Philharmonic Audio - 3-way open back ML-TQWTs designed by Dennis Murphy

[Solid-State]

Just FYI, the supplied manufacturer graphs are measurements of this planar are in dipole operation so there is a 6db/oct gradient rolloff before it even hits the 12db/octave natural driver rolloff.. This is a monopole speaker so the driver's measurements in a baffle will be notably different.

DOH!

That was pointed out to me before! I'm most curious about where he's placed the xover. I don't think it's in the ML-TL cab. I hope it's in the midrange cab bottom even if stuffing snags on it. Is the ML-TL stuffed/loaded in China or do they tune it in Washington?

I'm so excited about this loudspeaker and potentially owning it. I'm going to have to pickup an ATI AT2005 or 2 to run it though. Owhh well great excuse to finally pickup top tier amplification.

For a pre I'm considering AVR-4311 over the 7005 for XT32. What do you guys know about the single ended outs on the 4311? Decent enough?

Why can't D&M make a middle road pre amp based on the 4311! I don't get it man... it would be so easy to rip out the amp modules and give it a great I/V discrete stage. Heck the parts count would be less and the unit fab costs would be about the same. I don't get D&M! Haven't you guys looked at 7005 sales and realized your LOSING sales to 40.x and 80.x !!!

 

[GranteedEV]

I'm so excited about this loudspeaker and potentially owning it. I'm going to have to pickup an ATI AT2005 or 2 to run it though. Owhh well great excuse to finally pickup top tier amplification.

Why not get some Hypex NC400 amps

http://www.hypex.nl/index.php?option=com_weblinks&view=weblink&id=106&catid=42

 

[woodsart]

uhh... I like FLAT speakers... If I need "warm" I'll use an EQ or I'll use Ozone plug.

Flat and neutral!!!!

 

[Solid-State]

Why not get some Hypex NC400 amps

http://www.hypex.nl/index.php?option=com_weblinks&view=weblink&id=106&catid=42

I've heard those. I've also built some DIY digital amps using Tripath and a gainclone. I'm very interested in IR2092. Hypex is great stuff but their patents are reminiscent of Apple Inc's on touch screen on a fundamental level IMHO plus I think the IR sigma delta sounds better...

BUT

Then I was at a friends listening to a true classy solid-state... Bryston... and I realized digital isn't there just YET.

I'd like to own two ATI AT3005s for 10 channels. That's a dream rig with A1HD.

BTW what is the AK4358VQ DAC like in 4311 ? It would sure be interesting to see a mod of the 4311 involving ripping out the amps and giving it decent analog out section. I wonder if the audio board has the DAC and I/V on the same PCB. The amp modules run middle chassis and have single ended runs on the sides of the chassis frame and speaker level running back to chassis backplate. I would assume the analog outs use op amps and are not discrete components. Sure would be interesting to get a look at the AVR-4311 innards.

 

[GranteedEV]

I've heard those. I've also built some DIY digital amps using Tripath and a gainclone. I'm very interested in IR2092. Hypex is great stuff but their patents are reminiscent of Apple Inc's on touch screen on a fundamental level IMHO plus I think the IR sigma delta sounds better...

Do you have any actual measurements of it?

 

[Solid-State]

Distortion Tests - HifimeDIY T2 / LJM L20D / SURE TDA7498 - diyAudio

For Hypex measurements check the web.

Just like driver FR it really doesn't show the "sonic signature" of the unit/design. All I know is I'm not paying Bruno $400 bucks for a module that cost $40 to fab.

ljm_ljm et al can sell IR2092 for $40-60 bucks and still make money.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/120687170518?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

http://www.sureelectronics.net/goods.php?id=1583

And if you want to pay more for a balanced input you have ClassD Audio at about $300 a module. Some of those funds also go to charity I believe...

 

[Nuance AH]

Nuance,
after hearing the ST, i know that my next speaker, i want something a little warmer side. Dont get me wrong about the ST, they are very neutral and sound fabulous. But i have also heard some focus audio that sounded warm and i know now what people refer to romantic sound. It just sound so sexy and romantic with jazz and sexa. I would like Jim to build me a Floostander M7 but i would imagine it would be way out of my price range.

Nuance, why dont you spare some time and go audition the Phil? I really wanted your opinion on those as you heard the M7 and have the ST Ribbon, so im sure you can give an honest and unbiased review.

The midrange has some warmth, as in it is intimate and romantic, but the speaker itself is not "warm." A warm speaker is a flawed speaker. I think the depth that the SoundScapes offer gives a perceived warmth, but what you're actually hearing is a better sense of space and accuracy; it's just a natural, believable sound and it draws you in quickly. In comparison, a non-open rear wave design sounds more forward or "in your face," but that is a product of the design.

Hehe, I'm working on getting the go ahead to snatch up a pair of Philly 2's, but no guarantees. We just bought a house and have other expenses. But if I hear/purchase a pair I'll be sure to keep you all informed.

 

[Solid-State]

I would love to see a Chinese clone of this IRS2092 module from Japan in a 3 parallel push-pull MOSFET design. Just look at the tiny heatsinkage for the 4020Hs !

<-- Teac/Essoteric IRS2092 module

The Esoteric I-03 is MSRP $12,000



The fact GranteedEV that Teac has enough balls to feel an IRS2092 is worth over $10k MSRP in a receiver shows they were MIGHTY impressed with it. Yeah it's in the same league as Hypex!



Teac should sell those modules like B&O does ICE IMHO IF it's that much better than the... LOL ROTFL... $45 Chinese modules.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

lol, dennis didn't say that. He said the planars are a better fit with the 70-10d.

And I believe Dennis also said the 70-10 is a better fit than the 70-20 for the Philharmonic.

I've asked Dennis if I could "upgrade" to the RAAL 70-20 & Accuton. He said he could charge me the extra money for the changes, but in his opinion, doing either of those changes would be a "downgrade" for this speaker.

Of course, paying significantly more money for a downgrade would not be crazy; it would be retarded IMO.

 

[GranteedEV]

And I believe Dennis also said the 70-10 is a better fit than the 70-20 for the Philharmonic.

I've asked Dennis if I could "upgrade" to the RAAL 70-20 & Accuton. He said he could charge me the extra money for the changes, but in his opinion, doing either of those changes would be a "downgrade" for this speaker.

I don't know about the audibility, but on paper I can see how it's a downgrade. 20mm vs 10mm at high frequencies... one has half the horizontal radiating surface area so it should have wider off axis response.

20mm is about the width of a 3/4" dome... 10mm is half that width! Most speakers use 1" domes.

 

[GranteedEV]

I've heard those.

...The NC400 came out like 2 weeks ago. Has anyone even built one yet?

 

[smwick]

I agree about Dennis's xover on this loudspeaker. Not only is it interesting in terms of the Raal xover point but also in terms of how low Dennis has that Neo8 running. It's 4LR point is 650Hz and seems really low for that planar. All this stuff is where the "magic" comes in right... I'd really like to see the xover. I'm curious if he had to pad the tweet to match Neo8 output etc. I'm also curious where the xover is physically located in the cab and if future access to it is possible. It's bloody obvious Dennis designed this speaker in many ways around the Neo8. I just hope his xover brilliance makes Neo8 the midrange so many have tried to make it.



This is the EXACT reason I'm looking at these speakers plus I do love Neo8 vocals and planar transducers for reasons partially sited in your above posts.

Even if the low Neo8 xover and my listening habits (loud rock) results in a new Neo8 every couple years I don't mind to get that planar mid sound. Heck I've seen deals at PE on them for as low as $70 a pop!

JUST WATCH YOUR IRON TEMP ON THOSE BLOODY PADS!

Here is a link to the Xover. Scroll down to the second photo to see the Xover. By the way, the ribon mahogany Phil 3's are the ones Dennis built for me .

philharmonicaudio.com

 

[Solid-State]

...The NC400 came out like 2 weeks ago. Has anyone even built one yet?

I've heard UcD180 and 400 without the HxR regulators. It's just a matter of taste right... I like the more tube like sound of the IRS2092. I think it's quantization noise/artifacts due to lack of even order quantization dithering that give it that "warm" sound. It's the most "tube like" digital PWM amplifier I've ever heard.

Gorgeous sound for the $$$.

 

[GranteedEV]

I like the more tube like sound of the IRS2092. I think it's quantization noise/artifacts due to lack of even order quantization dithering that give it that "warm" sound. It's the most "tube like" digital PWM amplifier I've ever heard..

well that'd be a big waste of a good pair of accurate speakers like philharmonics...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

By the way, the ribon mahogany Phil 3's are the ones Dennis built for me .

Very lovely!

Perhaps I missed your review. Have you written a review of your Philharmonic 3?

I have short term memory.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Someone told DenPureSound he should get some 30W tube amps!

I told him, "Hell, no! Your 200wpc Emotiva will kick the a$$ of any 30w tube amps!"

 

[Solid-State]

well that'd be a big waste of a good pair of accurate speakers like philharmonics...

no no man... not really I mean it's not like a tube in the bad sense. It also doesn't colour the sound either. I'm horrible at explaining sound properties of gear. All I can say is it's a very pleasing sound and lacks the "edge" the UcD module have.

 

[GranteedEV]

no no man... not really I mean it's not like a tube in the bad sense. It also doesn't colour the sound either. I'm horrible at explaining sound properties of gear. All I can say is it's a very pleasing sound and lacks the "edge" the UcD module have.

i recommended the ncore module not the ucd

 

[smwick]

Very lovely!

Perhaps I missed your review. Have you written a review of your Philharmonic 3?

I have short term memory.

Yes I have. I may have it in this thread as well, but I don't recall. Here is a link to a review I wrote when I first received them.

My new speaker cabinets

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yes I have. I may have it in this thread as well, but I don't recall. Here is a link to a review I wrote when I first received them.

My new speaker cabinets

Oh, yeah, short term memory I have.