Robb elementary shooting in TX

[Mikado463]

Article by a trauma surgeon from a while back. In the case of this latest horror, round size and velocity probably played a lesser role to the amount of uncontested time the killer had to work in that room..

A Trauma Surgeon Talks About Wound Ballistics and Stopping Power

"I got involved in wound ballistics and what it really took to stop a threat during residency in Philadelphia because I had a friend on the police force who lost his job for use of excessive force by shooting somebody, I think it was, 18 times, and I always thought, maybe he needed to shoot that...

www.policemag.com

Good article and in the end Vail's comment on .45 vs 9mm sums up the basis for the majority of arguments with respect handgun choices. Also of note, until recently 9mm, like .223 ammo was plentiful and cheap

 

[Mikado463]

Sure, but one can do with a .30 round is not relevant to the point being made in the article. The ballistic properties of the 5.56mm round, i.e. light weight, make it very unstable when it hits a body.

I acknowledged that, thus my reference to FMJ (full metal jacket) comparison

While those may be reasons for you to want to own one, none of them are slam-dunk justifications for the general public having them. That's just my take, for what it's worth...not much.

I do not own nor have ever desired to own an AR-15 but I can tell you, my cousin who managed the largest gun shop in Western NY has sold more AR-15's than probably anyone you know and the reasons I stated are completely valid.

 

[GO-NAD!]

I acknowledged that, thus my reference to FMJ (full metal jacket) comparison



I do not own nor have ever desired to own an AR-15 but I can tell you, my cousin who managed the largest gun shop in Western NY has sold more AR-15's than probably anyone you know and the reasons I stated are completely valid.

The reasons are subjectively valid. Others look at it from a different perspective.

 

[GO-NAD!]

All I can say is that I’ve seen enough in-person demos of such weapons against pumpkins and large water bottles to have a healthy respect for them. I’m just glad the most grizzly usage I’ve personally witnessed was a truck bed full of dead coyotes.

I see no requirement for a semi-automatic for hunting. A bolt-action rifle with a small capacity magazine would be perfectly sufficient.

 

[Mikado463]

The reasons are subjectively valid. Others look at it from a different perspective.

as you look at from 'North of the border'

 

[GO-NAD!]

as you look at from 'North of the border'

Plenty of Americans have similar views.

 

[Mikado463]

I see no requirement for a semi-automatic for hunting.

how much Varmint hunting have you done ?

A bolt-action rifle with a small capacity magazine would be perfectly sufficient.

yep and that is what I use

 

[GO-NAD!]

how much Varmint hunting have you done ?



yep and that is what I use

Do deer count? I had a bolt action Lee Enfield .303 for that.

 

[Dude#1279435]

I knew a guy once when I lived out in the sticks. He'd get paid a couple dollars for every pair of gopher hands he brought back. Because they'd be making holes all over the farm lands. I went with him once, and If they were still alive in the trap, he'd hit them over the head till dead. Then cut off their hands. He once said to me, Are you ok? Think I said something like, Oh, yeah! When it was really more like No, I'm a pussy from the city.

 

[highfigh]

Something like this.....

View attachment 56489

That strikes me as something from the movie 'Brazil', for some reason.

 

[highfigh]

I see no requirement for a semi-automatic for hunting. A bolt-action rifle with a small capacity magazine would be perfectly sufficient.

Unless a larger predator is charging from short distance and/or the shot misses or hits a non-vital spot. Bear and Cougar don't mess around and when a hunter/ranger/etc is startled, aim can be less than great. Not a very good choice in a home invasion, though. The whole "F&ck, I missed!" and the round going through the wall(s) and hitting family members is a problem that many don't consider.

 

[Steve81]

Unless a larger predator is charging from short distance and/or the shot misses or hits a non-vital spot. Bear and Cougar don't mess around and when a hunter/ranger/etc is startled, aim can be less than great. Not a very good choice in a home invasion, though. The whole "F&ck, I missed!" and the round going through the wall(s) and hitting family members is a problem that many don't consider.

In truth, a 12 gauge shotgun seems like a better option for both types of encounters vs an AR-15.

 

[SithZedi]

That strikes me as something from the movie 'Brazil', for some reason.

A Clockwork Orange...Kind of like government rehab.

 

[panteragstk]

In truth, a 12 gauge shotgun seems like a better option for both types of encounters vs an AR-15.

No kidding. You shoot a bear with an AR-15 and you're just going to piss it off.

 

[Mikado463]

Do deer count? I had a bolt action Lee Enfield .303 for that.

LOL, no I wouldn't see deer so classified, although they are a nuisance for sure ! I'm pretty sure here in Pa the most used weapon to kill deer is ones vehicle and not by choice !

 

[GO-NAD!]

LOL, no I wouldn't see deer so classified, although they are a nuisance for sure ! I'm pretty sure here in Pa the most used weapon to kill deer is ones vehicle and not by choice !

Well, I haven't hunted in many years and sold my rifles. Just lost interest. In the meantime, the deer population has increased substantially. They wander through our neighbourhood all the time - and we live in a suburb, not the boonies. My wife has to sprinkle her flower beds with cayenne pepper to keep the deer from devouring them. So, if they aren't varmints, their varmint-adjacent.

 

[highfigh]

In truth, a 12 gauge shotgun seems like a better option for both types of encounters vs an AR-15.

It is, but if someone listens to the recommendation of "Just buy a double barrel shotgun- that's all you need", they'll be having a bad day if their home is invaded by more than one person (unless they're well-hidden and can reload quickly). Imagine three armed dirtbags enter a home and the homeowner hits two of them- the last one, if they decide to stay, now has three guns and two hands, so they can fire a lot of rounds at the homeowner in a short time.

Yeah, it sounds crazy, but it does happen. We recently had a situation where two guys broke into a house, hoping to rob a drug deal. They killed six. In West-Central WI, a retired judge was killed a week ago in his home, by someone he had sentenced to prison fifteen years before. The killer had a hit list, which included Mitch McConnell and Gov Whitmer, from Michigan. I think he also had WI Gov Evers' name on it.

From the ink,
"Wisconsin court records show that Roemer was involved in Uhde's sentencing for a 2002 criminal conviction. In 2005, he sentenced Uhde to six years in state prison and nine years extended supervision for armed burglary, a felony, with concurrent sentences for three lesser counts. Uhde had pleaded no contest to the charges."

Once again, it was someone who wasn't supposed to have a gun.

Suspect who allegedly killed retired judge had hit list that included Mitch McConnell, Gov. Whitmer: Official

Suspect who killed judge had hit list that included Mitch McConnell, Gov. Whitmer, others, official says.

abcnews.go.com

This guy was held at gunpoint by the son of the manager of one of the electronics distributors I use- he had been on the run for a couple of days and did some creative maneuvers to evade capture. He was originally wanted for a Fargo, ND attempted murder.

Police: Fargo fugitive arrested in wounding of 2 Wisconsin officers

DELAFIELD, Wis. (AP) — A man suspected of wounding two police officers in a shooting in Wisconsin on Friday and who is wanted in North Dakota for attempted murder has been arrested following …

www.twincities.com

 

[highfigh]

Well, I haven't hunted in many years and sold my rifles. Just lost interest. In the meantime, the deer population has increased substantially. They wander through our neighbourhood all the time - and we live in a suburb, not the boonies. My wife has to sprinkle her flower beds with cayenne pepper to keep the deer from devouring them. So, if they aren't varmints, their varmint-adjacent.

So, you admit that the increase in the deer population is YOUR fault?

Sure, blame the deer for invading your neighborhood, when it was THEIRS before people took over.

 

[Steve81]

It is, but if someone listens to the recommendation of "Just buy a double barrel shotgun- that's all you need", they'll be having a bad day if their home is invaded by more than one person (unless they're well-hidden and can reload quickly).

I was thinking more along the lines of a Mossberg 500. Of course, 3 on 1 isn’t good odds in your typical home invasion scenario, regardless of what you’re packing.

 

[SithZedi]

China agrees with Mr. Moore. Of course they would. Who knows, it might be the biggest concern they have if they eventually try.

Kind of reminds me of the famous quote from WW2 by Admiral Yamamoto:

“You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass.”

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1535529110906314752