Adam Kinzinger (R-IL)

[Irvrobinson]

It's amazing how many gop apologists can read a statement and twist it to their pre conceived notions about " how libtards think"..too much foxnoise in Irv's recent past...

Where do you come up with this horseshit?

 

[lp85253]

Would have been more fun in the american heartland but they'd (i.e. the gubmint) probably would have just stolen some native tribe's reservation land....

I still think they should give the Dakotas to anybody that wants them .. It would solve the issues in the senate.. Christ ..4 senators for 32 people 10 chickens and 3 mules..

 

[Irvrobinson]

What would I want the military to do? The army and Shin Bet advised the police not to act the way they did, but were ignored. Now, the military has been forced to act.

And, if you think it's a simple matter of a few families being evicted, you really aren't looking at the big picture.

I know the big picture well. Hamas has the stated objective of the destruction of Israel. Not exactly someone I’d want to cut some slack.

 

[Jerkface]

It's amazing how many gop apologists can read a statement and twist it to their pre conceived notions about " how libtards think"..too much foxnoise in Irv's recent past...

Considering I'm a centrist libertarian (Ron Paul sucks, let's just get that out of the way), I'm not surprised he got confused about me being a typical "liberal".

 

[lp85253]

Considering I'm a centrist libertarian (Ron Paul sucks, let's just get that out of the way), I'm not surprised he got confused about me being a typical "liberal".

Anybody that's not right wing is a liberal in the current vernacular.... The crazy fun part is they don't know the difference between communism , socialism, and social democracy.. It ain't rocket science... Centerist libertarian is a new one on me though...we gotta talk, this could be educational for me...

 

[Jerkface]

Anybody that's not right wing is a liberal in the current vernacular.... The crazy fun part is they don't know the difference between communism , socialism, and social democracy.. It ain't rocket science... Centerist libertarian is a new one on me though...we gotta talk, this could be educational for me...

Believe it or not, the libertarian concept does have a spectrum. Farther right you get, though, the more it's about "rights for me, not for thee". There is such a thing as a libertarian socialist, though.

 

[GO-NAD!]

I know the big picture well. Hamas has the stated objective of the destruction of Israel. Not exactly someone I’d want to cut some slack.

If you know the big picture, then you know that Hamas is not capable of destroying Israel. And, you would know that that the effort to evict Palestinian families from the Sheik Jarrah neighbourhood of East Jerusalem is just a pretext for expansion of Jewish settlements in disputed territory, enlarging Israel - de facto, if not legally. So, you would understand why the Palestinians are so strongly opposed. Hamas is a loathsome organization, but they will be supported by Gazans as long as Israel follows this same path.

 

[Irvrobinson]

If you know the big picture, then you know that Hamas is not capable of destroying Israel. And, you would know that that the effort to evict Palestinian families from the Sheik Jarrah neighbourhood of East Jerusalem is just a pretext for expansion of Jewish settlements in disputed territory, enlarging Israel - de facto, if not legally. So, you would understand why the Palestinians are so strongly opposed. Hamas is a loathsome organization, but they will be supported by Gazans as long as Israel follows this same path.

Your position is illogical. No negotiation can take place while rockets are flying. Since Hamas fired the first shot they have to fire the last one. Hamas has consistently refused to negotiate in the past. Any other position is illogical to expect from the Israelis. My guess is that Hamas won't stop until Iran tells them to, or they run out of rockets.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Your position is illogical. No negotiation can take place while rockets are flying. Since Hamas fired the first shot they have to fire the last one. Hamas has consistently refused to negotiate in the past. Any other position is illogical to expect from the Israelis. My guess is that Hamas won't stop until Iran tells them to, or they run out of rockets.

My post does not take a position, it describes what's happening. So, logic doesn't come into it.

Netanyahu doesn't seem interested in a ceasefire and I suspect he may be trying to get Hamas to deplete their rocket arsenal and they appear to be obliging. They aren't causing much damage or casualties, so the Israeli government has little incentive to seek an end to the conflict. And, like I said previously, Netanyahu has legal problems that he may be trying to deflect attention from.

While the circumstances triggering each eruption of violence may be unique, they are part of a pattern of periodic flareups.
Why Israel and Palestine are fighting in Gaza: They’re stuck in a cycle of conflict - Vox

 

[Irvrobinson]

My post does not take a position, it describes what's happening. So, logic doesn't come into it.

Netanyahu doesn't seem interested in a ceasefire and I suspect he may be trying to get Hamas to deplete their rocket arsenal and they appear to be obliging. They aren't causing much damage or casualties, so the Israeli government has little incentive to seek an end to the conflict. And, like I said previously, Netanyahu has legal problems that he may be trying to deflect attention from.

While the circumstances triggering each eruption of violence may be unique, they are part of a pattern of periodic flareups.
Why Israel and Palestine are fighting in Gaza: They’re stuck in a cycle of conflict - Vox

I was responding to your sub-thread of posts, not just the last one. I was just reading this morning that Hamas has launched a total of about 4000 rockets. I think Israel is showing remarkable restraint. I doubt the US would be so careful.

 

[highfigh]

Answer is B. I hoped my little word play would be obvious. Alas...

I don't know about the US, but in Canada, a person described as a "tool" would not take it as a compliment.

I just wanted it to be clear WRT A vs B and 'tool' wasn't meant to be a compliment.

"Congress- America's toolbox".

 

[highfigh]

While I don't support every policy she advocates, I don't look on AOC with the same level of disdain that the American right does. Campaigning for and funding primary challenges of fellow Dems seems, I find a bit...distasteful. Regardless, the two parties aren't close to being mirror images.

More similar to an asymmetrical ink blot.

 

[highfigh]

I read a lot. You should try it some time.



Sidestepping my comment that you should decide whether supporting an authoritarian G.O.P. is a fair exchange for economic policies you like as opposed to democracy with an ad hominem attack.

OK, you read a lot- whose writing do you read and how unbiased is it? People tend to believe what they already agree with- an open mind is very hard to find. Anything written has been interpreted, so it's not necessarily true. Have you ever read anything that changed your thinking about the topic/person/place or thing?

What definition of 'authoritarian' do you use?

 

[highfigh]

I've never heard any right-leaning person at this forum, Republican politician, or voter on the right in general openly denounce Trump, January 6th, or the election scandal scam. Well except Kinzinger and Cheney. The rest have all but disappeared. This just might be the bigger problem.

You need to look further.

 

[highfigh]

If you know the big picture, then you know that Hamas is not capable of destroying Israel. And, you would know that that the effort to evict Palestinian families from the Sheik Jarrah neighbourhood of East Jerusalem is just a pretext for expansion of Jewish settlements in disputed territory, enlarging Israel - de facto, if not legally. So, you would understand why the Palestinians are so strongly opposed. Hamas is a loathsome organization, but they will be supported by Gazans as long as Israel follows this same path.

By themselves, you're right- Hamas couldn't destroy Israel but with help from Iran, Syria and others, they could. Where do they get their missiles?

 

[GO-NAD!]

I was responding to your sub-thread of posts, not just the last one. I was just reading this morning that Hamas has launched a total of about 4000 rockets. I think Israel is showing remarkable restraint. I doubt the US would be so careful.

Well, I don't see how any of my posts on the topic could be considered "illogical". I guess we just see the matter differently. The vast majority of the rockets fall short, land in open areas, or are shot down by Iron Dome. Israel could continue doing this without a need to conduct a counter-offensive.

Hamas used Israeli actions as an excuse to launce rocket attacks. It may be a flimsy excuse, but what we think of it is of no consequence to them. Israel uses the rocket attacks as an excuse to mount disproportional artillery and air strikes in response. Once again, I in no way am expressing any support for Hamas and their actions. My concern is that it's Palestinian civilians in Gaza who are suffering the most. The fact that Israel may be exercising restraint by calling ahead before destroying apartment buildings is cold comfort to the residents.

 

[GO-NAD!]

By themselves, you're right- Hamas couldn't destroy Israel but with help from Iran, Syria and others, they could. Where do they get their missiles?

As I understand it, they're mainly home-made. Israel's neighbours have tried to destroy the country on multiple occasions and failed. I see no prospect of it happening now. They are all frightened to death of Israel, despite their rhetorical bluster.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Where do they get their missiles?

It is thought they are Iranian.

 

[highfigh]

As I understand it, they're mainly home-made. Israel's neighbours have tried to destroy the country on multiple occasions and failed. I see no prospect of it happening now. They are all frightened to death of Israel, despite their rhetorical bluster.

From the link-

"Hamas, the militant group that has run Gaza since 2007 and does not recognize Israel’s right to exist, has parlayed the arsenal into an increasingly lethal threat,..."

"They assemble the rockets underground or in dense neighborhoods where Israeli airstrikes are likely to cause civilian casualties."

So, who's the bad guy? Firing on the source of the rockets, or building and firing from residential areas?

Gaza’s Rockets: A Replenished Arsenal That Vexes Israel (Published 2021)

Despite a blockade, Palestinian militants have used help from Iran, ingenuity, Israeli-fired duds and even plumbing pipes to make thousands of rockets with increased range.

www.nytimes.com

 

[GO-NAD!]

From the link-

"Hamas, the militant group that has run Gaza since 2007 and does not recognize Israel’s right to exist, has parlayed the arsenal into an increasingly lethal threat,..."

"They assemble the rockets underground or in dense neighborhoods where Israeli airstrikes are likely to cause civilian casualties."

So, who's the bad guy? Firing on the source of the rockets, or building and firing from residential areas?

Gaza’s Rockets: A Replenished Arsenal That Vexes Israel (Published 2021)

Despite a blockade, Palestinian militants have used help from Iran, ingenuity, Israeli-fired duds and even plumbing pipes to make thousands of rockets with increased range.

www.nytimes.com

I'm not sure how many times I have to state that I am not defending Hamas' actions. Right now, I don't see any "good" guy.

Where you and @Irvrobinson appear to see this conflict as black and white issue, I see it in multiple shades of grey.