Dream Speakers Under $6,000 Retail

[GranteedEV]

I would put these passive woofers against anything;

Actually I lied, that speaker uses active crossovers between the 10" midwoofer and 18" woofer. I just wanted to post the pic.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yeah, I guess 18" active subwoofers, assuming at least the same or more internal volume, should produce more bass than the 14" and 10" active subs.

Kind of ugly, though, ain't it?

 

[Nuance AH]

What on earth is that, GranteedEV?

 

[lsiberian]

In terms of bass output and extension, there is no way any passive woofers will compete with the active subwoofers

I'm not following you. What do you mean by a passive woofer? My subwoofer is technically passive and I'm pretty sure would outperform a super cube.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'm not following you. What do you mean by a passive woofer? My subwoofer is technically passive and I'm pretty sure would outperform a super cube.

I mean those passive woofers inside towers like Paradigm Studio 100, S8, PSB Synchrony One, KEF Reference 207/2, Klipsch Palladium, B&W 800D, Salon2, Salk Soundscape, Philharmonic, Orion, etc.

I was not referring to dedicated subwoofers, passive or active. Just the woofers inside the towers.

 

[Hocky]

I mean those passive woofers inside towers like Paradigm Studio 100, S8, PSB Synchrony One, KEF Reference 207/2, Klipsch Palladium, B&W 800D, Salon2, Salk Soundscape, Philharmonic, Orion, etc.

I was not referring to dedicated subwoofers, passive or active. Just the woofers inside the towers.

There are definitely passive woofer tower speakers out there that will outperform that combo in both extension and output. Actually, 2 of your favorite speaker companies immediately pop into my mind: Wilson and Zu. Of course, they are expensive solutions, but it's just money.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

There are definitely passive woofer tower speakers out there that will outperform that combo in both extension and output. Actually, 2 of your favorite speaker companies immediately pop into my mind: Wilson and Zu. Of course, they are expensive solutions, but it's just money.

I don't believe it. Why? Because with active subwoofers inside the towers, you can actually turn UP the dual 14" 1800watt Active subwoofer levels independently and make them HOT if you want. Like make the bass 10dB hotter then the rest of the sound.

You cannot do that with passive woofers inside the towers! You cannot independently increase or decrease the subwoofer level with the passive woofers inside the towers.

 

[GranteedEV]

I don't believe it. Why? Because with active subwoofers inside the towers, you can actually turn UP the dual 14" 1800watt Active subwoofer levels independently and make them HOT if you want. Like make the bass 10dB hotter then the rest of the sound.

You cannot do that with passive woofers inside the towers! You cannot independently increase or decrease the subwoofer level with the passive woofers inside the towers.

Sure ya can. All you need is an outbound amp + shelving EQ filter, and you can do it with more precision too. You can probably do it with receivers and their graphical filters, but not with the same level of results (although probably still as good as "turning up the sub volume".

 

[Hocky]

I don't believe it. Why? Because with active subwoofers inside the towers, you can actually turn UP the dual 14" 1800watt Active subwoofer levels independently and make them HOT if you want. Like make the bass 10dB hotter then the rest of the sound.

You cannot do that with passive woofers inside the towers! You cannot independently increase or decrease the subwoofer level with the passive woofers inside the towers.

Nearly all quality speakers offer bi/tri-wiring. You can turn them up to the moon.

 

[PENG]

I don't believe it. Why? Because with active subwoofers inside the towers, you can actually turn UP the dual 14" 1800watt Active subwoofer levels independently and make them HOT if you want. Like make the bass 10dB hotter then the rest of the sound.

You cannot do that with passive woofers inside the towers! You cannot independently increase or decrease the subwoofer level with the passive woofers inside the towers.

Zumbo is doing it (MB Quarts?) with his old school Denon amps.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Nearly all quality speakers offer bi/tri-wiring. You can turn them up to the moon.

Sure ya can. All you need is an outbound amp + shelving EQ filter, and you can do it with more precision too. You can probably do it with receivers and their graphical filters, but not with the same level of results (although probably still as good as "turning up the sub volume".

Won't equalizing a passive woofer in a tower mess up the overall SQ. Like messing up the rest of the off-axis FR?

Passively bi/tri-amping won't do much good. We all know about passive bi-amping, right?

You can turn up the bass EQ of the passive bi-wire Salon2 or Soundscape 12 or the tri-wire KEF 207/2 to the moon or sun, but they will not output as much bass as a pair of BP7000SC with two 1800watts active 14" subwoofers and four 14" passive radiators.

 

[PENG]

Passively bi/tri-amping won't do much good. We all know about passive bi-amping, right?

I hope you are not among those who easily go with hearsays for facts..

 

[Nuance AH]

You can turn up the bass EQ of the passive bi-wire Salon2 or Soundscape 12 or the tri-wire KEF 207/2 to the moon or sun, but they will not output as much bass as a pair of BP7000SC with two 1800watts active 14" subwoofers and four 14" passive radiators.

Quality over quantity my friend. Are you telling me the bass is more accurate through the Def Techs than the Revels or SoundScapes? And are you actually going to need more bass than what the SoundScapes provide? Actually, I would pit the woofers in the Soundscapes against the ones in the Def Techs. Those AE drivers are pretty awesome, and the designer used to work for TC Sounds if I remember correctly. Bring it on!

 

[cpp]

Are you telling me the bass is more accurate through the Def Techs than the Revels or SoundScapes?

of course he is

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I hope you are not among those who easily go with hearsays for facts..

Oh, I'm just as guilty as anyone regarding passive bi-amping and tri-amping and buying Kimber Kable and all that. At one point I had 4 Acurus 200X3 3Ch amps just for bi/tri-amping. And I certainly can't tell one bit of difference. I did not try to bi-amp the Salon2 or tri-amp the 201/2 though.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Quality over quantity my friend. Are you telling me the bass is more accurate through the Def Techs than the Revels or SoundScapes? And are you actually going to need more bass than what the SoundScapes provide? Actually, I would pit the woofers in the Soundscapes against the ones in the Def Techs. Those AE drivers are pretty awesome, and the designer used to work for TC Sounds if I remember correctly. Bring it on!

I would say the bass in the Salon2, Soundscape, KEF 207/2, & Orion, are tighter (Q=0.5) and have less distortion. Of course. Fact of life. Carved in stone.

But as you say, the quantity is more in the BP7001SC. And the "quality" is pretty good, but not good as the other speakers, which is expected with the price difference.

And whether we need more bass is dependent on our preferences. Some guys and girls prefer crazy amount of bass. And as Brian (Rythmik) pointed out, some folks just prefer a bass with Q above 1.0, instead of 0.5. Some consider the higher-Q bass more fun.

I think it's mood dependent and music dependent.

For example, I prefer the bass in the BP7000SC for the song "Billie Jean" over the Salon2. The BP7000SC produce that party fun chest thumping bass in your face.

Other times, especially for more serious mood, I prefer the bass of the Salon2.

But hey, everyone is quite different, and that is quite A OK.

But bottom line, as you say, quantity vs "quality". An engineering compromise.

Take home message, hell yes I would rather have the Salon2, Orion, Soundscape.

But those BP7000SC speakers are pretty darn good.

Will someone please help he out here?

Gotta go, good night.

 

[PENG]

Oh, I'm just as guilty as anyone regarding passive bi-amping and tri-amping and buying Kimber Kable and all that. At one point I had 4 Acurus 200X3 3Ch amps just for bi/tri-amping. And I certainly can't tell one bit of difference. I did not try to bi-amp the Salon2 or tri-amp the 201/2 though.

I am not saying you should hear one bit of difference or not. I am saying those who project themselves as experts and like to talk about how passive biamp being useless and that active biamp is useful are mostly hearsayers, not that they have tried or really understand the electrical theories behind either schemes. To understand the theories involved one does have to have a strong math & science background, do a lot of self studies on the topic, or go get an EE degree in university first. Sorry, you know I don't usually like being blunt but sometimes I get passionate about certain things.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

of course he is

I ain't that brave, brotha.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I am not saying you should hear one bit of difference or not. I am saying those who project themselves as experts and like to talk about how passive biamp being useless and that active biamp is useful are mostly hearsayers, not that they have tried or really understand the electrical theories behind either schemes. To understand the theories involved one does have to have a strong math & science background, do a lot of self studies on the topic, or go get an EE degree in university first. Sorry, you know I don't usually like being blunt but sometimes I get passionate about certain things.

You and DenPureSound like to quiz me on some calculus and physics or something?

He's been sending me engineering equations all day!

 

[PENG]

You and DenPureSound like to quiz me on some calculus and physics or something?

He's been sending me engineering equations all day!

Don't worry, I will not do that to you.