Main speaker as center

[Sef_Makaro]

Man your wife just recieved the coolest wife award ever award. I'm single so I just get to do what I want but that is usually not the answer most of the fellas get from there wives sometimes Lol

Yeah, she’s awesome. I think she just knows me well enough to know that if I’m disappointed with something I bought I’m going to buy something else anyway. May as well skip a step.

 

[Danzilla31]

Haha, that’s more or less my plan. Each upgrade for the main system means a hand-me-down upgrade for the second!

That's one heck of a downgrade!

 

[Danzilla31]

That's one heck of a downgrade!

My secondary bedroom system is going to be jealous of your second system!

 

[CWM]

Almost all set

 

[Danzilla31]

Almost all set

Woooohoooo diggity look in seexxxyyy! How does it sound? Putting a tower as my center channel made quiet the difference let me tell ya!

 

[Danzilla31]

It all depends on the height of the towers. Main speakers don't necessarily have to be towers.

For example, my main speakers are less than 35" tall and they're on casters:View attachment 28225

Hey I've been meaning to tell you I love your setup! And I love how you converted a front table into your equipment rack! Very clever and very slick!

Thank goodness for pro amps eh? Just try cramming some classic AB amps in that spot!

 

[CWM]

I apsalutly love the sound. I have all monitor 70s. But decided to drop center to 60. Figure the 4" lower stance would be nice. And I decided to keep the subs matching using the psw505. Just makes my OCD happy. Sounds nasty.

 

[Sef_Makaro]

Almost all set

It’s looking good!

I gave up the surround back speakers from the main system for Zone 3 in my wife’s craft room. Win/win, she gets good sound that can sync with the main zone and I get to replace those speakers with the angled elevation speakers.

 

[rgbbhat72]

the Centre is generally horizontal while the Floor standers are Vertical. Would that create any significant difference.
Also , If I have a floor standing speaker laying horizontal due to lack of space , would it be advisable.
Thanks

 

[Sef_Makaro]

the Centre is generally horizontal while the Floor standers are Vertical. Would that create any significant difference.
Also , If I have a floor standing speaker laying horizontal due to lack of space , would it be advisable.
Thanks

If I understand it correctly, the issue with a horizontal center speaker tends to be the orientation of the drivers and size of the cabinet. A MTM (midrange-tweeter-midrange) center can cause lobing that our ears are more sensitive to from left to right than top to bottom. Some brands have different layouts that help with that. I have a horizontal center in my second system that uses the WMTMW. The mid and tweet are stacked vertically between the woofers. Since the mid and tweeter are not on the same axis as the woofers problem with MTM is minimized.

That said, not everyone hears it. I had acoustic issues with my room when I first got a horizontal center. I swapped it for a tower and the sound improved but not as much as I had hoped. After fixing the room a bit and learning how to level match and tune settings better I got it sounding pretty good. I swapped in the center from my other system and it sounds just fine now.

 

[rgbbhat72]

If I understand it correctly, the issue with a horizontal center speaker tends to be the orientation of the drivers and size of the cabinet. A MTM (midrange-tweeter-midrange) center can cause lobing that our ears are more sensitive to from left to right than top to bottom. Some brands have different layouts that help with that. I have a horizontal center in my second system that uses the WMTMW. The mid and tweet are stacked vertically between the woofers. Since the mid and tweeter are not on the same axis as the woofers problem with MTM is minimized.

That said, not everyone hears it. I had acoustic issues with my room when I first got a horizontal center. I swapped it for a tower and the sound improved but not as much as I had hoped. After fixing the room a bit and learning how to level match and tune settings better I got it sounding pretty good. I swapped in the center from my other system and it sounds just fine now.

Thank you . I think experimentation is the only solution. I have the B&W 603s 2018 version and Polk CS10 as the centre.

 

[Sef_Makaro]

Thank you . I think experimentation is the only solution. I have the B&W 603s 2018 version and Polk CS10 as the centre.

True. I’m not familiar with your B&W speakers, is there a matched center for those? You may benefit from swapping out the Polk if there is. Speakers within a series are typically tonally matched so sound is consistent from speaker to speaker.

At the end of the day though, if it sounds good to you, it sounds good.

Edit- If I found the right series it looks like there is a matching center and it a “nested” MTM. The tweeter is set higher than the mids so it’s not on the same axis.

 

[Danzilla31]

True. I’m not familiar with your B&W speakers, is there a matched center for those? You may benefit from swapping out the Polk if there is. Speakers within a series are typically tonally matched so sound is consistent from speaker to speaker.

At the end of the day though, if it sounds good to you, it sounds good.

Edit- If I found the right series it looks like there is a matching center and it a “nested” MTM. The tweeter is set higher than the mids so it’s not on the same axis.

Generally a vertical identical tower in the center is considered best but is nowhere near practical for most of us

Your advice on room treatments room eq channel level adjustments were great and spot on for when you can't have that third tower and need to make a center speaker work better

Also great advice on MTM vs WMTMW centers is spot on MTM centers as a rule can be more problematic then there counterparts

But your best advice was with telling him to go with your ears. Great call bro sometimes we have to make compromises in real world situations and although we apply the science as best we can in the end how the sound makes us feel is the final judge only our ears can know that and sometimes you gotta go outside the box to get there

 

[Danzilla31]

the Centre is generally horizontal while the Floor standers are Vertical. Would that create any significant difference.
Also , If I have a floor standing speaker laying horizontal due to lack of space , would it be advisable.
Thanks

The only reason centers are horizontal is due to most of us being unable to fit towers under the TV.

But they have come along way in making them and there's a lot we've learned we can do with eq room treatments etc to make them work better these days

Don't put a vertical tower on its side tho
They weren't designed to be used that way and it will just make things worse

I sold my 3 Polk S60's towers when I moved up my journey and one guy that wanted to buy them wanted to know if he could turn one of them on there side in some kind of cabinet for a special center channel

I told him I would refuse to sell them to him under any circumstances if I knew my Polks were going to be treated in such a manner! Lol

Despite there limitations they served me well and they deserved a far better fate then treatment such as that

 

[ryanosaur]

Indeed: don't play with speaker orientation. A good designer/builder will make certain that all the issues of baffles and diffraction are dealt with to the best of their abilities! Turning a vertical speaker sideways can create suck-outs where you will lose significant SPL due to cancellations from that diffraction. Good center channels designed for horizontal use should be OK, but if you have the space, a like tower or standmount, matched to voice cortectly with your L/R channels is ideal.

This review by @shadyJ shows the difference in using an MTM speaker horizontal vs vertical... very informative to see the effects of orientation!

Going back to that point... definitely consider looking into a matching center speaker for your rig. @rgbbhat72, I don't want you to spend more money, but if you are more into HT than Audio, consider that that center channel is the anchor for a surround rig, and that the front soundstage is engineered for a cohesive sound. If you have two different Sound Qualities as sound is traveling left-right, you will inevitably be losing some of the impact properly matched speakers can deliver.

 

[rgbbhat72]

Indeed: don't play with speaker orientation. A good designer/builder will make certain that all the issues of baffles and diffraction are dealt with to the best of their abilities! Turning a vertical speaker sideways can create suck-outs where you will lose significant SPL due to cancellations from that diffraction. Good center channels designed for horizontal use should be OK, but if you have the space, a like tower or standmount, matched to voice cortectly with your L/R channels is ideal.

This review by @shadyJ shows the difference in using an MTM speaker horizontal vs vertical... very informative to see the effects of orientation!

Going back to that point... definitely consider looking into a matching center speaker for your rig. @rgbbhat72, I don't want you to spend more money, but if you are more into HT than Audio, consider that that center channel is the anchor for a surround rig, and that the front soundstage is engineered for a cohesive sound. If you have two different Sound Qualities as sound is traveling left-right, you will inevitably be losing some of the impact properly matched speakers can deliver.

Thank you Ryanosaur for watching out for my wallet . Definitely more HT than music . I will look out for a used B&W center. Hopefully that should help.
@Danzilla31 - I too had the Polk S60s and traded them for the B&W, which sound so good. Each day is a revelation.

 

[ryanosaur]

Thank you Ryanosaur for watching out for my wallet . Definitely more HT than music . I will look out for a used B&W center. Hopefully that should help.
@Danzilla31 - I too had the Polk S60s and traded them for the B&W, which sound so good. Each day is a revelation.

Dunno if its the same drivers:
https://www.ebay.com/p/B-W-Lcr600-S3-Center-Channel-Speaker-Lcr-600s3/28019000473?iid=264165590512&chn=ps
MTM can be stood upright like in that review. Dunno if thats a match or not, but...

 

[Danzilla31]

Thank you Ryanosaur for watching out for my wallet . Definitely more HT than music . I will look out for a used B&W center. Hopefully that should help.
@Danzilla31 - I too had the Polk S60s and traded them for the B&W, which sound so good. Each day is a revelation.

Hah! Isn't this journey great! Those S60's were a lot of fun weren't they? Definetly got me started on the journey of wanting more!

 

[Sef_Makaro]

Hah! Isn't this journey great! Those S60's were a lot of fun weren't they? Definetly got me started on the journey of wanting more!

It’s kinda fun to think back on our older equipment. My first good speakers were Marantz 3 way towers. With the 3 way adjustable EQ built into the speaker, paired with a Yamaha stereo with a wood case lol. Had some Infiniti’s after that. Got sold on Bose.....not what I was looking for. Went and got a set of Polk TSI towers with the cs10 center and a psw110. Now I’ve got all SVS stuff, feel like I’ve barely got my feet wet.

 

[JerryLove]

Generally a vertical identical tower in the center is considered best but is nowhere near practical for most of us

At the risk of being pedantic: an identical speaker. Three bookshelves are as good as three towers.