What do you think about what's gong on at the Capital??

[Mikado463]

Yeah, should have listen to his kid ...........

Trump's son urged father to intervene in 6 January Capitol riot

Donald Trump Jr urged his father's aides to get the ex-president to stop the mob, text messages show.

www.bbc.com

 

[Dude#1279435]

I doubt they'll get him on anything. Since he's a "past" president now and how that works. But his legacy is toast.

 

[Mr._Clark]

My theory goes like this....
You post photos like this.....
and leave out pics like this.....
But really more importantly you leave out the graphic stuff like outside the Capitol where officers were clubbed with sticks and flag posts. A few were dragged out into the crowd. One from his face on the ground. But only a couple people died so yanno it really wasn't that big a deal. You say there was no evidence of a coup, which is true. However, manipulation.....well the Orange Man himself has said Pence "is a traitor" and should be "hanged." So no matter the lack of evidence there's still this lingering doubt. Then you trivialize the riot even more by going into the details of what "insurrection" means. Is it this military coup, a firearms heavy attempt? Then Faux and company will tell you the BLM/antifa events were by "domestic terrorists," but in some examples I've seen, like Portland, I'd define them as "looters" and not the former. It isn't to downplay but to point out the trajectory the right media are aiming for. There's the Wyoming Republican Party dispatching Cheney from the party because she was willing to be on the investigation committee. (She acknowledge she agreed with 93% of Trump's policies.) McCarthy has called her and Kinzinger "Pelosi" Republicans. There's "Gym" Jordan saying "We've acknowledged the problems of Trump" without any examples of such. Then you have people in social media publicly saying "who cares about that, it's in the past" because, let me translate, they don't care about it. They only want to get back on to BLM/antifa. In fact, it's a great narrative for 2022/24, and frankly a lot of it can be pointed at Democrats. But it isn't telling the entire truth. On the day of Jan 6th, Republicans here and elsewhere became awfully quiet, and only did they really speak up when the flip was switched. The politicians never "moved on" but side stepped the issue due to Trump's 30%. What can be clearly gleaned from the NYT's documentary is these were "domestic terrorists." It may have not been well planned, but there's serious reason to believe they would have murdered Pence and Pelosi had they gotten their hands on them. (They were the targets.)

To some extent, the media discussion about an insurrection or coup has proven to be a useful smokescreen for those who seek to downplay what happened.

Many of the rioters are actually being charged with obstruction of an official proceeding (18 U.S.C. 1512(c)(2)). If breaking into the Capitol Buidling while congress is certifying a Presidential election is not obstruction of an official proceeding, then what is?

>>>Chansley was arrested Jan. 9, 2021 and has been in custody ever since. He pleaded guilty in the District of Columbia on Sept. 3, 2021, to obstruction of an official proceeding.<<<

Arizona Man Sentenced to 41 Months in Prison On Felony Charge in Jan. 6 Capitol Breach

WASHINGTON- Jacob Anthony Chansley, a.k.a. Jake Angeli, 34, of Phoenix, Arizona, was sentenced today to 41 months in prison for his criminal conduct during the breach of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, which disrupted a joint session of the U.S. Congress that was in the process of ascertaining and...

www.justice.gov

And, of course, many have been charged with assaulting or impeding law enforcement. From the DOJ link above:

>>>In the ten months since Jan. 6, more than 675 individuals have been arrested in nearly all 50 states for crimes related to the breach of the U.S. Capitol, including over 210 individuals charged with assaulting or impeding law enforcement.<<<

I have not reviewed all evidence in every case. However, of the cases I did look at, the government had overwhelming evidence (e.g. body camera footage from officers) of the crimes the defendants were charged with.

Regardless of the semantics surrounding the event, obstruction of an official proceeding, assaulting a law enforcement officer, and impeding law enforcement are all federal crimes.

I'm not sure if Trump will be charged with any crimes, but he did treat both the Office of the President and the Constitution as if they were his personal urinals.

Here's the oath of office from Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the Constitution:

>>>Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation:–I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.<<<

Oath of Office for the Presidency | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

An annotation about Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

Article II, Section 3 states that the President "shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed."

Take Care Clause: Overview | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

An annotation about Article II, Section 3, 1.3.1 Take Care Clause: Overview of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

Captain Obvious says: Instigating obstruction of an official proceeding of Congress (certification of an election) and doing nothing to halt the obstruction knowing that it is occurring, is not preserving, protecting, and defending the Constitution, nor is it taking care that the laws be faithfully executed.

 

[Dude#1279435]

To some extent, the media discussion about an insurrection or coup has proven to be a useful smokescreen for those who seek to downplay what happened.

Many of the rioters are actually being charged with obstruction of an official proceeding (18 U.S.C. 1512(c)(2)). If breaking into the Capitol Buidling while congress is certifying a Presidential election is not obstruction of an official proceeding, then what is?

>>>Chansley was arrested Jan. 9, 2021 and has been in custody ever since. He pleaded guilty in the District of Columbia on Sept. 3, 2021, to obstruction of an official proceeding.<<<

Arizona Man Sentenced to 41 Months in Prison On Felony Charge in Jan. 6 Capitol Breach

WASHINGTON- Jacob Anthony Chansley, a.k.a. Jake Angeli, 34, of Phoenix, Arizona, was sentenced today to 41 months in prison for his criminal conduct during the breach of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, which disrupted a joint session of the U.S. Congress that was in the process of ascertaining and...

www.justice.gov

And, of course, many have been charged with assaulting or impeding law enforcement. From the DOJ link above:

>>>In the ten months since Jan. 6, more than 675 individuals have been arrested in nearly all 50 states for crimes related to the breach of the U.S. Capitol, including over 210 individuals charged with assaulting or impeding law enforcement.<<<

I have not reviewed all evidence in every case. However, of the cases I did look at, the government had overwhelming evidence (e.g. body camera footage from officers) of the crimes the defendants were charged with.

Regardless of the semantics surrounding the event, obstruction of an official proceeding, assaulting a law enforcement officer, and impeding law enforcement are all federal crimes.

I'm not sure if Trump will be charged with any crimes, but he did treat both the Office of the President and the Constitution as if they were his personal urinals.

Here's the oath of office from Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the Constitution:

>>>Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation:–I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.<<<

Oath of Office for the Presidency | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

An annotation about Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

Article II, Section 3 states that the President "shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed."

Take Care Clause: Overview | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

An annotation about Article II, Section 3, 1.3.1 Take Care Clause: Overview of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

Captain Obvious says: Instigating obstruction of an official proceeding of Congress (certification of an election) and doing nothing to halt the obstruction knowing that it is occurring, is not preserving, protecting, and defending the Constitution, nor is it taking care that the laws be faithfully executed.

If I heard correct some 10K are being charged in the Floyd riots across the country.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Yeah, should have listen to his kid ...........

Trump's son urged father to intervene in 6 January Capitol riot

Donald Trump Jr urged his father's aides to get the ex-president to stop the mob, text messages show.

www.bbc.com

Kilmeade, Hannity, and Ingraham all appeared in calls.
Last night Hannity was back on damage control. 'The president never said to attack the capitol.' Plus 'The committee turned down Gym Jordan.' Of course he isn't going to say "Go attack the Capitol!!!" Hannity was probably the one more than any in media who was rubbing shoulders with Trump. His tv appearance some months back with Trump was basically fulfilling an obligation to Trump's base who were in attendance. He didn't look like he had much respect for him after the riot.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Fox Hosts Privately Begged Trump Act During Capitol Riot. On Air, They Downplayed the Violence

Fox News hosts privately begged then-President Donald Trump to act during the Jan. 6 Capitol riot. However, on air, the Fox News hosts downplayed the violence.

www.mediaite.com

Fox News hosts privately begged then-President Donald Trump to act during the Capitol riot on Jan. 6, according to text messages to then-White House chief-of-staff Mark Meadows. Those texts were read aloud by Rep. Liz Cheney (R-WY) on Monday night during a hearing of the House select committee investigating the riot.

Cheney read the correspondence just before the committee voted unanimously to recommend that the Department of Justice charge Meadows with criminal contempt of Congress for refusing to cooperate with the committee. The measure will now be voted on by the full House of Representatives.

Fox News did not air the hearing, though CNN and MSNBC did.

“Mark, the President needs to tell people in the Capitol to go Home. This is hurting all of us,” texted Laura Ingraham. “He is destroying his legacy.”

“Please get him on TV,” said Brian Kilmeade. “Destroying everything you have accomplished.”

“Can he make a statement, ask people to leave the Capitol,” asked Sean Hannity.

However, on the air, the Fox News hosts sang a different tune the violence.

On the night of January 6, Ingraham repeatedly suggested that the worst rioters might not have been MAGA at all, arguing Antifa was “sprinkled” through the crowd and saying she’d never seen Trump supporters armed or armored at rallies.

“I have never seen Trump rally attendees wearing helmets, black helmets, brown helmets. Black backpacks. The uniforms that you saw in some of these crowd shots. Have you ever seen them wearing… those knee pads and the, you know, all of the pads on their elbows?” she said to The Federalist’s Mollie Hemingway. “I just, I mean, I’ve been to a lot of these rallies. I know you, you both have covered them. I have never seen that before. Ever.”

On his radio program that day, Hannity appeared to defend the rioters.

“Apparently a standoff outside of the House door chambers. Not sure why, they knew this was coming,” he said on his radio program. “They knew there was going to be a march. They knew they were heading to the Capitol. I’m not surprised. I am surprised that they didn’t have more of a police presence there when they got there.”

Later that night, Hannity condemned the violence on air.

“Now, let me stop here and be crystal clear: those who truly support President Trump, those that believe they are part of the conservative movement in this country, you do not, we do not support those who commit acts of violence,” he said on Jan. 6. “They – people we don’t believe should be vandalizing our nation’s Capitol, attacking the brave men and women that keep us safe in law enforcement. They don’t storm the Capitol.”

Kilmeade expressed opposition to holding Trump accountable for Jan. 6, but condemned the riot on January 6.

“This is Americans attacking with their faces apparent and transparent while they sat in the speaker’s office,” he said. “That clown should be arrested now, hopefully. And to put up a Trump flag and take down the American flag is not patriotic. One of the worst things I’ve ever seen.”

 

[Dude#1279435]

What's weird about all this is what in the world is Meadows carrying this info for?! Seems to me you delete it. Like Bannon, you'd think Meadows will stall until 2022 if the Republicans get the House. The DOJ has a difficult job in finding other areas of Trump corruption to attach to this making the transition of power toothless in the closing of the case.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Gym Jordan also believed to have texted on Jan 6th. Don Jr, Hannity, Ingraham, and Jordan are like a who's who cliche on this.

 

[Dude#1279435]

There have been a few theories on why McConnell is supposedly changing his tune on Jan 6th. Beyond Huh, interesting LOL. Its giving him the outlet he needs to distance the party from Trump.

 

[Dude#1279435]

I'm not seeing enough in the way of criminal charges on the obstruction of justice (ie prison time) like the left media wants to believe. What I'm seeing is influence that turned to violence and therefore losing political seats. Jim Jordan's text suggesting challenging the electoral vote and transfer of power might be enough for the latter. I still think they'd have to say literally go out and do this. Where Trump could face harsher penalty is in dereliction of duty as president while the riots were happening. I'm not familiar with law though. Whatever happens I'm just glad the information get out there.

 

[Dude#1279435]

I thought Mary Trump has some great insight into the psyche of Trump. The claim by Trump that the riot crowd was "filled with love." She said "I don't think he understands what love is." Her point about the texts that those callers knew what was going to happen on Jan 6th but that it "got outta control." Don Jr's text because that would've been information Donald wouldn't want to hear about. His narcissism, and anybody that speaks against him is gone is an example I use.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Summarizing what Ingraham said: 'Look what you're doing to your legacy. You're hurting us.' Glad to know she really cared about the Capitol incident. It was reported shortly after her text she was saying it was antifa. Begs again what in the world Meadows was thinking? I mean power to the point you can do it right out in the open and get away with it. MR says his intent was to please Trump by saying he wanted to own covid when he contracted it and show he was a strong man. Yet it also is revealed Trump may have intentionally been trying to give it to everyone. Woops. Trump says, 'Hey look, idiot. You don't broadcast that.' Beyond me why Meadows would have those relevant texts on his computer. There's another part about rep Gosar having meetings with some of the organizers of the riot. I'd think nah that's BS, but it's the mentally ill Gosar so it is plausible. In other words, there's some reason to believe there was some level of planning before Jan 6th the committee is looking into.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Fact Check: Did Adam Schiff 'Tamper' With Jim Jordan January 6 Evidence?

The January 6 committee chair has been accused of "doctoring" the content of a text message sent to Mark Meadows by the Ohio congressman.

www.newsweek.com

Schmitz's full message reads: "On January 6, 2021, Vice President Mike Pence, as President of the Senate, should call out all electoral votes that he believes are unconstitutional as no electoral votes at all -- in accordance with guidance from founding father Alexander Hamilton and judicial precedence. 'No legislative act,' wrote Alexander Hamilton in Federalist No. 78, 'contrary to the Constitution, can be valid.'

"The court in Hubbard v. Lowe reinforced this truth: 'That an unconstitutional statute is not a law at all is a proposition no longer open to discussion.' 226 F. 135, 137 (SDNY 1915), appeal dismissed, 242 U.S. 654 (1916). Following this rationale, an unconstitutionally appointed elector, like an unconstitutionally enacted statute, is no elector at all," the message concludes.

The message was provided to Newsweek by a committee spokesperson.

A spokesman for Jordan later confirmed that he was the sender and said the message was "misrepresented" because Schiff erased the final clause and the dash preceding it, replacing it with a period, and failed to disclose the edits.

Problem with Jordan's position on this one is the electorals were deemed constitutional by the supreme court since no evidence of fraud was found. Looks to me like Jordan is conveniently leaving that part out.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Schiff appears to be omitting the clause Jordan used because the law is on his side. The irony.

A text appears to have been forwarded by conservative lawyer Joseph Schmitz, but Jordan's office acknowledged the initial text came from him. I doubt anything will happen but an investigation should be taken. There's a much more severe penalty for elected officials claiming fraud and the end result is a riot. The funny part here is at the end where Jordan has kind of a pants on fire moment when questioned.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Interesting one on the texts without names. Theorizes Cheney is much more her dad than you think. The message is we're going after Trump, and these names not mentioned could go down with Trump too.
Edit: theory is hold the names till mid-terms and give the Dems a better chance to keep the House investigation. Protecting the institute of the presidency vs democracy.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Liz Cheney smacked GOP Rep. Jim Jordan's hand away when he tried to escort her during the Capitol riot, telling him, 'You f---ing did this,' book says

Cheney was ousted from her high-ranking post in the House GOP after she criticized Trump and fellow Republicans for spreading false election claims.

www.businessinsider.com

According to The Daily Beast, the book said Cheney told Mark Milley, the chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff: "That f---ing guy Jim Jordan. That son of a b---- … While these maniacs are going through the place, I'm standing in the aisle and he said 'We need to get the ladies away from the aisle. Let me help you.' I smacked his hand away and told him, 'Get away from me. You f---ing did this.'"

 

[Dude#1279435]

Not the most wholesome example but Roger Stone made a good point about proving perjury. Difficult thing to do. However, if there's a case to be made against say Jim Jordan who pushed the election scam with video and text evidence, there is a strong reason for him being unseated since his words do have consequences.

 

[Dude#1279435]

What a POS this guy is. A long one that reads like an anthology of the type of individual Jordan is. It goes in depth over Jordan's involvements leading up to Jan 6th. A couple excerpts below.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jul/27/jim-jordan-republican-capitol-attack-insurrection-house-select-committee
From 1987 to 1995, Jordan was an assistant wrestling coach at the Ohio State University, where many athletes claim he knew about and turned a blind eye to Dr Richard Strauss’s sexual abuse of at least 177 students. Jordan has denied that he engaged in a cover-up. One of the abused wrestlers, Mark Coleman, who was a close friend and roommate of Jordan and became an Ultimate Fighting Champion, told the Wall Street Journal (in comments he would later retract): “There’s no way unless he’s got dementia or something that he’s got no recollection of what was going on at Ohio State.” Another abused wrestler, Dunyasha Yetts, said: “If Jordan says he didn’t know about it then he’s lying.” Jordan refused to cooperate with the university’s investigation: goodbye, Columbus.

The report on the abuse, issued in 2019 by the law firm hired by OSU to conduct the investigation, Perkins Coie, concluded that Strauss’s predatory sexual behavior was an “open secret”, according to students, and that “coaches, trainers and other team physicians were fully aware of Strauss’ activities, and yet few seemed inclined to do anything to stop it.” (Strauss killed himself in 2005.)

At a hearing held by the Ohio state legislature’s civil justice committee, in February 2020, Adam DiSabato, an OSU wrestling champion, testified that Jordan tried to get him to persuade his brother, another OSU wrestler, Mike DiSabato, who was a whistleblower about the abuse, to withdraw his statement. Every year as assistant coach, Jordan awarded a “King of Sauna” certificate to the wrestler “who talked the most smack”, reported the Columbus Dispatch. According to Mike DiSabato, Jordan was in the sauna daily, where much of the sexual molestation took place. “Jim Jordan called me crying, crying, groveling, on the Fourth of July … begging me to go against my brother, begging me, crying for half an hour,” Adam DiSabato said at the hearing. “That’s the kind of cover-up that’s going on here. He’s a coward. He’s a coward.”

After serving in the Ohio legislature, Jordan entered national politics in the interregnum of rightwing extremism between the fall of Newt Gingrich and the rise of the Tea Party. He was elected to the House in 2006, during a midterm Democratic sweep that put them into the majority, but the backbencher vaulted suddenly into prominence when the Republicans captured the House in the reaction to the Obama administration in 2010. Elected by the emboldened conservative faction to head the Republican Study Group, he sought to trip up the Republican speaker of the House, John Boehner, eventually forcing the federal government shutdown of 2013, which Boehner denounced as “fucking stupid”.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2021/jul/25/i-alone-can-fix-it-carol-leonnig-philip-rucker-trump-book-bestseller
Jordan founded the House Freedom Caucus, more radical than the Republican Study Group, to push Boehner out. “Anarchists,” Boehner called them. “They want total chaos.” He singled out Jordan as “a legislative terrorist”. Boehner quit under the pressure in 2015. In an interview with CBS about his memoir published this year, On the House, Boehner remarked about Jordan: “I just never saw a guy who spent more time tearing things apart – never building anything, never putting anything together.”

Liz Cheney, who Pelosi has appointed to the select committee, and was stripped of her position as chair of the House Republican Conference in an effort led by Jordan, said McCarthy named Jordan to the committee in order to sabotage it.

“At every opportunity, the minority leader has attempted to prevent the American people from understanding what happened, to block this investigation,” she stated. Jordan, she pointed out, could also not serve on the committee because he “may well be a material witness to events that led to that day, that led to 6 January”.

The questions that Jordan may be asked if he were to testify would cover his knowledge and involvement in the planning, organization and funding of the insurrection, as well as his participation in the concerted effort to prevent the constitutional certification of the presidential election and the propagation of Trump’s “big lie” that the election was a fraud and stolen.

Then.....

On 11 January, the same day an article of impeachment was filed in the House against Donald Trump for “incitement of insurrection”, Trump awarded Jordan the Presidential Medal of Freedom in a closed ceremony at the White House.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Particularly the parts where Boehner calls him a "political terrorist" and "has never built anything."

 

[Mr._Clark]

Not the most wholesome example but Roger Stone made a good point about proving perjury. Difficult thing to do. However, if there's a case to be made against say Jim Jordan who pushed the election scam with video and text evidence, there is a strong reason for him being unseated since his words do have consequences.

I'm not trying to argue with you, but I'm not sure I understand what you mean about Roger Stone? He was convicted but later pardoned by Trump.

In Trump world, laws are for the little people.

>>>Roger Stone was found guilty of seven criminal counts of lying to the House of Representatives' Intelligence Committee, obstructing justice and witness tampering.<<<

Roger Stone: Trump ally, political strategist, Nixon fan and Russia probe defendant

The 67-year-old supposedly spurns socks, and has a tattoo of Richard Nixon on his back.

www.bbc.com