Yamaha AVENTAGE 2021 AV Receivers Bulk Up on Power and 8K Features

[Am_P]

If Epson ever comes out with an 8K-Rez, 8K-Lumen Laser PJ, I will probably just get a Yamaha A6 for my 5.2.4 HT system.

If anyone is asking why not the A8, the answer is because I only need 9 speakers, not 11.

I love my CX-A5100, but I am ready to say that AVR-alone is all I need for my 9 RBH speakers. The external amp (MX-A5000) can be used for my subwoofers. But the AVR alone is all I need for the 9 speakers.

What?? You're going from a pre-pro to a receiver?? It's a sad day indeed. These low standards forum grunts have brought you down to their level.
That wonderful day when the CX-A5300 pre-pro gets released with Auro-3D and Auromatic, just take my money man. I am uppity that way...pre-pro uppity...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I deleted that post because I realized every points I made had been made already but for some reasons I missed a page or two. You are okay with RCAs, and won't miss the "click"?

Oh, hells no, not the RCA!

I forgot these AVRs don’t have XLR for subwoofer outputs.

Everyone has a weakness.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

What?? You're going from a pre-pro to a receiver?? It's a sad day indeed. These low standards forum grunts have brought you down to their level.
That wonderful day when the CX-A5300 pre-pro gets released with Auro-3D and Auromatic, just take my money man. I am uppity that way...pre-pro uppity...

@PENG just reminded me about the RCA outputs for the subs. I can’t handle that. So looks like the CX-A5300 it is!

 

[PENG]

Oh, hells no, not the RCA!

I forgot these AVRs don’t have XLR for subwoofer outputs.

At least they have them for LR, wish they would do the C and Subs too.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

At least they have them for LR, wish they would do the C and Subs too.

If I were to get something like the RX-A6C or A6D, etc., I would just need XLR for the subs since I don’t plan on using any external amps for the speakers. The only external amps I would use are for the subs.

 

[clone1008]

These low standards forum grunts have brought you down to their level.

Since you're in here, what's that say about you then?

 

[Trell]

Since you're in here, what's that say about you then?

I'm not sure that he is intellectually capable of understanding the irony.

 

[clone1008]

I'm not sure that he is intellectually capable of understanding the irony.

Obviously

 

[PENG]

If I were to get something like the RX-A6C or A6D, etc., I would just need XLR for the subs since I don’t plan on using any external amps for the speakers. The only external amps I would use are for the subs.

Got you. I am a little keener on XLR now only because I plan on switching my class AB amps to the VTV or Buckeye amps that all can take advantage of XLR's higher voltage.

 

[PENG]

@PENG just reminded me about the RCA outputs for the subs. I can’t handle that. So looks like the CX-A5300 it is!

If you are concerned with the available voltage, it looks like Yamaha got that covered:

Rated Output Level/Output Impedance

PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R
(1 kHz) 1.0 V/470 Ω

Subwoofer 1/2 (50 Hz) 1.0 V/470 Ω
Front Balance L/R 2.0 V/470 Ω
ZONE2/3 OUT 470 mV/470 Ω


Maximum Output Level
PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R 2.0 V
Subwoofer 1/2..................6.5 V
Front Balance L/R 4.0 V

So even if you use a RCA to XLR interconnect, you can still get 6.5 V maximum, that should be able to drive any sub power amps.

If that isn't a typo in the manual, then the A6A's unbalanced pre out's max voltage matches that of the CX-A5200 is more than double that of the RX-A3080.

 

[Danzilla31]

4.0

If you are concerned with the available voltage, it looks like Yamaha got that covered:

Rated Output Level/Output Impedance

PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R
(1 kHz) 1.0 V/470 Ω

Subwoofer 1/2 (50 Hz) 1.0 V/470 Ω
Front Balance L/R 2.0 V/470 Ω
ZONE2/3 OUT 470 mV/470 Ω


Maximum Output Level
PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R 2.0 V
Subwoofer 1/2..................6.5 V
Front Balance L/R 4.0 V

So even if you use a RCA to XLR interconnect, you can still get 6.5 V maximum, that should be able to drive any sub power amps.

If that isn't a typo in the manual, then the A6A's unbalanced pre out's max voltage matches that of the CX-A5200 is more than double that of the RX-A3080.

4.0 volts is impressive. @PENG in Gene's measurements is there a place where the internal amps might start clipping is that where they begin to clip at 4v?

Honestly we all use less power then we realize. So I don't know if it's even an issue they have plenty of headroom at 2v and most amps will go to more then enough power in our typical listening rooms for most of us at 2v or less

Just curious where the internal amps since they can't be disconnected might start to add distortion clip or otherwise affect performance if used as a preamp

 

[Danzilla31]

If you are concerned with the available voltage, it looks like Yamaha got that covered:

Rated Output Level/Output Impedance

PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R
(1 kHz) 1.0 V/470 Ω

Subwoofer 1/2 (50 Hz) 1.0 V/470 Ω
Front Balance L/R 2.0 V/470 Ω
ZONE2/3 OUT 470 mV/470 Ω


Maximum Output Level
PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R 2.0 V
Subwoofer 1/2..................6.5 V
Front Balance L/R 4.0 V

So even if you use a RCA to XLR interconnect, you can still get 6.5 V maximum, that should be able to drive any sub power amps.

If that isn't a typo in the manual, then the A6A's unbalanced pre out's max voltage matches that of the CX-A5200 is more than double that of the RX-A3080.

I really like my CX A5200 and may go with one of these avr models in another room the room is large and I may need amps hence the reason for my question.

 

[Torqueflite]

What I don't understand is the 2 model. Not even Yamaha talks about in their videos. I looked at getting it and a power amp but in few ways it seems to be a "real" Aventage. So what is up with that? I might have stollen this from Mr 7.

 

[PENG]

4.0

4.0 volts is impressive. @PENG in Gene's measurements is there a place where the internal amps might start clipping is that where they begin to clip at 4v?

Honestly we all use less power then we realize. So I don't know if it's even an issue they have plenty of headroom at 2v and most amps will go to more then enough power in our typical listening rooms for most of us at 2v or less

Just curious where the internal amps since they can't be disconnected might start to add distortion clip or otherwise affect performance if used as a preamp

Hard to say without knowing how Gene set up his test. If we assume he has an 8 ohm load connected, then assuming the gain of the A6A is about 29 dB (I am sure it is a good guess), then based on the manual, the spec says with two channel driven, the A6A would output 165 W into 8 ohms at 0.9% THD at 1 kHz, we can estimate/by calculation that the clipping point won't be much higher than 1.3 V if Yamaha consider 1% THD is a good indicator for clipping.

Based on that, I would say at 1.5 V the A6A's power amp will definitely be well pass its knee point. That's the theory and my educated guess. Now take a look of the measured results:

You can see that at 1% THD, the output into 8 ohm is 186 W, now if we calculate the pre out voltage, it will be abut 1.37 V. That sort of support my earlier estimate that at 1.5 V, the internal amp would have well passed the clipping point.

That does not mean that at 2 V the distortion would become so high that it would be easily audible, because hopefully only a minute portion of the distortions/noise from the badly clipped power amp get fed back to the preamp side.

 

[Danzilla31]

Hard to say without knowing how Gene set up his test. If we assume he has an 8 ohm load connected, then assuming the gain of the A6A is about 29 dB (I am sure it is a good guess), then based on the manual, the spec says with two channel driven, the A6A would output 165 W into 8 ohms at 0.9% THD at 1 kHz, we can estimate/by calculation that the clipping point won't be much higher than 1.3 V if Yamaha consider 1% THD is a good indicator for clipping.

Based on that, I would say at 1.5 V the A6A's power amp will definitely be well pass its knee point. That's the theory and my educated guess. Now take a look of the measured results:

You can see that at 1% THD, the output into 8 ohm is 186 W, now if we calculate the pre out voltage, it will be abut 1.37 V. That sort of support my earlier estimate that at 1.5 V, the internal amp would have well passed the clipping point.

View attachment 52910

That does not mean that at 2 V the distortion would become so high that it would be easily audible, because hopefully only a minute portion of the distortions/noise from the badly clipped power amp get fed back to the preamp side.

Hmmmmm and this is why I usually prefer prepros thanks Peng!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

If you are concerned with the available voltage, it looks like Yamaha got that covered:

Rated Output Level/Output Impedance

PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R
(1 kHz) 1.0 V/470 Ω

Subwoofer 1/2 (50 Hz) 1.0 V/470 Ω
Front Balance L/R 2.0 V/470 Ω
ZONE2/3 OUT 470 mV/470 Ω


Maximum Output Level
PRE OUT - Front L/R, Center, Surround L/R, Surround Back L/R, Front Presence L/R, Rear Presence L/R 2.0 V
Subwoofer 1/2..................6.5 V
Front Balance L/R 4.0 V

So even if you use a RCA to XLR interconnect, you can still get 6.5 V maximum, that should be able to drive any sub power amps.

If that isn't a typo in the manual, then the A6A's unbalanced pre out's max voltage matches that of the CX-A5200 is more than double that of the RX-A3080.

Oh, no, I have never been concerned with the voltage of any pre-preouts.

Just don’t like the RCA connection on the Sub-out. No adapters for me.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I really like my CX A5200 and may go with one of these avr models in another room the room is large and I may need amps hence the reason for my question.

Dan, just get an AVR and don’t even worry about buying any amps. You don’t need them.

Your main bad-a$$ HT room already has the separates - AVP + Amps.

The 2nd room just needs the AVR. No need for amps.

Just like my living room only has the RX-A3080 to power the SV-831‘s. Don’t need any amps to power the speakers. The SV-1212N‘s are powered by the sub-amp.

 

[Danzilla31]

Dan, just get an AVR and don’t even worry about buying any amps. You don’t need them.

Your main bad-a$$ HT room already has the separates - AVP + Amps.

The 2nd room just needs the AVR. No need for amps.

Just like my living room only has the RX-A3080 to power the SV-831‘s. Don’t need any amps to power the speakers. The SV-1212N‘s are powered by the sub-amp.

I know I know they are so damn cool tho!

 

[Danzilla31]

Dan, just get an AVR and don’t even worry about buying any amps. You don’t need them.

Your main bad-a$$ HT room already has the separates - AVP + Amps.

The 2nd room just needs the AVR. No need for amps.

Just like my living room only has the RX-A3080 to power the SV-831‘s. Don’t need any amps to power the speakers. The SV-1212N‘s are powered by the sub-amp.

Also I've started to notice some of the nicer avrs are starting to cost more then a dang pre! Denon raising there prices didn't help any

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Also I've started to notice some of the nicer avrs are starting to cost more then a dang pre! Denon raising there prices didn't help any

Well, don’t need to buy the top models.

Something like the RX-A4 5.2.2CH or RX-A6A 5.2.4CH will work great for the SECOND ROOM.

They do not cost more than the real AVPs from Yamaha and Marantz.

But yeah, they may cost a little more than those other cheap-a$$ bug-ridden so-called “pre-pros”.