Man Cave V2.0

[mike c]

since rythmik previously used these drivers in their subs (flat to 15hz anechoic) i'd say its safe to bump a little around 20hz - at the cost of some xmax? (what do you think annunaki?)

 

[annunaki]

since rythmik previously used these drivers in their subs (flat to 15hz anechoic) i'd say its safe to bump a little around 20hz - at the cost of some xmax? (what do you think annunaki?)

I would assume it to be safe, but I would also assume the amplifier would then be limited to prevent over excursion. Remember, they may have been flat to 15hz, but at what output level?

 

[Matt34]

I would assume it to be safe, but I would also assume the amplifier would then be limited to prevent over excursion. Remember, they may have been flat to 15hz, but at what output level?

Thanks for the help annunaki! I think I'm going to leave good enough alone for now until I introduce a ported sub to the mix. Right now on the list is an Epik Tower, SVS Ultra and Craigsub's Sasquatch.

 

[annunaki]

Well I took the ASW-8 subs out of the setup. I couldn't get it to work with my limited placement options so I'm back to just the two DS12 subs crossed-over at 80hz which seems to be the best for my room. I found by stacking them in the front corner gave me the smoothest response however. I only had a peak at around 32hz which I was able to tame for the most part. Everything else is pretty much flat up to 150hz besides the +3db house curve for movies.

Matt, the room response looks better than before. How does it sound as opposed to before?

 

[annunaki]

Thanks for the help annunaki! I think I'm going to leave good enough alone for now until I introduce a ported sub to the mix. Right now on the list is an Epik Tower, SVS Ultra and Craigsub's Sasquatch.

Why don't you simply do ported enclosures for the existing subs? The two subs properly set up (perhaps with a DCX2496) should equal or exceed either of the ones listed.

Sure you won't get 10hz response, but it will still be quite impressive, not to mention cheaper by a far margin.

 

[Matt34]

Matt, the room response looks better than before. How does it sound as opposed to before?

Chapter 11 and 30 in Wall-E where the shuttle takes off and lands is great! I get that tactile feel from when I had them near field but it also sounds fuller up in the front corner.

 

[Matt34]

Why don't you simply do ported enclosures for the existing subs? The two subs properly set up (perhaps with a DCX2496) should equal or exceed either of the ones listed.

Sure you won't get 10hz response, but it will still be quite impressive, not to mention cheaper by a far margin.

Finding someone to do a proper enclosure around here is hard to do. I found one person here that does some pretty amazing car audio enclosures and does it right by measuring the T/S of every driver used but he gave me an estimate of $320 per sealed, unfinished enclosure. I didn't even bother to ask how much a ported box would cost.

 

[Matt34]

Forgot to add, I did the Fan Mod for the EP2500, night and day difference! If you have an EP2500 this is a must do mod.

 

[Matt34]

Current bedroom setup, nothing like Warp's but it sounds pretty darn good for what I have invested into it.

I can now fully recommend the TCS ASW-8 subs for a small room setup. I'm really impressed what two of them are doing in this room.

Pioneer 517
Pioneer DV-588a
Wii
LG 32" LCD
X-CS Claissics
X-LS Classics
2x TCS ASW-8

 

[annunaki]

Finding someone to do a proper enclosure around here is hard to do. I found one person here that does some pretty amazing car audio enclosures and does it right by measuring the T/S of every driver used but he gave me an estimate of $320 per sealed, unfinished enclosure. I didn't even bother to ask how much a ported box would cost.

I could easily do vented for that price depending upon the finish, you've seen a couple of my build threads

 

[Matt34]

I could easily do vented for that price depending upon the finish, you've seen a couple of my build threads

But damn the shipping cost.

 

[annunaki]

But damn the shipping cost.

True, they do get heavy, even if ply was used.

 

[WmAx]

But damn the shipping cost.

Oh, come on now, that will be cheap compared to the shipping charges you are going to pay for a certain couple of modifed Primus 362s.

-Chris

 

[Matt34]

Oh, come on now, that will be cheap compared to the shipping charges you are going to pay for a certain couple of modifed Primus 362s.

-Chris

Yeah, don't remind me.

 

[WmAx]

Getting very very close....

Internal diagram of OEM vs. modified. Note: As you will notice, the lower re-enforcement panels were enlarged in actual production because I thought it would look better, and provide over-all more enclosure strength.

These minimum size floorstanders are a real back breaker for me to work with by now. Realize, folks, this has concrete inner shell and solid 1.2" oak bracing every 4" or so inside, and the lower half of the unit has 2.25" thick walls with steel 3/4" embedded into the walls to increase stiffness of the lower section since the woofer motor (8" JL W7) is so huge it does not give me any space for bracing for about a 10" span in two directions.

-Chris

 

[Matt34]

OMG!






Looking good Chris.

 

[mike c]

can't wait to see pics of the drivers put in

super excited for you Matt

 

[jamie2112]

Nice Chris ,as always I am sure it will smoke the competition....

 

[WmAx]

Nice Chris ,as always I am sure it will smoke the competition....

What competition? Unless Matt has a pair of Revel Salon 2's laying around, which this was specifically designed to equal or better in all respects except bass SPL(the Salon2 w/3 x 8" units ported in each, will likely have a bit more bass output under 43Hz even though I'm using the best of the best in 8" drivers here (8" JL Audio W7) with this project...). This will have radically superior off axis, this will have substantially lower cabinet resonance, equal driver resolution(the MMD mid-range in the Primus 360/362 is good enough for any caliber of speaker - it's potential is simply lowered radically in it's USE in the stock Primus due to the incredibly resonant cabinet system and of course, very poor midbass response with the huge midbass hump in the OEM response curve), though I know a lot of people would will refuse to believe that such a cheap speaker would come with a mid-range of that caliber. The Salon 2 will have slightly flatter response through the treble, as the ribbon tweeter I am using has some deviation between on and off axis due to a small waveguide on it, but that is not substantial, and the off axis linearity provided by this tweeter more than makes up for the little bit of deviation. Much wider and more realistic soundstage will be possible with correct room placement and acoustics because of the much wider dispersion this tweeter provides. This is a 4 way fully active system. It will have the ability to of course let Matt adjust baffle step compensation to the exact amount needed for his room to get neutral mid-range balance - a feature that virtually no passive xover speaker offers - and this is a big deal as the exact amount of compensation that is ideal depends on distance from walls, room size, etc.. Also, he has the ability adjust treble tilt for ideal overall treble energy output. In addition, he can choose the LF safety roll off point. If he wanted to use the unit only down to about 43 Hz, it could easily have the dynamic range of the Salon 2 with the single W7 8". But he can have it go down to 30Hz, but some compromise in output will be had, as that 8" has to go to extreme stroke levels to get high output now, and it has no port to help out like the Salon 2 has. Adding port would have added a couple of hundred dollars or more to the construction cost of Matt's speakers due to the expansion of the back and complex assembly to remain resonance free, and incorporating a proper folded slot port. Please realize, it would not simply be a folded port added to the cabinet with a solid connection; it would have to be added with a floating suspension to prevent the large spanning non braced slot areas from becoming resonant, or other complex building to prevent resonance. But, with the port, it could have extension down to 23-24Hz with no compromise in distortion or SPL output due to this extraordinary driver technology, even though it's only an 8" driver. The only comparable(or perhaps even superior) 8" driver, that would have been my choice, was made by TC Sounds, but it has not been available for a long time since the company is currently not producing anything and may not ever produce anything again, though it is said they are trying very hard to re-structure and get back into business. The crossover on this speaker is fully active 4 way. It uses a DCX2496. In order to get the LF active and extending the 3 way DCX to 4 way with minimal cost, a Behringer CX2310 is being utilized. The mid and high outputs from the DCX will be used normally, feeding the 4" mid and ribbon tweeter amps directly. The LF output from the DCX, however, will be routed to a CX2310. The DCX will be set to cross the LF from the midbasses to mids, around 500Hz. Then the signal fed to the CX2310 will be further split at 80Hz to feed the 8" W7 LF driver amp and the mid-bass driver amp. This will allow 4 way split, while still having full control over all drivers by the DCX, without having the expense of paying for a 2nd DCX. The CX2310 is only $80, as compared to $275 for another DCX2496.

I think I saw Matt mention something about the passive crossovers still being usable in a prior post or thread. I want to make it clear that the old passive crossover board can still be used in the speaker, but Matt will have to swap out the ribbon tweeter for the original Primus tweeter and remove the safety capacitor from the tweeter circuit inside the cabinet. Also, the 8W7 would not be usable unless an active crossover was used, of course. A parametric EQ would be needed to compensate for the roll off in the small sealed cabinet section that the 8W7 resides within. Though, I could not imagine anyone wanting to use the original passive xover; the overall result would be significantly decreased sound quality.

-Chris

 

[Matt34]

Yeah, what he said ^^