DO NOT BUY anything from AV123

[cschang]

OK...so that obviously leads to the next question...How much time do you give him?

I have an interesting story. I have a friend(I'll change their names...so lets call this friend Sherry) that loaned another friend(Michelle) a little over $100K to help her finish building her dream house. The friend building the house has refused to repay the loan for various reasons, and because of the housing market here in California, she has also taken a loss on the house she built. These two were the best of friends, and part of my circle of friends.

Finally, the two of them went to court to get this settled, and the judge ordered repayment, around $3K a month even though it was shown that Michelle could not make that payment. Us, in the circle of friends, have all stayed away from the matter when talking to them....we all think it was dumb for Sherry to loan the money to Michelle, but also think Michelle needs to repay the loan.

I see the some of the same things happening here....but it wasn't a loan.

 

[Chu Gai]

It shouldn't be much longer, Curtis. He's been silent because he's meeting with Kanye West and getting prepped on how to give good apology speeches. He'll then go on Larry King, Letterman, and all the late night shows. I can't confirm if he'll also go on the Rachel Madow Show and Fox News.

 

[cschang]

It shouldn't be much longer, Curtis. He's been silent because he's meeting with Kanye West and getting prepped on how to give good apology speeches. He'll then go on Larry King, Letterman, and all the late night shows. I can't confirm if he'll also go on the Rachel Madow Show and Fox News.

HA....yeah....you will now get people bashing you for liking him to Kanye.

For me, one of the biggest issues I have with folks that are saying some us are being unfair to Schifty, and that he will "speak up" in time, is that he should not be given that luxury until he acknowledges and sets a timeframe/plan. He certainly wasn't fair in his wrong doings.

 

[Mac11700]

OK...so that obviously leads to the next question...How much time do you give him?

I have an interesting story. I have a friend(I'll change their names...so lets call this friend Sherry) that loaned another friend(Michelle) a little over $100K to help her finish building her dream house. The friend building the house has refused to repay the loan for various reasons, and because of the housing market here in California, she has also taken a loss on the house she built. These two were the best of friends, and part of my circle of friends.

Finally, the two of them went to court to get this settled, and the judge ordered repayment, around $3K a month even though it was shown that Michelle could not make that payment. Us, in the circle of friends, have all stayed away from the matter when talking to them....we all think it was dumb for Sherry to loan the money to Michelle, but also think Michelle needs to repay the loan.

I see the some of the same things happening here....but it wasn't a loan.

For me, one of the biggest issues I have with folks that are saying some us are being unfair to Schifty, and that he will "speak up" in time, is that he should not be given that luxury until he acknowledges and sets a timeframe/plan. He certainly wasn't fair in his wrong doings.

So..your trying to pin me down for a date..To do what..start my own speculating..publicly condemning the man..what..? I thought I answered this already here..

I have no problem of people speaking up Curtis..when they have been wronged..provided what they saying is actual facts..not something that is based on second/third/fourth hand information....and what they are saying is truthful..Are you saying it is right to do otherwise?

Mac

 

[Adam]

It shouldn't be much longer, Curtis. He's been silent because he's meeting with Kanye West...

I can hear Kanye now. "Yo, Mark. I’m really happy for you; I’mma let you finish. But Madoff had one of the best scams of all time! One of the best scams of all time!"

 

[cschang]

So..your trying to pin me down for a date..To do what..start my own speculating..publicly condemning the man..what..? I thought I answered this already here..

I have no problem of people speaking up Curtis..when they have been wronged..provided what they saying is actual facts..not something that is based on second/third/fourth hand information....and what they are saying is truthful..Are you saying it is right to do otherwise?

Mac

You are the one that wants to give him the luxury of time, correct? Aren't you also speculating that he will eventually own up to the issues and take care of them? You are already speculating in his favor by your wanting to give him time and thinking he will eventually address the issues.

I am just looking at the facts....so lets take all that other stuff out of your equation. For the sake of argument, lets just keep it to the money that should be directed to Sloan/Kettering.

 

[Mac11700]

You are the one that wants to give him the luxury of time, correct? Aren't you also speculating that he will eventually own up to the issues and take care of them? You are already speculating in his favor by your wanting to give him time and thinking he will eventually address the issues.

I am just looking at the facts....so lets take all that other stuff out of your equation. For the sake of argument, lets just keep it to the money that should be directed to Sloan/Kettering.

I said up front Curtis I didn't know when he would..so..I guess you are correct..this is since I don't know when or where he will post about it..

If you want all the facts..call and speak to the man directly and get them him..After all..isn't better to get it from the sources than any other place..This way you have both sides of any issue and can make a honest decision based on that..with out all the other stuff being there,you still know to get in touch with him don't you..? Other than that..since I have no concrete answers about Mark for you or anyone else,I will bow out of any further posting on the subject..Have a nice day..

Mac

 

[cschang]

I said up front Curtis I didn't know when he would..so..I guess you are correct..this is since I don't know when or where he will post about it..

If you want all the facts..call and speak to the man directly and get them him..After all..isn't better to get it from the sources than any other place..This way you have both sides of any issue and can make a honest decision based on that..with out all the other stuff being there,you still know to get in touch with him don't you..? Other than that..since I have no concrete answers about Mark for you or anyone else,I will bow out of any further posting on the subject..Have a nice day..

Mac

You see, this whole idea of speculating goes both ways. What first hand information do you have, or have tried to obtain?

Mac...when you spoke to him on the phone, he didn't give you any reasons? How did you distinguish fact from fiction? Has he given you any reason on why he lied to you?

MLS knows how to get in touch with me, Sloan/Kettering, and David Fabrikant to "explain" his side of the story, but hasn't. Gonk has contacted him directly, and it doesn't appear he has gotten any facts to the issues. Gonk has the thread on AV123, and yet, we haven't seen any direct response to questions or any facts.

 

[Soundman]

I'm working on something with Chu to help shed some light on av123's sales numbers. Alot that has been posted is speculation, I know. But we do know that this information is a big part of the future of the company and right now it looks pretty grim. I'll try to post something once I can verify this information.

 

[Chu Gai]

Soundman's doing all the work though. I just sit on my fat *** and make suggestions.

 

[gonk]

And it seems that AV123 still dislikes hearing difficult questions. The thread is intact, but it is now locked. It moved away from its original intent - so no more of that. And the wait continues...

 

[Soundman]

Soundman's doing all the work though. I just sit on my fat *** and make suggestions.

lol.......

 

[SnowmaNick]

I was going to post this at av123's forum but as that thread is closed now rolleyes I would like to post my answer here.

Techfan asked a good question.

"I have one simple question: what answer will satisfy you? From what I have read Mark has very openly admitted that funds did not make it to where they should have and he is working to rectify the situation. I don't intend to indict or defend the actions that got things to this point, but now that we are here it is going to take some time to make things right. If some reasonable amount of time passes and no progress is seen, maybe that will be the time to ask more questions. Just a thought...and one that will likely be quickly dismissed.

Randy"

I'll be honest here (and that will probably come across as me being that guy but oh well).

What would satisfy me would be:

A) Full restitution to the raffle recipients discussed, plus interest from the time the money was to be paid out. Verified by an independent 3rd party auditor.

B) Verification from a 3rd party auditor that all other raffles have been paid on time and in full. If not then the same terms as those discussed above.

C) Verification that all requests for refunds for: prepaid, in development or unshipped goods have been paid.

D) A public apology from AV123 regarding their specific role in the raffles and the diversion of funds.

E) MLS to step down from AV123 (the part that probably will make me "that guy").

I find it unacceptable that an employee of a company can steal from their customers and charities in the companies name and remain in their position.

F) The proper authorities to investigate to what degree any laws may have been broken and to take the appropriate actions as specified by law including any injunctions and damages the court finds appropriate.


I think that would about do it for me. I have a hunch I am not alone in what I would like to see happen.

There is a chance that a 3rd party audit would exonerate MLS/AV123 from any wrongdoing, but considering MLS has admitted that some raffles were "underfunded" and that it does not appear that the raffles were conducted in a legal manner to begin with, that appears to be a lot harder to prove.

 

[Soundman]

And it seems that AV123 still dislikes hearing difficult questions. The thread is intact, but it is now locked. It moved away from its original intent - so no more of that. And the wait continues...

oh, man....Well, you gave it your best. What I saw was impressive.

 

[Chu Gai]

And it seems that AV123 still dislikes hearing difficult questions. The thread is intact, but it is now locked. It moved away from its original intent - so no more of that. And the wait continues...

Someone or some people have violated Article 58, Criminal Code of the RSFSR. I haven't checked with Vladamir, but according to reliable sources in Khabarovsk, it seems to me that there are multiple violations such as,

• 58-1: "counterrevolutionary" defined
• 58-1a: traitors to the motherland (including defectors)
• 58-3: abettors of the enemy
• 58-4: agents of the international bourgeoisie (eg emigres)
• 58-5: inciting a foreign website to declare war on MLS
• 58-6: spies. Includes PSh (Suspicion of Espionage), NSh (Unproven Espionage), SVPSh (Contacts Leading to Suspicion of Espionage)
• 58-7: subversives
• 58-8: terrorists (may include TN, "Terrorist Intent," eg speaking rudely to an official)
• 58-9: saboteurs (wreckers)
• 58-10: anti-MLS agitation and propaganda
• 58-11: hostile group (an aggravating factor)
• 58-12: non-informers
• 58-14: economic sabotage: any failure to perform a task.

Will everyone not guilty take a step backward?

 

[gonk]

I was going to post this at av123's forum but as that thread is closed now rolleyes I would like to post my answer here.

Good answer. You bring up a reasonable point, too, even if you do get classified as that guy. MLS ran the raffles on AV123's forum, with either the company's involvement, its blessing, or the appearance of its blessing, and then stole from them. If you or I were a company employee, whether a janitor or a president, and committed a crime like that, I suspect that we'd end up looking for a new job.

oh, man....Well, you gave it your best. What I saw was impressive.

I tried.

 

[GirgleMirt]

Quite frankly..I choose when and where I give my personal opinions of anyone..I also choose to show respect to individuals publicly until they have given a full accounting of their reasons or something they have posted..

So it's better for schifter not to give a full accounting so you can show respect to him indefinitely.

You see..while I may be a bit out dated...I still believe in the principal of "Innocent until proven guilty" theory..

A self admission of guilt isn't proof enough?

I fully understand the feelings of many here and elsewhere with regards to the raffles and all the rest of the issues..but..until Mark fully explains his position on everything..I'll reserve to post my personal opinions on the matter..To do otherwise only leads to more problems and issues.

So any crook caught in fraudulent acts shouldn't be judged until they've given their own 'positions' on everything...

Seriously, who the hell wants to hear his position? Let me ask you this, what 'position' would you find acceptable, for stealing charity money like he did? I said so already, the second he stole from the donated charity money, he made clear that he has absolutely no morals. What do you think the money was used for? Save thousands of children from starving? I bet not, it was simply stolen by this fat lard and used at his discretion instead of making it's way to the intended charity recipients. It's disgusting... Dishonest... Illegal... And after that, you continue to give him credit? Really, who wants to hear the fat pig sing? Who the hell cares about his word after what he has done? I certainly don't, but I fully expect this money to be given back. And that has not happened. And that's really the only thing that matters. The pig has danced around but has yet to give back the stolen money. Do you really want to see more of the pig dancing and singing?

And as it's been asked, how long do you give him to give back the tens of thousands of dollars he's stolen before you allow yourself to pass judgment on him? You do admit it's stealing right? Taking something that's not yours? The fact that he's stolen money isn't enough for you? You want him to explain his position, and somehow until that's done you reserve from passing judgment? You know, I'm all for the innocent until proven guilty, but it's way passed that at this point, you can easily verify the facts for yourself, he's already admitted his guilt, he's had plenty of chances to right the wrongs, and he's shown absolutely no interest in doing so. Even his posts show an amazing lack of integrity and an amazing amount of hypocrisy... So, just let him do his thing? "He must have good reasons"? I can't understand your position... It's extremely naive and will bite you on your *** in real life you can be sure... Letting crooks do their thing is the worst thing to do.

The thread is intact, but it is now locked.

There you go. That topic is over. Discussion is finished. Nothing to see here, move along people!

You should start a new thread when this one drops from page 1... Since the other one got locked for off topic stuff or I don't know what... Surely, he didn't lock it to censor the discussion... So why should an unfinished discussion be stopped if it's not concluded?

Bottom line, (as if it wasn't evident), is that they still continue to censor.

 

[stevo238]

Quite frankly..I choose when and where I give my personal opinions of anyone..I also choose to show respect to individuals publicly until they have given a full accounting of their reasons or something they have posted..I've done this even for you..when you have called me names for no reason.I did this even with Chu..and his noxious posting of Mark..up until I felt that I should say something..which led me to posting here on the matter.BTW.. I really don't call any forum home now..not here..not there..but I do visit many different forums..all under my screen name here.While there..I try to post under the rules set up by the place..

You see..while I may be a bit out dated...I still believe in the principal of "Innocent until proven guilty" theory.. I fully understand the feelings of many here and elsewhere with regards to the raffles and all the rest of the issues..but..until Mark fully explains his position on everything..I'll reserve to post my personal opinions on the matter..To do otherwise only leads to more problems and issues.

Sorry if this isn't acceptable with you or others..it's just the way I am. I don't participate in internet lynch mobs..and feel doing so isn't the best solution..even when I am effected by the individual or company.I'll use other means of seeking redress of an individual or business,ones I know will effect the solution to any personal grievances I may harbor.

Mac

Considering your over wrought rants directed at naysayers over at AV123, I'd say you've had a change of heart Mac. Your comments above suggest to me that you borrowed MLS' dancing shoes this afternoon so at best your words sound disingenuous like his. No need to hand you a shovel. I think you've buried yourself quite well.

 

[tom67]

Should I buy Rockets?

1,382 threads here and I am not sure whether AV123 is Bernie Madoff or Albert Schweitzer.....

 

[Chu Gai]

1,382 threads here and I am not sure whether AV123 is Bernie Madoff or Albert Schweitzer.....

You can buy morphing software and take your pick.