American Communist Med Students graduate

M

MDS

Audioholic Spartan
I just have to wonder how many parents 'raise their kids to be a liberal'. Sounds ridiculous to me and would only make sense to someone that sees the entire world and all issues that pertain to that world in terms of 'liberal' vs 'conservative'. I will emphasize once again that the terms are meaningless.
 
furrycute

furrycute

Banned
Really?

We've been there for 5 years and how much oil have we pumped, refined or shipped? That is one of the biggest left wing fallacies that abounds. Besides, how does one possibly escape the political suicide after trying to capitalize on all that blood oil? Once we start pumping, shipping or selling, I'll give your point some street cred, until then it's just fluff.

And as far as your final point, I'll agree that much of the administration has been unfairly judged. He has surrounded himself withe some highly skilled and experienced people. If he would only listen to them all...
It's not about how much oil we can pump out right now. It's about securing our access to Middle Eastern oil when the crunch time comes, which is just around the corner, in about a decade or so. The world oil reserve is dwindling fast, and the oil companies and the world leaders know it.

I also agree the likes of Haliburton and many of the so called "conservative" politicians are obscene war profiteers.
 
J

Johnd

Audioholic Samurai
Like it or not, we are there in the Middle East right now to stake out our claim on the world's remaining oil reserve.
Just because you say it, does not make it so. Just because you keep saying it, or others keep saying it, does not make it so. Proffer some empirical proof and it becomes more than fluff.
 
Davemcc

Davemcc

Audioholic Spartan
Really? Most economists and history itself would disagree.
Name three economists that would make that point.

History is an abstract concept and agrees with nobody. It is the consensus of opinion and that consensus may change with opinion. Remember "the victor writes the history".

What was pre-embargo Cuba like in the fifties?
By pre-embargo, I will infer you mean pre-Castro. It was a vibrant and diverse community of people working to achieve their own personal goals. It was wealthy and prosperous, as can be evidenced by the abundance of 1950's Packards, Hudsons, Chevrolets, etc. Some very fine vehicles that people could afford as befitting a prosperous nation. Those cars are a fine symbol of the nation itself. What was once beautiful and functional is now faded, worn and though serviceable, just a forelorn reminder that once people could aspire to more than simply a state issued sack of beans and rice.

You made my very point. The rest of the world is dealing with Cuba...just not us. If some of us got out of our cozy shells (looked at things from a more international perspective, rather than America right or wrong), I think we would readily agree that:
1) the embargo has outlived its' usefulness;
Not at all. The embargo serves a valid point. Cuba is a hostile communist nation 90 miles from the U.S. coast that has a history of alliances with th most vociferous anti-American nations. Cuba is still seeking alliances with Iran, North Korea and Venezuela, the nations that hate America the most. While Cuba has the right to treat with any nations it chooses, it is proper that the United States ensure that enemies of the United States are not financed with American finances. This really begs the question of why America doesn't embargo China, but China is not 90 miles off the coast.

2) Communism is all but dead (despite some rantings here); and,
Communism is very much alive in such places as Cuba, China, North Korea, Vietnam and Russia. Further, it is still a military threat in many places around the world, most notably Taiwan. It is imperative that the communist leadership in Cuba not attain the military/economic potential to harm the United States.

3) the very fact that we are the only country embargoing Cuba isolates us from those (the rest of the world) that do not.
And America is the only major nation 90 miles from Cuba. American policy vis-a-vis Cuba is very different from France's, for instance. France would like nothing more than to see th United States face threats, real or perceived, that takes American influence away from other international arenas in which France could otherwise play a lead role. This is the real reason France didn't join the latest Gulf War. France has been actively trying to form and lead a diplomatic coalition of nations whose aim is to a) reduce the influence of the U.S. in international affairs and b) give France a dominant role in international affairs as an alternative to the U.S. French foreign policy is nothing more than to oppose the U.S. regardless of the merits of U.S. policy. Go ahead, take France's lead on the Cuban issue and subvert America's best interests.

Rather than accepting the status quo, and allowing things to remain just because...I believe one needs to justify international policy...especially obsolete 45 year old ones that serve only to separate us from the rest of the world.
Justification for foreign policy need only be that it is in the best interest of the country holding that policy. In fact, that is the only justification. It is in America's best interest that Cuba remain weak and militarily ineffectual. American foreign policy should reflect that. And to the extent that Cuba's proximity poses a threat, so must be the extent of the policy.



It's here that I must add a few comments on negotiation and compromise, but I give Ayn Rand full credit for the intellectual basis of these comments. Compromise can only benefit evil (or wrong). If one party is right and the other is wrong, any compromise will only lead the right party to be less right. If freedom is right and communism is wrong, then only communism can benefit by causing freedom to compromise. Sorry if I've butchered Ms. Rand's thesis, but in negotiations with communist states, the U.S. should not compromise. Such compromise can only serve to strengthen the communist states and diminish the freedoms of the citizens that the negotiations aim to benefit. In my view, all free nations should be in detente with all communist nations until the communists collapse under the weight of their own repression. Even tacit acceptance of communism, never mind formalized compromise, strengthens the communists and dilutes America's commitment to human rights and freedom.
 
furrycute

furrycute

Banned
Communism only failed because a central command styled economy cannot possibly compete with a free market economy.

But a free market economy driven forward solely by endless consumption can only thrive in an environment of cheap and seemingly endless natural resources. How long do you think this consumption based economic model will last?
 
furrycute

furrycute

Banned
Just because you say it, does not make it so. Just because you keep saying it, or others keep saying it, does not make it so. Proffer some empirical proof and it becomes more than fluff.
Then why do you think we went to war with Iraq?
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
I just have to wonder how many parents 'raise their kids to be a liberal'. Sounds ridiculous to me and would only make sense to someone that sees the entire world and all issues that pertain to that world in terms of 'liberal' vs 'conservative'. I will emphasize once again that the terms are meaningless.
They might be meaningless but humans have an urge to label everything and this just helps especially when you can dismiss "bad" ideas as the opposing political orientation to make yourself feel better and less alike "them".
 
highfihoney

highfihoney

Audioholic Samurai
37th...39th. While Cuba does not have cutting edge technology in medicine, it is available to all. Why do we not have a similar program?
We do have a similar program in fact its the best in the world,NO STATE OR COUNTY HOSPITAL CAN REFUSE SERVICE,that includes dentistry & all childrens health care including pediatrics,patients cant be turned away even if they owe the hospital thousands of dollars.

Another great program for the bums in this country like my brother in law is the welfare health insurance,no co payments on doctors visits or meds & accepted at all doctors offices by law.

Im not trying to insult you but if you think for 1 second that anybody in the USA is being denied world class health care your dreaming,the only possible gripe that the poor & lazy non working bums can possibly have is that they have to wait in line,boo friggen hoo.

My company supplies some of the best health care insurance that can be had to our employes,we have alot of mexican workers at our company here on work visa's & they get the same insurance as i do but they refuse to use it,why you ask,because the state medical is better because its free,instead of walking into a doctors office & ending up with a $20 co pay they prefer to sit at the county hospital,no co payments there.

My fat head lazy a$$ brother in law is a middle aged welfare bum,he gets free eye glasses,free dentistry for his false teeth:D & for all of his kids,free prescriptions & now he gets $500 a month cash for being stupid,they say its for being bi-polar,another fancy name for being a dumb a$$.

If you want free goodies this is the country to exploit.
 
stratman

stratman

Audioholic Ninja
Hello John,

Just one question? Do you believe this country (and other countries) should resign their national sovereignty, submit to a central collective body which in turn guarantees protection against agression, puts forth equitable trading practices, abolishes fighting forces both nuclear and conventional (except for it's own), redistributes wealth according to need? I'm just curious where this banter that started with Cuba is leading.

Stratman
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
If you want free goodies this is the country to exploit.
Very true. I volunteer and an ER and we are very familiar with some hypochondriacs who have no insurance needless to say they have never once paid a bill to the hospital so who other but the hospital pay it? No one. These people just waste the doctors time and resources and never have to pay a dime.

Edit: This is all because there are laws in place saying we can turn no one away even if they don't have insurance or are a known drug seeker we must admit and see all.
 
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Davemcc

Davemcc

Audioholic Spartan
Then why do you think we went to war with Iraq?
Because Saddam led a rogue regime that invaded no less than three neighboring states (Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia), violated UN sanctions, failed to uphold the UN agreements that ended the first Gulf War, gassed his citizens with WMD's (women and children), mass murdered political opponents, financed terrorism and generally abused the decades of American backing for evil purposes.
 
Tomorrow

Tomorrow

Audioholic Ninja
Dear John,

I can see that there a quite a few folks here who would be very interested in you actually proffering some proactive ideas for our country's behavior. All we've been hearing from you is the tired, old criticism of the current administration, apparently based on your opinion derived from what you read and see (I assume on NBC and in the NY Times).

Put it forth, John, and allow us to critique your 'non-head-in-the-sand' approach. But carefully research your military and historical data....we're watching, lol. ;)

You DO have the U.S.'s best interests at heart, do you not?

Best regards,

Tomorrow
 
Tomorrow

Tomorrow

Audioholic Ninja
Just because you say it, does not make it so. Just because you keep saying it, or others keep saying it, does not make it so. Proffer some empirical proof and it becomes more than fluff.
Nicely done, John! I'm trying to hold your feet to the same fire. ;)
 
J

Johnd

Audioholic Samurai
We do have a similar program in fact its the best in the world,NO STATE OR COUNTY HOSPITAL CAN REFUSE SERVICE,that includes dentistry & all childrens health care including pediatrics,patients cant be turned away even if they owe the hospital thousands of dollars.
I'm not insulted...I appreciate your input. But around here, you're simply dead wrong. For the uninsured, care is commonly refused if it is not life threatening. They may eventually be able to find no or low-cost medical assistance, but it is at their own expense. There may be "a program" available, but it is the exception, not the rule.

The US still has private, profit-driven medical care last time I looked out the window. It's a double-edged sword, the money and the high prices fund r&d and technology, a good thing, whilst making it unaffordable for many.
 
furrycute

furrycute

Banned
Because Saddam led a rogue regime that invaded no less than three neighboring states (Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia), violated UN sanctions, failed to uphold the UN agreements that ended the first Gulf War, gassed his citizens with WMD's (women and children), mass murdered political opponents, financed terrorism and generally abused the decades of American backing for evil purposes.

Change a couple of words in that description, people might start to think that you are talking about Israel.


Because Israel's government is a rogue regime that invaded almost all its neighboring states (Palestine, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, etc.), repeatedly violated UN sanctions, failed to uphold the numerous Camp David accords that were supposed to end the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, treating its Arab citizens and Jewish citizens of African descent as second class citizens (women and children), mass murdered political opponents, financed terrorism (against arab states) and generally abused the decades of American backing for evil purposes.

And oh, Israel also has the one thing that was never found in Iraq, WMD's!
 
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J

Johnd

Audioholic Samurai
Dear John,

I can see that there a quite a few folks here who would be very interested in you actually proffering some proactive ideas for our country's behavior. All we've been hearing from you is the tired, old criticism of the current administration, apparently based on your opinion derived from what you read and see (I assume on NBC and in the NY Times).

Put it forth, John, and allow us to critique your 'non-head-in-the-sand' approach. But carefully research your military and historical data....we're watching, lol. ;)

You DO have the U.S.'s best interests at heart, do you not?

Best regards,

Tomorrow
You call it criticism. I am simply stating my opinion as a citizen of this free country. We need to end our tenure in Iraq.

What is not to understand? Why do you keep asking me for an "approach", a plan, and if I have America's best interest at heart? That is precisely the reason why I do extend my opinion. I think to continue to remain in Iraq will only hurt this country further.

1) Nationally: We are approaching 4000 US deaths, and some of those relatives are becoming disenfranchised.

2) Nationally: We cannot continue to rob Peter to pay Paul. There is only so much money to go around to fund this war.

2) Globally: We continue to make more enemies than friends by remaining in Iraq.

Care to try to disprove any or all of these three points?
 
Tomorrow

Tomorrow

Audioholic Ninja
I'm not insulted...I appreciate your input. But around here, you're simply dead wrong. For the uninsured, care is commonly refused if it is not life threatening. They may eventually be able to find no or low-cost medical assistance, but it is at their own expense. There may be "a program" available, but it is the exception, not the rule.

The US still has private, profit-driven medical care last time I looked out the window. It's a double-edged sword, the money and the high prices fund r&d and technology, a good thing, whilst making it unaffordable for many.
Perhaps one of our doctor members will chime in. (Brad, where are you?!) But you're absolutely wrong, John. NO ONE may be turned away from emergency room treatment, no matter what. As an example, if you break an arm, have no insurance, have no money (or tell them you don't), you will receive free care...even though you did NOT have a life threatening condition. ER's are not allowed to turn away patients who are unable to pay. That's why illegals, homeless, etc. like to go to the ER with minor ailments. It's free.

Where do you get your information?

And if you prefer the politics, education, medical care, and economics of other countries, then there's always expatriation. ;) Cuba really is only a short swim away, lol. Surely they'll listen to your criticisms. (Just be careful about saying anything anti-Cuba-ish...speak softly there.)
 
J

Johnd

Audioholic Samurai
And if you prefer the politics, education, medical care, and economics of other countries, then there's always expatriation. ;) Cuba really is only a short swim away, lol. Surely they'll listen to your criticisms. (Just be careful about saying anything anti-Cuba-ish...speak softly there.)
Ad hominem, ad hominem, ad hominem. No matter how many times your write it...
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
Perhaps one of our doctor members will chime in. (Brad, where are you?!) But you're absolutely wrong, John. NO ONE may be turned away from emergency room treatment, no matter what. As an example, if you break an arm, have no insurance, have no money (or tell them you don't), you will receive free care...even though you did NOT have a life threatening condition. ER's are not allowed to turn away patients who are unable to pay. That's why illegals, homeless, etc. like to go to the ER with minor ailments. It's free.

Where do you get your information?

And if you prefer the politics, education, medical care, and economics of other countries, then there's always expatriation. ;) Cuba really is only a short swim away, lol. Surely they'll listen to your criticisms. (Just be careful about saying anything anti-Cuba-ish...speak softly there.)
I may not be a doctor, yet, but I do volunteer at an ER desk and we are not allowed to turn away anyone no matter the condition or insurance status if people want to see a doctor we check them in and send them to the back. It really is that simple. As I said earlier we literally have people with no insurance in every week (the same person) who has no real illness and costs the hospital thousands monthly yet we cannot turn him away. Even with a profit driven system there are laws in place to make sure no one goes untreated.
 
Rock&Roll Ninja

Rock&Roll Ninja

Audioholic Field Marshall
2) Nationally: We cannot continue to rob Peter to pay Paul. There is only so much money to go around to fund this war.
This is very true of all spending, not just Iraq. The national debt is currently 8.9 TRILLION dollars. We need an immediate end to Republican pork-barrel spending and Democrat socialist experiments if we are going to avoid a new economic depression that will make the Great Depression seem like the roaring 50s. Our country will be shittier than Romania* if something doesn't get done.

*If I offended any Romanians, let me appologize by saying "What are you doing on the internet. Shouldn't you be dressing up as Dracula in an attempt to solicit tips from tourists or something?"
 

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