Coronavirus

[highfigh]

Well I asked a few antivaxers a question this week. So if you get covid and end up in ICU for weeks and you die, is your family ready to handle all the hospital bills on your stay and the medical assistance that tried to keep you alive. Interesting, these men, never gave that any thought. Its all about "them" and their feelings the Govt and medicine is wrong. A lot of these anti vaccine folks just fail to think about the cost to them and their families if one of them gets covid and ends up for a long stay in the hospital and the panic to their family if they die.

Do these people NOT have health insurance?

 

[TLS Guy]

The science of this pandemic is in many ways becoming complex and confusing for the scientific and medical communities. So it is no wonder the public are confused, especially when you add in miss information.

Things are not going nearly as well as expected. The Delta + variant is now raging in Europe. Cases are rising fast in Austria, Germany, Poland and the Baltic states at present. The situation in Austria is the worst, which seems to have far more than its fair share of antivaxers.

Cases in the UK are holding steady, but at too high a level. I watched the PMs news conference two days ago. Professor Chris Whitty went over the European and UK data in detail. The Delta + variant does seem to overtaking the previous variant in continental Europe. He was of the opinion that this new variant is more infectious and pathogenic. If this is so, it is very bad news. There is increasing belief in the scientific community that herd immunity may not be possible for this virus. This is very bad news if that turns out to be true.

Minnesota is now the hot spot for US cases, despite a relatively high vaccination rate. Our Hospitals are full, and we have over 300 in ICUs. About 20% of key medical staff have quit from burnout. Two army medical teams are now on their way to support ICU staff in the Twin Cities.

However it seems to me this dire situation is being driven by inadequate vaccine uptake.

Total number of fully vaccinated Minnesotans age 12 and older (as of the week beginning 10/10/21)*	3,234,905​

	Number of vaccine breakthrough cases	Percent of fully vaccinated people
Total cases	72,628​	2.245%​
Total cases hospitalized**	3,177​	0.098%​
Total deaths***	519​	0.016%​

That is a week of data from the Minnesota State Health department. I think it speaks for itself.

Austria has got tough, and ordered lock down for the unvaccinated. They have to stay home. They are allowed out for one brief period of exercise daily. Police will be stopping and checking people randomly. There will be heavy fines for non compliance. Germany will introduce similar measures in at least a couple of states at the end of the week.

I think these sort of measures are warranted and justified in the US. This situation can not continue. If it does we will continue to shed essential medical staff and no one will have adequate access to care.

I have to say this pandemic is continuing with serious consequences far longer than I thought it would. One way or another, everyone have to get vaccinated.

 

[mtrycrafts]

What is the population in MN 12 and over? That would give an idea of % vaccinated.
Yes, 70%-80% will not hack it. I think it needs to be in the mid 90s or better, similar to school kids and vaccinations.

This seems to be what happens at the first sign of getting better and lower cases, people relax too soon and we are back to square two.

 

[TLS Guy]

What is the population in MN 12 and over? That would give an idea of % vaccinated.
Yes, 70%-80% will not hack it. I think it needs to be in the mid 90s or better, similar to school kids and vaccinations.

This seems to be what happens at the first sign of getting better and lower cases, people relax too soon and we are back to square two.

Minnesota has a population of 5.3 million rounding the number off.

64% of the population over 5 years old are fully vaccinated. 75% of the population over 18 are fully vaccinated. 93% of the population over 65 are vaccinated.

The worrying thing is that in the early days, we thought those sort of numbers would put the Genie back in the bottle. The fact that we can go to number one hot spot in the nation I find very concerning. Of course we are a far northern state for the US and have been retreating inside for about three weeks now. we had warm weather until the last week of October. This does not look good as the cold moves south. It underscores the fact that most infections do take place in the home.

It also highlights the fact that we need as close to 100% uptake as we can get.

My wife has been a volunteer rolling out vaccines to children and boosters. She says children are enthusiastic to receive the vaccine. These have been largely 5 to 12 years old. These children seem to largely understand what many adults seem incapable, or willfully refusing to understand.

 

[panteragstk]

My wife has been a volunteer rolling out vaccines to children and boosters. She says children are enthusiastic to receive the vaccine. These have been largely 5 to 12 years old. These children seem to largely understand what many adults seem incapable, or willfully refusing to understand.

That's good to hear. My kids (soon to be 5, 7, 8) are all on the schedule to get theirs soon.

As far as kids understanding, they do. Much better because they are taught to trust doctors and science. So, when a person of authority (Dr., scientist, teacher) tells them something is to help them and other people (the vaccine) they are all about it.

Too bad a lot of kids have that empathy taught out of them by their parents. That and the lack of continuing education are really what have caused us so many of the issues we're seeing when it comes to misinformation and the like.

 

[cpp]

Do these people NOT have health insurance?

Or just poor high deductible insurance

 

[Jeff R.]

That's good to hear. My kids (soon to be 5, 7, 8) are all on the schedule to get theirs soon.

As far as kids understanding, they do. Much better because they are taught to trust doctors and science. So, when a person of authority (Dr., scientist, teacher) tells them something is to help them and other people (the vaccine) they are all about it.

Too bad a lot of kids have that empathy taught out of them by their parents. That and the lack of continuing education are really what have caused us so many of the issues we're seeing when it comes to misinformation and the like.

I’m not sure that teaching kids they should trust teachers, doctors and scientists is a good idea. You should never trust anybody because of their profession. If you have no skepticism you will at some point become a victim. So I think this a dangerous path to walk. This is why adults no longer do. They at some point learned the hard way.


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[mtrycrafts]

... These children seem to largely understand what many adults seem incapable, or willfully refusing to understand.

Yes, indeed. And, most likely they have been getting all the required shots for school and general life and been told that vaccines are good for you.

 

[shadyJ]

I’m not sure that teaching kids they should trust teachers, doctors and scientists is a good idea. You should never trust anybody because of their profession. If you have no skepticism you will at some point become a victim. So I think this a dangerous path to walk. This is why adults no longer do. They at some point learned the hard way.


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+1 agreed. Doctors and scientists aren't nearly as reliable sources of information as random loons on Facebook.

 

[Mikado463]

+1 agreed. Doctors and scientists aren't nearly as reliable sources of information as random loons on Facebook.

While I see your humor I also get Jeff R's point. Even so, I'm going with the science in front of me .......

 

[MaxInValrico]

Or just poor high deductible insurance

That's why HSA's were invented, to offset the cost of deductibles.

 

[Mikado463]

That's why HSA's were invented, to offset the cost of deductibles.

and very often they go hand in hand with the higher deductible policies. When I was working my employer had that type of ins. It was great !

 

[panteragstk]

I’m not sure that teaching kids they should trust teachers, doctors and scientists is a good idea. You should never trust anybody because of their profession. If you have no skepticism you will at some point become a victim. So I think this a dangerous path to walk. This is why adults no longer do. They at some point learned the hard way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You shouldn't BLINDLY trust someone because of their profession, but there is some built in trust.

You also shouldn't BLINDLY trust anything you read online or otherwise, but TONS of adults do because it's the popular thing to do. Why else do you hear groups of people saying the same nonsense? Where else does that come from other than blindly trusting something they shouldn't?

 

[MaxInValrico]

and very often they go hand in hand with the higher deductible policies. When I was working my employer had that type of ins. It was great !

Under the ACA, any high deductible health insurance program is required to offer an HSA as a means to offset uncovered medical expenses and deductibles. HSAs are essentially a 401k for health care.

 

[NINaudio]

Under the ACA, any high deductible health insurance program is required to offer an HSA as a means to offset uncovered medical expenses and deductibles. HSAs are essentially a 401k for health care.

Assuming you can build up enough money in one to be able to use the investment features they offer. Our HDHP has a max yearly out of pocket of $7000, with a $4000 deductible. Max I can put into the HSA in a year pretax is $7300. So that leaves $300 for dental and vision use if we hit our out of pocket maximum in any given year. Our other healthcare choice is a traditional PPO with an FSA. The HDHP saves me about $500/yr if we reach the out of pocket maximum versus if we chose the PPO and hit the out of pocket maximum.

 

[Danzilla31]

Just got the booster today on Pfizer don't feel anything yet but I didn't feel sick from the 2nd dose until the 2nd day I took tommorow off work just in case. Will keep everyone updated if anything comes up. Don't think it will. Even tho I got pretty sick from the 2nd dose it only lasted for one day

 

[Danzilla31]

Minnesota has a population of 5.3 million rounding the number off.

64% of the population over 5 years old are fully vaccinated. 75% of the population over 18 are fully vaccinated. 93% of the population over 65 are vaccinated.

The worrying thing is that in the early days, we thought those sort of numbers would put the Genie back in the bottle. The fact that we can go to number one hot spot in the nation I find very concerning. Of course we are a far northern state for the US and have been retreating inside for about three weeks now. we had warm weather until the last week of October. This does not look good as the cold moves south. It underscores the fact that most infections do take place in the home.

It also highlights the fact that we need as close to 100% uptake as we can get.

My wife has been a volunteer rolling out vaccines to children and boosters. She says children are enthusiastic to receive the vaccine. These have been largely 5 to 12 years old. These children seem to largely understand what many adults seem incapable, or willfully refusing to understand.

I think that's part of the issue as you have pointed out the numbers and knowledge keeps changing. Eventually it leads to public fatigue which may play a part in people becoming fatigued and uncooperative

I've just started preparing myself for the high possibility that this virus is here to stay like the flu.

Not sure where we go from here but I'm not convinced Austria is the best course of action here in the U.S. Not sure with the political divide in the US right now that that might do way more harm then good.

 

[Mikado463]

Under the ACA, any high deductible health insurance program is required to offer an HSA as a means to offset uncovered medical expenses and deductibles. HSAs are essentially a 401k for health care.

even better than a 401k because it's non-taxed going in and out ! I also believe it puts a certain onus on ones own personal responsibility to take better care of themselves.

 

[panteragstk]

Just got the booster today on Pfizer don't feel anything yet but I didn't feel sick from the 2nd dose until the 2nd day I took tommorow off work just in case. Will keep everyone updated if anything comes up. Don't think it will. Even tho I got pretty sick from the 2nd dose it only lasted for one day

My two oldest kids just got their first round about 15 min ago. Not home yet, but they don't like shots so I'm sure their mom had fun.

My son will be 5 in Dec, so he'll get his then.

Hopefully, nobody gets sick (including you). Fingers crossed.

 

[Danzilla31]

My two oldest kids just got their first round about 15 min ago. Not home yet, but they don't like shots so I'm sure their mom had fun.

My son will be 5 in Dec, so he'll get his then.

Hopefully, nobody gets sick (including you). Fingers crossed.

So far so good I still don't feel anything yet not even a sore arm