Can You Get Audiophile 2CH Sound from a Home Theater?

[witchdoctor]

I see you went with combo panels for your room treatment. They look good. I have the same issue with a window on the right wall and hung auralex acoustic lens which lets the light through

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0422/3813/products/diffusion-auralex-sustain-lens-24-bamboo-sustain-lens-diffusors-pair-1_800x.jpg?v=1553523592

 

[Trell]

I see you went with combo panels for your room treatment. They look good. I have the same issue with a window on the right wall and hung auralex acoustic lens which lets the light through

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0422/3813/products/diffusion-auralex-sustain-lens-24-bamboo-sustain-lens-diffusors-pair-1_800x.jpg?v=1553523592

Please quote the post you are talking about as that will make it much easier to follow the conversation.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Does anyone want to discuss 2 CH stereo through a multi-channel setup?

Yeah. 2CH through a MCH system sounds awesome (at least as good as 2CH system) if your MCH system is awesome. And sounds worse than 2CH Systems if your MCH system SUCKS.

 

[lovinthehd]

Again with the look in the mirror crap, I see I hit a soft spot. You don't have to give your name it is Anonymous (the meetings).
Tuesday nights are the best time to show up. They do have meeting 7 days and nights a week. Best to go sober, ay.
Apr of 82 for me and booze. I drank 26 years later at my daughters wedding and haven't since.

Your post are still a little muddled, I'll attribute that to shaky hands. That will go away you know. Please don't tell me you have
a Fentanyl, speed and coke problem too. Gambling? I fear that is the reason for the cheap gear and bad attitude. Had to sell
the goods. LOL

I don't gamble either. The wife does. 20.00 a week on Lotto

I don't call people fools for a reason. Read in the Bible what it says about calling someone a FOOL. I didn't write it, I just read it.
You may not believe in the Bible. It never hurt anyone to know what was in one either.

You draw strange conclusions about posts as well as audio. Good luck with that. You can keep up your strange comments about me, I don't care, I just consider the source. The bible, seriously?

 

[witchdoctor]

Please quote the post you are talking about as that will make it much easier to follow the conversation.

Got it

 

[witchdoctor]

Yeah. 2CH through a MCH system sounds awesome (at least as good as 2CH system) if your MCH system is awesome. And sounds worse than 2CH Systems if your MCH system SUCKS.

This is true, but a GREAT MCH system can do great 2CH and great MCH. Great 2CH is fine but limited to two CH. MCH has not gotten traction for many reason, but not being satisfying is not one of them. If anyone reading this wants to unleash the MCH gods you have to get a good MCH source as upmixing can never take the place of a MCH source. That used to mean $$$ on a collection of SACD, DVD-A, BRD, etc. Then comes spatial audio which is fine but limited to whatever is available. The X-Box series S or X let's you choose how you want your MCH to be rendered. I love jazz and big band in DTS format so set it and forget it. Everything plays in DTS and I set the processor to DTS- Neo-X. I like arena rock, hip hop, and house music in atmos so I just set it and thats it. It is also DLNA capable so you can stream anything, not limited to the apps on the X-Box.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

This is true, but a GREAT MCH system can do great 2CH and great MCH. Great 2CH is fine but limited to two CH. MCH has not gotten traction for many reason, but not being satisfying is not one of them. If anyone reading this wants to unleash the MCH gods you have to get a good MCH source as upmixing can never take the place of a MCH source. That used to mean $$$ on a collection of SACD, DVD-A, BRD, etc. Then comes spatial audio which is fine but limited to whatever is available. The X-Box series S or X let's you choose how you want your MCH to be rendered. I love jazz and big band in DTS format so set it and forget it. Everything plays in DTS and I set the processor to DTS- Neo-X. I like arena rock, hip hop, and house music in atmos so I just set it and thats it. It is also DLNA capable so you can stream anything, not limited to the apps on the X-Box.

Sometimes the person doing the blaming needs to look in the mirror, instead of just blaming everyone else around them.

If something doesn’t sound great (sound quality, bass, ATMOS, etc.), the culprit could be their own system.

 

[witchdoctor]

I think what helped take my system from good to great was the room treatment setup that Gene and Anthony Grimani posted on youtube. The more speakers you have in a room, the more reflections you have bouncing around. The room correction electronics in a processor works much better in a well treated room.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I think what helped take my system from good to great was the room treatment setup that Gene and Anthony Grimani posted on youtube. The more speakers you have in a room, the more reflections you have bouncing around. The room correction electronics in a processor works much better in a well treated room.

I think everyone can agree that if your room acoustics is bad, fixing that issue is a must.

Of course, every case is different. Could be room, could be speakers/subs, could just be the setup and fine-tune.

Not every room needs or should be treated.

Does your room have hard floor or a lot of glass/windows/wood/hard surfaces?

 

[witchdoctor]

I think everyone can agree that if your room acoustics is bad, fixing that issue is a must.

Of course, every case is different. Could be room, could be speakers/subs, could just be the setup and fine-tune.

Not every room needs or should be treated.

Does your room have hard floor or a lot of glass/windows/wood/hard surfaces?

My room is irregular shaped. It has a little alcove by the picture windows which introduced more corners in the room. It is also has an open area by the back wall which I was able to solve by placing some free standing panels. I'll post pics over the week-end.

 

[witchdoctor]

I think the #1 reason for having 2 or MORE systems is because you have more than one room and want to fill those rooms.

So my HT room is for HT, but my living room is for 2CH, not because 2CH sounds better for music.

If I had 1 HT room and 10 living rooms, there would be 1 HT room and 10 rooms with 2CH.

I use DTS Play-Fi for exactly that reason. Some rooms only have one speaker like the kitchen.
Home Theater- 9.2.7 (Playf1 enabled with a Klipsch Gate)
Man Cave- 5.1.4 (Onkyo/Play-Fi receiver)
Kitchen- 1 (Paradigm Shift A2 active speaker connected to a Klipsh Gate)
Patio-1 (DefTech W7 active playfi speaker)
Bedroom-1 (DefTech W7)
Home Office- 2.1 (Klipsch Powergate connected to a pair of Boston Acoustic Soundware speakers and a Boston Acoustics sub)
Dining Room- 1 (DefTech W7)
Garage- 1 (Paradigm PW 800 Playfi enabled speaker)

I have been eyeing a McIntosh MB50 playfi enagled streamer for the HT but since I primarily stream music in Atmos or DTS I have been on the fence. Thoughts?

 

[MrBoat]

So then, what is the best way to get 2-channel audio with bass management and variable crossover settings if not with an AVR? I don't recall seeing a lot of features such as sub outs on most 2-channel integrated amps. What about with passive subs? As much as I like my full range speakers, I still like to use subs for what they do well in my 2-channel system.

I haven't looked at 2-channel amps in a while because I haven't needed to.

 

[witchdoctor]

So then, what is the best way to get 2-channel audio with bass management and variable crossover settings if not with an AVR? I don't recall seeing a lot of features such as sub outs on most 2-channel integrated amps. What about with passive subs? As much as I like my full range speakers, I still like to use subs for what they do well in my 2-channel system.

I haven't looked at amps in a while because I haven't needed to.

Great question, I have an amp by Paradigm called the PW Amp that has a sub out and uses ARC room correction. It was about $300. If budget allows look at Anthem 2 channel amps which also use ARC. I think NAD offers two channel amps with DIRAC as well.

 

[everettT]

Great question, I have an amp by Paradigm called the PW Amp that has a sub out and uses ARC room correction. It was about $300. If budget allows look at Anthem 2 channel amps which also use ARC. I think NAD offers two channel amps with DIRAC as well.

This Paradigm amp?

Review and Measurements of Paradigm PW Amp

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Paradigm PW Amp streaming capable power (speaker) amplifier. It is on kind loan from a member. The PW Amp normally costs US $499 but is being sold currently for just US $225 from company's website. Needless to say this has generated a lot of...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[OHMisback]

MrBoat said:
So then, what is the best way to get 2-channel audio with bass management and variable crossover settings if not with an AVR? I don't recall seeing a lot of features such as sub outs on most 2-channel integrated amps. What about with passive subs? As much as I like my full range speakers, I still like to use subs for what they do well in my 2-channel system.

I haven't looked at amps in a while because I haven't needed to.

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Sub out can mean a few thing. One is the cut point and the other is if it has a stepped signal. I don't use a modified signal
from the source in 2 channel stereo reproduction or from a preamp. If the source has an enhanced bass track (like in many HT movies)
Sub out is the ticket.

Two channel stereo reproduction I've never seen "sub out" used because in STEREO reproduction they don't use it.
The enhanced SUB tracks are unique to HT so is LTE or what ever it's called it uses a step baffle +3-10db gain 40-60hz.
I've heard it and my MX Macs have it. I never used it. Rumble filter is more likely for me with non servo subs.
Servos are made for LP use in my case. They have a rubble filter switch with a step pot adjustment.

I use a left and right signal to power my plate amps if I use them. There are TWO bass tracks or more in
most music reproduction, don't leave one out. There is a left and right tracks and they can be different.
Stanly Clarks LPs were that way. You could image a center channel with Bass columns (not subs). 80-280hz.
My mains are at 280hz >. They image a separate center, from the bass columns. Kinda cool actually.

You better have pretty "good" room treatment for 2 channel. Dead does not work, correct does.
I'm a Helmholtz enthusiast, with heavy draw drapes. Both are quickly tunable. JIC

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I use DTS Play-Fi for exactly that reason. Some rooms only have one speaker like the kitchen.
Home Theater- 9.2.7 (Playf1 enabled with a Klipsch Gate)
Man Cave- 5.1.4 (Onkyo/Play-Fi receiver)
Kitchen- 1 (Paradigm Shift A2 active speaker connected to a Klipsh Gate)
Patio-1 (DefTech W7 active playfi speaker)
Bedroom-1 (DefTech W7)
Home Office- 2.1 (Klipsch Powergate connected to a pair of Boston Acoustic Soundware speakers and a Boston Acoustics sub)
Dining Room- 1 (DefTech W7)
Garage- 1 (Paradigm PW 800 Playfi enabled speaker)

I have been eyeing a McIntosh MB50 playfi enagled streamer for the HT but since I primarily stream music in Atmos or DTS I have been on the fence. Thoughts?

The only things good about Mac are their aesthetics/bragging rights for their big bad AVP and Amps.

I don’t think anyone cares about their little 8-pound WiFi streamer, unless you already have their big bad AVP and Amps to go along with it.

So no, the Mac streamer makes no sense.

And besides, that little Mac streamer is only 11” wide? They can’t afford to put it into a 17” standard chassis?

 

[witchdoctor]

The only things good about Mac are their aesthetics/bragging rights for their big bad AVP and Amps.

I don’t think anyone cares about their little 8-pound WiFi streamer, unless you already have their big bad AVP and Amps to go along with it.

So no, the Mac streamer makes no sense.

Thanks, I have no desire to drop $1500 on aesthetics

 

[witchdoctor]

This Paradigm amp?

Review and Measurements of Paradigm PW Amp

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Paradigm PW Amp streaming capable power (speaker) amplifier. It is on kind loan from a member. The PW Amp normally costs US $499 but is being sold currently for just US $225 from company's website. Needless to say this has generated a lot of...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Yes, I used it in my desktop system and the sub integration with ARC really works good. It is a question if it has the other features you need.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thanks, I have no desire to drop $1500 on aesthetics

Oh, no, the aesthetics and bragging rights are just for their big bad amps and AVP. That 11” streamer doesn’t have the aesthetics or bragging rights.

They would have to put that 11” streamer into one of their amps or AVP chassis and jack the price up to $5,000.

$1,500 ain’t nothing to brag about.

 

[everettT]

Yes, I used it in my desktop system and the sub integration with ARC really works good. It is a question if it has the other features you need.

My only issue with it is the noise issues from what I see, the amp would likely audibly effect a lot of speakers throughout the speech band. I didn't read the RC part of the manual, is the crossover variable or fixed and does it include selectable HP and LP filters?