Ukraine – Russia … not more of the last thread

D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Spartan
The original nazis were often very stupid. They underestimated Russia and England, they badly underestimated the United States. Allied intelligence was often much superior to German intelligence because the Nazies thought they wouldn't have to use signal intelligence against their enemy because their enemy was too corrupt and stupid to do anything surprising. Hitler redesigned the government with terrible inefficiencies because he had government offices frequently competing at accomplishing the same task. Many of their earlier gains came about through dumb luck, and it was widely known by military planners that the tide had turned by late 1942 and that defeat was inevitable.

I do think that their ideology was partly what made them stupid. It gave them an unearned arrogance that blinded them to reality. I think much the same thing has now happened with Russia.
I do agree that they made some stupid decisions. Deciding to try to invade Russia in the middle of the winter ranks on the top of that list in my mind.

But you can say the same thing about the Allies. They underestimated Germany. And it cost them dearly in the beinning whether Germany got lucky or not.

We have an opportunity to avoid the same situation playing out with Russia and China. But only if we learn from our past mistakes and not underestimate our enemies.

I agree there ideology and method of government makes them prone to stupid decisions and susceptible to having discrepancies between carrying out initiatives in theory and carrying them out in reality as were seeing demonstrated with Russias conflict in Ukraine

Reminds me of the movie Red Dragon the prequel to Silence of the Lambs where Edward Nortons character is speaking to Hannibal Lecter's character played by Anthony Hopkins in the gym. Lector looks at Norton and says "you caught me so I suppose that makes you think your smarter then me". Nortons character replies "no not smarter at all not even close". "You just had certain disadvantages". "Oh? Lector replies "what were those?". Nortons character replies "your insane."

These nations have fundamental disadvantages in how they think and operate based on ideology. Still they shouldn't be underestimated. I'd rather overprepare for an adversary then underprepare
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Spartan
The original nazis were often very stupid. They underestimated Russia and England, they badly underestimated the United States. Allied intelligence was often much superior to German intelligence because the Nazies thought they wouldn't have to use signal intelligence against their enemy because their enemy was too corrupt and stupid to do anything surprising. Hitler redesigned the government with terrible inefficiencies because he had government offices frequently competing at accomplishing the same task. Many of their earlier gains came about through dumb luck, and it was widely known by military planners that the tide had turned by late 1942 and that defeat was inevitable.

I do think that their ideology was partly what made them stupid. It gave them an unearned arrogance that blinded them to reality. I think much the same thing has now happened with Russia.
Good point Shady I also believed Hitler redesigned his government to fail by doing just as Putin is now eliminating either strong opposition or even to strong of supporters so they the dictator can not be challenged or threatened from retaining there power.

A huge weakness with dictatorships. While it allows the dictator to retain power they lose competent subordinates to implement there goals.

An example of this is the incompetence of Putins generals in the application of this war against Ukraine. He can't afford to have to capable or competent generals. They would pose a threat to him.

A problem with his ideology that we can hopefully exploit to our advantage
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
Defense expert to vg.no: The western Countries and US take great risk by not intervening in Ukraine

Researcher Ståle Ulriksen tells VG that West Europe and Norway must do more to stop the war in Ukraine.

The risk of getting directly involved is that the war may escalate to World War III. But it also involves a great risk not to intervene, Ulriksen says to VG. He is a researcher at Norwegian defence naval war College and has, among other things, previously had a chair in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs' security policy committee.

"If it is the case that when Putin can threaten about something, and we want to avoid escalation at all cost, then Putin can just keep on pushing," he said.

In recent days, several countries in the NATO eastern flank have called for a discussion on what is Europe's "red lines" towards Russia's war against Ukraine. The question has often become what to do when a red line is crossed.

- Nobody really dare to say that. But how much should you really tolerate? This is very similar to the 1930s, when Hitler first enters Austria, then Czechoslovakia, and then it's Poland's turn, says Ulriksen.

He also believes that active military intervention by the West is possible without necessarily leading to a geographical expansion of the war.

Ukrainian President Zelenskyj has repeatedly called for NATO to impose a no-fly zone over the country, which has so far been rejected due to the danger that the war will escalate.

Source:
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
One thing that occurred to me is how this war will impact Russia's declining population. I can't see it doing anything other than accelerating that decline. For those who don't know, Russia has been having a very serious population decline for a while now, and it has been especially rough in the last two years with COVID. This war is doubtlessly going to send Russia into a severe economic depression, which I would guess would exacerbate this trend. The long-term consequences of this invasion may be more catastrophic for Russia than they realize.
Afghanistan war lead to the fall of the Soviet Union .... what happens next
Over a period of just a month there are as many russian soldiers killed as during 10 years of Afghanistan war.

 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Defense expert to vg.no: The western Countries and US take great risk by not intervening in Ukraine

Researcher Ståle Ulriksen tells VG that West Europe and Norway must do more to stop the war in Ukraine.

The risk of getting directly involved is that the war may escalate to World War III. But it also involves a great risk not to intervene, Ulriksen says to VG. He is a researcher at Norwegian defence naval war College and has, among other things, previously had a chair in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs' security policy committee.

"If it is the case that when Putin can threaten about something, and we want to avoid escalation at all cost, then Putin can just keep on pushing," he said.

In recent days, several countries in the NATO eastern flank have called for a discussion on what is Europe's "red lines" towards Russia's war against Ukraine. The question has often become what to do when a red line is crossed.

- Nobody really dare to say that. But how much should you really tolerate? This is very similar to the 1930s, when Hitler first enters Austria, then Czechoslovakia, and then it's Poland's turn, says Ulriksen.

He also believes that active military intervention by the West is possible without necessarily leading to a geographical expansion of the war.

Ukrainian President Zelenskyj has repeatedly called for NATO to impose a no-fly zone over the country, which has so far been rejected due to the danger that the war will escalate.

Source:
I don't think anyone is confident that Putin would refrain from using nukes and that's why NATO and the West haven't moved in. In an all-out conventional war and using the past month as a reference, Russia would surely lose. The first thing the US did at the outset of the Gulf Wars was to disable the radar systems but since this hasn't been much of an air war, they're not much of a factor but if the US and allies send aircraft to snuff the Russians, I think it would be over in a matter of days. Hell, Iraqi soldiers were surrendering to our drones!

Now, Putin is saying that the West is using Cancel Culture. Poor baby. Pretty pathetic, coming from the former head of KGB.

 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
I think it is pretty obvious and clear that if putler could use nuclear weapons in Ukraine without fear of retalliation, he would.... without hesitation.

I reckon the only thing that can stop putler is the west showing real force, and so far we did not really go that far, did we?..... still we are pumping billions of USD worth of money into russia, every month, we did not react when russia invaded donbass and Crimea, we are not really doing that extremely tuff sanctions yet (oil and gas to Europe is excluded and some russian banks are still connected to SWIFT), there are many views of a no-fly zone, I don´t know the answers here

We may think that putlers messages are pathetic, but he is not adressing us, it is part of the message going to russian people.... so many of them may believe it, it looks like most russians in russia is pretty boneheaded, not very much thinking in there. Even fathers and mothers in russia do not believe the sons when they say what happens in Ukraine.
 
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highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I think it is pretty obvious and clear that if putler could use nuclear weapons in Ukraine without fear of retalliation, he would.... without hesitation.

I reckon the only thing that can stop putler is the west showing real force, and so far we did not really go that far, did we?..... still we are pumping billions of USD worth of money into russia, every month, we did not react when russia invaded donbass and Crimea, we are not really doing that extremely tuff sanctions yet (oil and gas to Europe is excluded and some russian banks are still connected to SWIFT), there are many views of a no-fly zone, I don´t know the answers here
But, does he think Mother Russia will be spared from radiation and its effects?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Maybe that´s what´s stopping him?
If his sending 7K-15K soldiers to their needless deaths is any indication, I doubt it. The reports state that three times as many have been wounded, in a month. That's not a carefully planned effort.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I guess it was never 100% verified that the dead body found was actually Hitler ...
But it sure looked good in print......Once again, the historians seem to have gotten it wrong.
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
If his sending 7K-15K soldiers to their needless deaths is any indication, I doubt it. The reports state that three times as many have been wounded, in a month. That's not a carefully planned effort.
Yes, latest statement is 40.000+ soldiers out of the loop, including 16.000+ killed
Seems like the people around putler only tell him what he wants to hear, so there is no real communication here

From what I hear now, the Ukrainian troops around Kyiv is doing insanely well organized counterattacks and they start to push back :cool:
 
SithZedi

SithZedi

Audioholic General
Hitler go boom, according to the history books. Some think he escaped to South America.
If you believe the Soviet autopsy report, he died by suicide.
Allegedly Stalin had some of his organs put in jars and sent back to Moscow for "soviet' examination and they burned the rest of the body to dust. The remains were later dug up again in the 70s and thrown into the river.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Yes, latest statement is 40.000+ soldiers out of the loop, including 16.000+ killed
Seems like the people around putler only tell him what he wants to hear, so there is no real communication here

From what I hear now, the Ukrainian troops around Kyiv is doing insanely well organized counterattacks and they start to push back :cool:
Did you see this?

 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
If you believe the Soviet autopsy report, he died by suicide.
Allegedly Stalin had some of his organs put in jars and sent back to Moscow for "soviet' examination and they burned the rest of the body to dust. The remains were later dug up again in the 70s and thrown into the river.
It's a shame they couldn't lob him into an active volcano while he was alive.
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
Ukrainian authorities claim russian general yakov rezantsev has been killed.

The Ministry of Defense of Ukraine claims that russian General yakov rezantsev has been killed, according to the BBC. He is said to have been killed near the Ukrainian city of Kherson.

The channel writes that this is the seventh russian general to be killed in Ukraine.

Ukrainian media reported on Friday that the general was killed at the Chornobaivka air base near Kherson, which russia uses as a command post and has been attacked by the Ukrainian military several times, writes the BBC.

(on purpose I write everything russian with small letters, they don´t deserve capital letters in names)

source: vg.no

9hdTUFJ.jpeg
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Warlord
If you believe the Soviet autopsy report, he died by suicide.
Allegedly Stalin had some of his organs put in jars and sent back to Moscow for "soviet' examination and they burned the rest of the body to dust. The remains were later dug up again in the 70s and thrown into the river.
I don´t believe anything coming from soviet union!
 

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