of progress WRT fuel economy and their pandering to people who 'feel the need for speed' on a mass-production basis. If people want more powerful cars and trucks, let them do it on their own time and on their own dime, not through the automakers seeing dollar signs selling cars to idiots whose only criterion for buying muscle cars is "I want it, I can pay for it, so I should have it". People who buy muscle cars, pickups and big SUVs to go to the grocery store and shuttle their kids to school need to go off and pound sand- commuter cars don't need to be bi and powerful, they need to have space for whatever needs to be transported and to get everything/everyone to the destination without getting in the way of everyone else. Mass transit is great, for people who don't need to make several trips in a day while carrying more than an armful of things- that's just not a practical means of travel for a lot of people but it does allow many people to move around at a low cost.
Maybe. The natural occurrence vs human thing is somewhat hard to know with certainty due lack of measurements for much of human history. What, you're not for uncontrolled capitalism?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Maybe. The natural occurrence vs human thing is somewhat hard to know with certainty due lack of measurements for much of human history. What, you're not for uncontrolled capitalism?
Not at all. It's one of the reasons people disappoint me- when is it 'enough'?

I don't have a problem with people having a bunch of money, but hoarding it like it's the last gulps of air they'll ever have and not doing something helpful with it pisses me off.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Not at all. It's one of the reasons people disappoint me- when is it 'enough'?

I don't have a problem with people having a bunch of money, but hoarding it like it's the last gulps of air they'll ever have and not doing something helpful with it pisses me off.
Capitalism has no "enough". Witness the desperate attempts by the republicans to discredit anything that interferes with old boy investments....
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Capitalism has no "enough". Witness the desperate attempts by the republicans to discredit anything that interferes with old boy investments....
OK, what's your alternative to Capitalism? Would you prefer that the government own everything and dole out whatever we need, at its whim?

People make the decisions to treat the workers badly, pay executives more than they should and to do all of the things that make people like you hate that economical model and yes, as used, it has flaws.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
OK, what's your alternative to Capitalism? Would you prefer that the government own everything and dole out whatever we need, at its whim?

People make the decisions to treat the workers badly, pay executives more than they should and to do all of the things that make people like you hate that economical model and yes, as used, it has flaws.
It's not a hate thing, but surely has flaws.... Your conclusion is a bit odd tho.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
It's not a hate thing, but surely has flaws.... Your conclusion is a bit odd tho.
You seem to dislike Capitalism strongly (is that better?) but it seems that you blame the economic model/system, rather than the people (unless they happen to be Republican) who abuse and distort it, while I blame the people. That's the reason I mentioned that 'it could be enough'- the model doesn't limit profit, whore-like behavior or anything like that, although some laws are supposed to prohibit monopolies. However, even those laws are interpreted by people (judges and justices) and if they choose to turn a blind eye, the laws fail to do what was intended.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
You seem to dislike Capitalism strongly (is that better?) but it seems that you blame the economic model/system, rather than the people (unless they happen to be Republican) who abuse and distort it, while I blame the people. That's the reason I mentioned that 'it could be enough'- the model doesn't limit profit, whore-like behavior or anything like that, although some laws are supposed to prohibit monopolies. However, even those laws are interpreted by people (judges and justices) and if they choose to turn a blind eye, the laws fail to do what was intended.
Not at all, did well with it myself. It's just broken in a coupla ways. We don't have laws largely for controlling greed, but maybe we should. We haven't been doing much about monopolies for a while....but the conservative bent in the law is somewhat to blame. Like corporate contributions to influence law making/enforcement....
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Not at all, did well with it myself. It's just broken in a coupla ways. We don't have laws largely for controlling greed, but maybe we should. We haven't been doing much about monopolies for a while....but the conservative bent in the law is somewhat to blame. Like corporate contributions to influence law making/enforcement....
It's broken in many ways, but mostly, the people abusing it are allowed to get away with it. However, that's not inherent in the system (not intentionally quoting a Monty Python line), IMO.

The freedom allowed in any system will eventually be abused and if someone were to look, rather than assume, they would see that it's not only the "other side" who are guilty. The saying "Money has no conscience' is very true.

How's your area WRT the fires? Any updates?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Yeah, the abusers basically run the system, tho :) We're just smoky. Altho at the moment not as horrible as it could be (AQI in the 170-200 range now)
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
It's raining! Not likely enough to make a lot of difference on the Gales Fire, but could well help the mop up operations on the Kwis fire, hopefully will make a difference in smoke for a while.....but what a sweet smell and awesome sound it is....for the moment :)
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Well, this year not so lucky....got forced out Friday evening with a level 3 evacuation order for the populated areas here (Oakridge/Westfir....this time due the Cedar Creek Fire, a much larger fire than the Kwis last year). Returned this afternoon after a change in winds back to westerly and some rain and power restoration (easterly winds caused the fire to get within a coupla klicks, causing the evacuation as well as a shut down of power from the utility). Hopefully winds won't change....air's pretty good right now but was 500+ when I left....
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Well, this year not so lucky....got forced out Friday evening with a level 3 evacuation order for the populated areas here (Oakridge/Westfir....this time due the Cedar Creek Fire, a much larger fire than the Kwis last year). Returned this afternoon after a change in winds back to westerly and some rain and power restoration (easterly winds caused the fire to get within a coupla klicks, causing the evacuation as well as a shut down of power from the utility). Hopefully winds won't change....air's pretty good right now but was 500+ when I left....
Lets hope the wind does not shift again. I had a look on a local news station. Pictures show a bad fire. We have had a lot of smoky skies of late. A couple of days ago, we had a stay indoors alert, which is unusual for us. The smoke has been high altitude today, and air quality at ground level is OK. I understand air quality has been a concern as far East from you as Bismarck ND. Where did you evacuate to?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Lets hope the wind does not shift again. I had a look on a local news station. Pictures show a bad fire. We have had a lot of smoky skies of late. A couple of days ago, we had a stay indoors alert, which is unusual for us. The smoke has been high altitude today, and air quality at ground level is OK. I understand air quality has been a concern as far East from you as Bismarck ND. Where did you evacuate to?
Me too!

It wasn't such a bad fire first coupla weeks but just got a lot bigger quite recently, especially as it was wind aggravated. Even formed it's own cumulonimbus cloud and lightning storm on Saturday. Here's one way to look at it, and there are several good Facebook sites with details https://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/8307/

Oh, and my sister lives in Eugene, about 40 miles west of here, but was smoky somewhat there too....
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Spartan
Well, this year not so lucky....got forced out Friday evening with a level 3 evacuation order for the populated areas here (Oakridge/Westfir....this time due the Cedar Creek Fire, a much larger fire than the Kwis last year). Returned this afternoon after a change in winds back to westerly and some rain and power restoration (easterly winds caused the fire to get within a coupla klicks, causing the evacuation as well as a shut down of power from the utility). Hopefully winds won't change....air's pretty good right now but was 500+ when I left....
Damn Lovin that sucks hope everything works out okay
 

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