Illegal Immigration? Watch this.

[johndoe]

If we're serious about stopping illegal immigration we need to suck it up and stop demanding the ridiculously low cost services these illegal workers provide. Either mow your own lawn or have somebody do it for you at a reasonable rate. Apply this to everything we are used to have done for next to nothing, and think just how many things those are. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people saying that they want their country free of illegal immigrants, but don't connect the fact that that's why they're having their house cleaned for $25, their lawn mowed for $15, their U.S.-grown produce at reasonable prices, etc. you can't have it both ways. Also, are you aware that from all the illegal immigrant crossing the U.S.-Mexico border, only Mexicans are deported when caught? Everyone else gets a court citation for a few weeks later... guess how many of them show up.
There's really no easy solution to the problem. Deport 12 million illegals, millions of them to remote corner of the world? Create a difficult, expensive, but attainable path to legality?

 

[annunaki]

If we're serious about stopping illegal immigration we need to suck it up and stop demanding the ridiculously low cost services these illegal workers provide. Either mow your own lawn or have somebody do it for you at a reasonable rate. Apply this to everything we are used to have done for next to nothing, and think just how many things those are. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people saying that they want their country free of illegal immigrants, but don't connect the fact that that's why they're having their house cleaned for $25, their lawn mowed for $15, their U.S.-grown produce at reasonable prices, etc. you can't have it both ways. Also, are you aware that from all the illegal immigrant crossing the U.S.-Mexico border, only Mexicans are deported when caught? Everyone else gets a court citation for a few weeks later... guess how many of them show up.
There's really no easy solution to the problem. Deport 12 million illegals, millions of them to remote corner of the world? Create a difficult, expensive, but attainable path to legality?

Actually, if the able bodied on welfare were made to do something for their money (i.e. work these jobs) there would be no problem deporting them. We could have it both ways. Think of it as a reward system. IF you are able bodied and receiving welfare you must now accept any position offered in order to receive benefits. They would be rewarded for their work, rather than for laziness.

 

[markw]

Great idea and I'll back ya 110%.

Actually, if the able bodied on welfare were made to do something for their money (i.e. work these jobs) there would be no problem deporting them. We could have it both ways. Think of it as a reward system. IF you are able bodied and receiving welfare you must now accept any position offered in order to receive benefits. They would be rewarded for their work, rather than for laziness.

But good luck implementing it. I'm sure there are enough "advocates" that will say their rights are being violated in some way, shape of form.

They tried "workfare" and it died a blazing death.

 

[johndoe]

Actually, if the able bodied on welfare were made to do something for their money (i.e. work these jobs) there would be no problem deporting them. We could have it both ways. Think of it as a reward system. IF you are able bodied and receiving welfare you must now accept any position offered in order to receive benefits. They would be rewarded for their work, rather than for laziness.

It makes great sense on paper. But since these would be fully legal U.S. citizens they would HAVE TO get paid more -or else here comes the wrath of extreme civil rights advocates (nothing wrong with moderates), with all the political clout they have.

Another thought on this. I heard recently on NPR that some governor in Mexico is urging everybody down there to start structural economic reforms to prevent people from migrating. His reasoning being that in short term, it is good to receive the remittances from the U.S., but in the long term they need to create the conditions for them to want to stay, otherwise there will be a collapse. It's becoming a real concern on both sides of the border, and I think that's a good thing. I'm being optimistic.

 

[mike c]

This thread has nothing to do with legal immigration.

I totally disagree about ILLEGAL imigration, but I thought the video in the first post was talking about LEGAL immigration.

(I'm on dial up at work, so I can't watch it again)

 

[Yamahaluver]

Not all European migrants were law abiding citizens who became model countrymen, the whole mafia clan was imported and flourished for generations, it still exists now and is passed on from one generation to others, all kinds of migration will bring problems, its futile to accuse one group of wrongs and make the other one look like a saint. Unless you are telling me that the Coppola/Puzio glorified world of Mafia is chic, then you would agree that the Mafia did a lot of grave damage to US society over the time. As I said, don't condone any kind of illegal immigration, but legal immigration has been the basis of US since its' existence, to stop that would ruin the entire purpose of this nation, I am all for immigration of educated, skilled category, but the uneducated also needs help, so if we make a sort of criteria for legal immigration into US, then even the uneducated unskilled would have to acquire some skills for sustenance.

I feel since we all are naturalized citizens in US, past and present, we have no right to curtail legal immigration, but illegal immigration has to be stopped at any cost.

 

[annunaki]

It makes great sense on paper. But since these would be fully legal U.S. citizens they would HAVE TO get paid more -or else here comes the wrath of extreme civil rights advocates (nothing wrong with moderates), with all the political clout they have.

Another thought on this. I heard recently on NPR that some governor in Mexico is urging everybody down there to start structural economic reforms to prevent people from migrating. His reasoning being that in short term, it is good to receive the remittances from the U.S., but in the long term they need to create the conditions for them to want to stay, otherwise there will be a collapse. It's becoming a real concern on both sides of the border, and I think that's a good thing. I'm being optimistic.

Why would they need more? They are making it as it is now? Chances are they are receiving more than the minimum wage would pay.

None of our lawmakers have balls anymore, nor do they represent the everday average citizen. We are very much a bureacracy.

 

[caupina]

During the time of the European influx, we were in need of skilled workers who would add fuel to the fire of our burgeoning economy. They went through the proper channels to come here, worked hard, learned the language, put down roots, raised their families here, and were not a burden to the country that was kind enough to let them live here. Within a generation or two they were indistinguishable from any people who had been here for generations before them.

Nowadays, the concept is not to integrate into this country. It's to sneak across the border, live in crowded hovels, work off the books, spend as little as possible here and send as much money back to the home country as possible and eventually go home leaving nothing. ...and we pay their medical bills!

Either that, or send a pregnant cow here to drop a baby and then move the entire extended family here and, unlike the legal European immigrants, get free medical care and force the current generation of Americans to cater the them rather than integrate into the society. Of course, they don't/won't speak English and will demand that services are provided in a language they understand.

What's funny is that virtually every other people (European, Asian, African, everyone) that came here had the brains and drive to learn the language. Why can't they?

They add nothing to this economy. All they do is drive the wage levels of unskilled labor jobs down and hurt the indigenous peoples. This is analogous to termites destroying the structure of a building from the inside.


no, most of those sneaking into this country and living in the shadows are unskilled labor, and we have enough locals that could do these jobs without these people driving the wage scale down, assuming they could be paid a living wage.

Now, my solution is to finger print everyone. Everyone. Natural born Americans as well. If a question arises, check the fingerprint database. If you don't belong here, out you go. If you're caught several times here illegally, well then, they want to be here in the worst way. So be it. We'll provide their basic living needs, but their freedoms will be seriously curtailed. Live in barracks and their services will be provided to local businesses at very low rates that would make the minimum wage appear to be a gold mine. OF course, the option to leave and never return will be available for a while but, after a few times of getting caught, it becomes permanent.

Yeah, it's a form of slavery but it's not like they were forced into it.

That's pretty harsh!!!!....it's obvious that your post is directed to all of us south of the border and I resent it. While I don't condone any kind of illegal immigration not only in the States but in any part of the world, that doesn't put me in a position to denigrate those who do, like you have. Calling a female a "a pregnant cow here to drop a baby ", what kind of insulting statement is that????.
You know, not all latinos have USD 100 to pay for a US visitor visa, and even if they apply and pay the fee, chances are they are going to be turned down and the fee forfeited. You know how much you can do with a hundred bucks anywhere but in the US...let me tell you...a lot!!!, that's a lot more than some central or south American minimun wage, so most of those illegal immigrants saw a chance (unlawfully), and took it, so they could build a better future for their families. I don't think these people risk their lives just to make an easy buck, there's a lot more than that.

 

[furrycute]

How much money have we spent on this so called "War on Drugs?"

Has it stopped the flow of drugs into this country? Those countless hundreds of billions we have spent on this drug war hasn't even put a dent on this drug problem.

Supply and demand. If there is a demand, nature will always find a way.

 

[markw]

That's pretty harsh!!!!....it's obvious that your post is directed to all of us south of the border and I resent it. While I don't condone any kind of illegal immigration not only in the States but in any part of the world, that doesn't put me in a position to denigrate those who do, like you have. Calling a female a "a pregnant cow here to drop a baby ", what kind of insulting statement is that????.

first off, let me make it clear that I have no issues with people who play by the rules in coming here to make a life for themselves. Obviously, they have needed skills and want to add to the greatness and wealth of this country. It's those that come here to suck it dry that rile me.

Sorry, but that's how I (and others) view anchor babies. They drop their load (at our expense) and we're stuck paying for their medical expenses and have to change our language to suit them? And now the whole family follows. Get off it.

How come every other nationality came here LEGALLY learned the language, blended in and made a home here, and youse can't?

You know, not all latinos have USD 100 to pay for a US visitor visa, and even if they apply and pay the fee, chances are they are going to be turned down and the fee forfeited. You know how much you can do with a hundred bucks anywhere but in the US...let me tell you...a lot!!!, that's a lot more than some central or south American minimun wage, so most of those illegal immigrants saw a chance (unlawfully), and took it, so they could build a better future for their families. I don't think these people risk their lives just to make an easy buck, there's a lot more than that.

So, what you're saying is that once they sneak across the border they should be home free and get a prize? Sorry, that's not gonna make it in my book.

We make it way too attractive to sneak in here. I'm of the attitude that we should apply the same rules to people sneaking into our country that Mexico does to people caught sneaking into there. That's fair, isn't it?

OK, so your country has problems. Stay there and fix it. Don't run here and expect us to make all your problems go away. That's what they want and we're sick of it. Make your own fortune where you are born.

Our country has problems, too, and we can't afford to fix both ours and yours as well. We have unskilled labors here too and they need work as well. The difference is that they don't qualify for free benefits like you illegals do. They have to play by the rules. By your guys working off the books for less than we can afford to, you drive down the wage scale. But, by to the hospitals for free medical, you can afford that.

How come youse sneak in, live in hovels, work off the books* send most of the money back to the home country and eventually move back there? All that does is take money our of our country and put it in yours. The way a thriving economy works is that money made there should be spent there. We're kinda tired of being sucked dry.

AFAICT, we should not be rewarding such behaviour.

*and yes, the people who employ these illegals should be made to pay as well.

We're tired of Mexico and other countries exporting their economic problems on this country. If you don't want to be viewed in that light, then do something about it. Fix your own problems.

 

[Yamahaluver]

And what happens when a country can't fix its problem, we then invade them in name of liberation

 

[superstar]

It is not illegal immigration that is bleeding this country, it is corruptness and greed. As for the govt spending money and illegal immigrants using it up in health care, I don't think that can make a dent for us to actually see/feel it. Not all illegal immigrants get sick or need an expensive medical procedure, and those that need medical procedure are very skeptical in going to the hospitals for fear of deportation. Go to any hospital's ER and I bet you that you do not see the majority as non-speaking english people but the opposite, english speaking that look like they are homeless.

Our budget mainly goes to the military http://www.fcnl.org/issues/item.php?item_id=2336&issue_id=18

 

[markw]

Go to any hospital's ER and I bet you that you do not see the majority as non-speaking english people but the opposite, english speaking that look like they are homeless.

You're not from around here, are ya?

And, yes, there are english speaking peoples here as well but believe me, they are far, far outnumbered by the non-english speaking peoples.

That's the beauty of guaranteed medical care. If you aren't documented, you don't have to pay. Everyone else pays more.

 

[caupina]

first off, let me make it clear that I have no issues with people who play by the rules in coming here to make a life for themselves. Obviously, they have needed skills and want to add to the greatness and wealth of this country. It's those that come here to suck it dry that rile me.

Sorry, but that's how I (and others) view anchor babies. They drop their load (at our expense) and we're stuck paying for their medical expenses and have to change our language to suit them? And now the whole family follows. Get off it.

How come every other nationality came here LEGALLY learned the language, blended in and made a home here, and youse can't?

So, what you're saying is that once they sneak across the border they should be home free and get a prize? Sorry, that's not gonna make it in my book.

We make it way too attractive to sneak in here. I'm of the attitude that we should apply the same rules to people sneaking into our country that Mexico does to people caught sneaking into there. That's fair, isn't it?

OK, so your country has problems. Stay there and fix it. Don't run here and expect us to make all your problems go away. That's what they want and we're sick of it. Make your own fortune where you are born.

Our country has problems, too, and we can't afford to fix both ours and yours as well. We have unskilled labors here too and they need work as well. The difference is that they don't qualify for free benefits like you illegals do. They have to play by the rules. By your guys working off the books for less than we can afford to, you drive down the wage scale. But, by to the hospitals for free medical, you can afford that.

How come youse sneak in, live in hovels, work off the books* send most of the money back to the home country and eventually move back there? All that does is take money our of our country and put it in yours. The way a thriving economy works is that money made there should be spent there. We're kinda tired of being sucked dry.

AFAICT, we should not be rewarding such behaviour.

*and yes, the people who employ these illegals should be made to pay as well.

We're tired of Mexico and other countries exporting their economic problems on this country. If you don't want to be viewed in that light, then do something about it. Fix your own problems.

If you had read my post thouroughly you'd noticed that I didn't condone any kind of illegal immigration anywhere.
I'm not saying your wrong on your opinions, I'm just saying that you could've gotten your point across without denigrating others who don't share the same opinion.

And last but not least, I'm here legally, paying taxes and all, and I was sent here by my company, I didn't choose to come, so it doesn't make a difference to me if I live here or there.

Once again I don't condone any kind of illegal activity, but just don't put the blame on the mexicans or any illegal alien, because as long as there are people willing to hire them, they are going to keep coming.

I do agree with Yammaluver post though, you guys take the world upon your shoulders and do everything in the name of freedom (and politics). How come you've invaded Irak in the name of human rights, freedom and terrorism, but not Cuba. Hey, Chavez, in Venezuela, is making a fool out your foreign policy, but nobody does anything. That's B.S.

 

[Tomorrow]

How come you've invaded Irak in the name of human rights, freedom and terrorism, but not Cuba. Hey, Chavez, in Venezuela, is making a fool out your foreign policy, but nobody does anything. That's B.S.

No, Iraq was not invaded "in the name of human rights, freedom and terrorism". Iraq was invaded when the WORLD'S intelligence groups all agreed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction and he had defied U.N. inspection requirements multiple times. By extension, this country was worried about some of these weapons falling into Al Quida hands, which was the 'real' reason for our participation in the invasion.

I'm curious. What is your country of origin?

 

[markw]

If you had read my post thouroughly you'd noticed that I didn't condone any kind of illegal immigration anywhere.

Then we have no issues.

I'm not saying your wrong on your opinions, I'm just saying that you could've gotten your point across without denigrating others who don't share the same opinion.

I guess it's just the attitude I got from seeing the results of what we're talking about first hand. Where I'm from there are areas we avoid because it's like walking in a third world country. You're looked at like you're crazy (or about to be killed) when you speak English.

And last but not least, I'm here legally, paying taxes and all, and I was sent here by my company, I didn't choose to come, so it doesn't make a difference to me if I live here or there.

You don't seem to be complaining about it.

Once again I don't condone any kind of illegal activity, but just don't put the blame on the mexicans or any illegal alien, because as long as there are people willing to hire them, they are going to keep coming.

If I generalized, I apologize, but when you consider that virtually all of these spanish speaking peoples came in from the southern border, I'm pretty sure you can see where I got that idea from.

And, yes, those that hire these peoples should be forced to pay heavy, heavy fines, at least until we officiallly create a slave class from illegals on their third illegal entry which can be leased out cheap to businesses

I do agree with Yammaluver post though, you guys take the world upon your shoulders and do everything in the name of freedom (and politics). How come you've invaded Irak in the name of human rights, freedom and terrorism, but not Cuba. Hey, Chavez, in Venezuela, is making a fool out your foreign policy, but nobody does anything. That's B.S.

now you're the one generalizing. You make it seem like we all stand behind bush. As long as we're generalizing, I bet y'all would love it if we took over Mexico and that area. Then you all could legally apply for welfare, right? Free Money! No Work! It's fiesta and siesta time!

We'll see how well Chavez does when he finally forces all the rich out of his country. That area of the world has a poor track record with dictators and socialism in case you didn't notice. It seems the drug lords have more control than the government but, just like in Mexico, it's hard to tell them apart.

And, before you get all high and mighty, know that my wife is from Brasil and I have other relatives by marriage from the DR as well. All share my views on illegals. They had nothing handed to them and had to work for it, and so should everyone else.

 

[caupina]

No, Iraq was not invaded "in the name of human rights, freedom and terrorism". Iraq was invaded when the WORLD'S intelligence groups all agreed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction and he had defied U.N. inspection requirements multiple times. By extension, this country was worried about some of these weapons falling into Al Quida hands, which was the 'real' reason for our participation in the invasion.

I'm curious. What is your country of origin?

Do you really believe that???? It looks to me that the main reason was (is) OIL. Well, I don't have all the facts to start an argument so is just a personal opinion.

I might have missed some news, but did they ever find the WMD????

The U.N., I believe, suggested a different way of action, but the U.S. just said we are going to make it our own way.

By the way I'm from Chile (probably a country you've never heard of before, or if you did it was because of Pinochet)

 

[caupina]

Then we have no issues.

I guess it's just the attitude I got from seeing the results of what we're talking about first hand. Where I'm from there are areas we avoid because it's like walking in a third world country. You're looked at like you're crazy (or about to be killed) when you speak English.

You don't seem to be complaining about it.

If I generalized, I apologize, but when you consider that virtually all of these spanish speaking peoples came in from the southern border, I'm pretty sure you can see where I got that idea from.

now you're the one generalizing. You make it seem like we all stand behind bush. As long as we're generalizing, I bet y'all would love it if we took over Mexico and that area. Then you all could legally apply for welfare, right? Free Money! No Work! It's fiesta and siesta time!

We'll see how well Chavez does when he finally forces all the rich out of his country. That area of the world has a poor track record with dictators and socialism in case you didn't notice. It seems the drug lords have more control than the government but, just like in Mexico, it's hard to tell them apart.

And, before you get all high and mighty, know that my wife is from Brasil and I have other relatives by marriage from the DR as well. All share my views on illegals. They had nothing handed to them and had to work for it, and so should everyone else.

The flag you carry when you invade some other country is the USA flag, so of course I have to generalize, the same way you do when saying that Mexico is just "fiesta and siesta time". Not all the people in Latin America are lazy, and in case you didn't notice there's a whole bunch of imports that have come from across the border so that means people work hard too in those countries.

I do share your views on illegal immigration too, I just found your comments too insulting.

 

[superstar]

You're not from around here, are ya?

No, I grew up in Spain How did you guess?

And, yes, there are english speaking peoples here as well but believe me, they are far, far outnumbered by the non-english speaking peoples.

That's the beauty of guaranteed medical care. If you aren't documented, you don't have to pay. Everyone else pays more.

I guess I was trying to point out that illegal immigration is not as severe that will damage the economy, there are plenty of other factors, like someone pointed out, if someone is willing to work their butts off for minimum wage they will hire them, should the clothing industry just stopped making their clothes in (insert here where your shirt is from) so they can employ unemployed US citizens? (Those unemployed are far much more likely to deplete the economy than illegal aliens) Should restaurants/construction companies/farmers employ those that are unemployed? I mean, do you think those people that are unemployed are willing to work in those types of jobs? If they wanted to work, they will find work, if an illegal immigrant can bust their *** for $20-$30/day so can those people in welfare. There is no excuse for that.

 

[highfihoney]

No, I grew up in Spain How did you guess?



I guess I was trying to point out that illegal immigration is not as severe that will damage the economy, there are plenty of other factors, like someone pointed out,

All you guys pointing at "other factors" are killing me,are you so blinded that you cant see illegal immigration is a cause & effect situation,not one issue being pointed at as a factor cant be traced directly back to the source,the cause of every last "other factor" is illegal immigration,the effects are drastically increased tax burden on the rest of the country.

You can point at "other factors" as being the problem but the simple truth is that if there were no illegal aliens there would be no "other factors" to point fingers at.

Pointing at other things as being the problem is exactly whats wrong in this country,most people have been wishy washy for so damm long they have lost the ability to make decisive decisions,instead they look at all the "other factors" instead of starting with the problem at hand.

If big business operated the way our wishy washy non condeming government operates it would be doomed to failure.