do i need a amp? when my reciever has almost as many watts?

  • Thread starter cheapskete OCer
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cheapskete OCer

Audioholic
helpful as always , unless i buy the axioms ill skip the amp...but i will need 2 mono blocks or something for the 4ohm m80s with my onkyo 705 right?
 
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chadnliz

Senior Audioholic
A traditional class A won't increase anything but the power bill. It's a worthless technology for audio amplifiers - completely wasteful in terms of the power supply, heatsinking and power use, while producing no audible difference.

-Chris
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true, its not my fault you either cant hear or afford to experience better sound. As far as the slap goes that wouldnt happen if you were not hiding behind a keyboard, internet alpha males are a dime a dozen, intelligence and bravado are both virtual.....not reality.
 
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Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true, its not my fault you either cant hear or afford to experience better sound. As far as the slap goes that wouldnt happen if you were not hiding behind a keyboard, internet alpha males are a dime a dozen, intelligence and bravado are both virtual.....not reality.
Let me be the first to say you have no freigen clue what you are talking about.;)
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
... They aren't all rated for it for one reason or another. ....)
They are not rated for it because the requirements are rigorous: preconditioning at a certain level into that impedance load with sine waves, not music:D, then you test at the design power for more and longer.
But, that is not how music is, so certainly a 4 ohm load or even a dip below it with a music signal that has very short RMS values, not like the sine wave at 70.7% is not an big deal:D
 
Adam

Adam

Audioholic Jedi
...internet alpha males are a dime a dozen...
So true. I, however, am a slightly more rare breed - an internet omega male. Heck, I'm exposing my belly right now...

[Sorry in advance for the mental image. :D]
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
[Sorry in advance for the mental image. :D]
That's unkind. I had no mental image other than one of a dog until reading that.
Now I see a mewling naked man. Uhggg...LOL :D
 
Adam

Adam

Audioholic Jedi
That's unkind. I had no mental image other than one of a dog until reading that.
Now I see a mewling naked man. Uhggg...LOL :D
Sorry, my friend. I should have noted that I am fully clothed. While exposing my tender underbelly, I still maintain a protective layer of thin cotton. :)
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true, its not my fault you either cant hear or afford to experience better sound. As far as the slap goes that wouldnt happen if you were not hiding behind a keyboard, internet alpha males are a dime a dozen, intelligence and bravado are both virtual.....not reality.
I take it that you can 'afford' and 'hear' better sound.
Are you an 'alpha male' in reality? Not just a rude, unwelcome loud mouth?
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true, its not my fault you either cant hear or afford to experience better sound. As far as the slap goes that wouldnt happen if you were not hiding behind a keyboard, internet alpha males are a dime a dozen, intelligence and bravado are both virtual.....not reality.
What he said was true if we are referring to modern amplifiers. Output biasing is done to improve efficiency. Yes, it also produces added distortion and that was meaningful in the tube days where distortion was and sometimes still is audible. With modern solid state amplifiers, the distortion generated by a more efficient biasing of the output transistors is inaudible. So while it might be higher, it doesn't matter since we can't hear it. Like most high end audiophile things, the manufacturer takes some audio issue that may not apply to the application in question and markets a product based on that. Marketing an amplifier because it has less inaudible distortion than one with more inaudible distortion is just one example.

Putting a 200 watt amplifier to drive a tweeter in a biamplified speaker system is another example of this sort of thing. Tweeters only need milliwatts yet people stand in line to biamplify them.

Assigning audibility to DAC's by blaming jitter, another inaudible phenomenon, is yet another.

Since it matters to you, let me say I can afford whatever sound I want and, in my high end audio days wasted six figures on high end audio gear. I've had my hearing tested by an audiologist and it is quite normal so I can hear better sound when it presents itself. While I think 100 lb. class A state amplifiers are cool, I wouldn't spend my money on one even though I could if I wanted to. I've owned a few and tested several of them and they provide no sonic advantage whatsoever. That's not opinion, by the way, that is bias controlled test results.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true,
That's true, but just because the difference (e.g. between class A & class A/B) is there, it doesn't mean you can hear it. Birds and some animals can hear things that we cannot, that's a fact, right? Anyway, I wouldn't want to respond to anything else beyond your first comma....
 
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chadnliz

Senior Audioholic
So true. I, however, am a slightly more rare breed - an internet omega male. Heck, I'm exposing my belly right now...

[Sorry in advance for the mental image. :D]
I can see your man boobs:confused:
 
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chadnliz

Senior Audioholic
Let me be the first to say you have no freigen clue what you are talking about.;)
How long did it take you to pen that burp of brilliance?, you are infact the first to say that and I am not surprised...empty cans make the most noise.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
How long did it take you to pen that burp of brilliance?, you are infact the first to say that and I am not surprised...empty cans make the most noise.
I'm sure your brilliance has no bounds.

I have viewed much of WmAx's work, he knows audio much better than I do. I'm not necessarily trying to defend him so much as belittle you. You make horse's rear of yourself in countless threads. Don't you wonder why you sit on the line of green/red chiklets all the time?

It seems your understanding of audio extends to, "the more I spend, the better my sound". Class A amplification (of the tube variety) is typically intended to sound different (audible distortion). Class A amplifiers such as Halcro, while pretty, are overglorified amplifiers that more than likely produce as accurate (at least in the audible range) as a Behringer EP2500 pro amplifier, only with much less power.
 
Adam

Adam

Audioholic Jedi
Peace, my friends! Please. To quote Mr. Rodney King, "Can't we all just get along?"

I'm not saying that we can't disagree, but come on! Personal attacks do no good.

[As a frame of reference, I'm a little drunk - so I'm trying to be a peace maker. Tomorrow morning, I'll be calling for blood... :)]
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
I'm a little drunk - so I'm trying to be a peace maker. :)]
If alcohol is the makings of a peace maker,
I'm afraid you're gonna have to kick it up a notch and start hitting the hard stuff. :D
Beer just ain't cuttin' it. :)
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
Just becaue thats what you think doesnt make it true, its not my fault you either cant hear or afford to experience better sound. As far as the slap goes that wouldnt happen if you were not hiding behind a keyboard, internet alpha males are a dime a dozen, intelligence and bravado are both virtual.....not reality.
Sir, I made no 'slap', that was some other poster. As for 'better'; my main interest is 'better', in terms of provable/quantifiable difference. In fact, I once bought into the audiophile madness, and wasted money on such non-sense. But that was many years ago. I learned from my mistakes and now focus on real differences that can be shown to exist with proper controlled/bias free listening tests and/or correlation with credible perceptual research as it relates to measured parameters.

For audio listening purposes, class A offers nothing provable that can make any audible difference. If the crossover distortion in a standard modern(last 20-25 years) solid state audio amplifier is audible, it can only be due to defective/broken unit or extraordinary poor design, resulting in far higher levels of crossover distortion than are normal. Other things that can cause audible differences are not really due to amplification stage topology(extreme output impedance differences, deliberate frequency response modification of audible amounts, non-level matched, non-blinded comparisons that allow listener bias to enter the picture, etc.).

-Chris
 
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