Emotiva T1+ Tweeters Burning Up??

[freefall]

I have a brand new pair of Emotiva T1+ speakers about a month old. I have gone through two tweeters, they are physically burning up, discoloring the tweeter, temp reached 150 degrees with a heat gun measurement. Customer service has been great, but pinpointing the problem is the issue. The first time the speakers were being powered by the Emotiva XPA 3 channel amp, The tweeter got red hot at a comfortable loud level. The tweeter was replaced and the same thing happened again, I then unhooked the amp and just used my AVR for power, a Denon 4500X, again the tweeter heated up to over 140 degrees before I shut everything down. I need somebody smarter than me to offer their opinion.

 

[ryanosaur]

A well designed speaker shouldn't have these problems.
That said, tweeters are the most fragile driver usually. They will all heat up this is the nature of electrical resistance. To what extent they heat up and at what point they fail is something that should be solved by the designers.
You just experienced one of the reasons Emo gets a bad rap. My recommendation would be to request they send you new speakers and a return label for the old ones. If it happens again, return them and walk away from Emo forever.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

I have a brand new pair of Emotiva T1+ speakers about a month old. I have gone through two tweeters, they are physically burning up, discoloring the tweeter, temp reached 150 degrees with a heat gun measurement. Customer service has been great, but pinpointing the problem is the issue. The first time the speakers were being powered by the Emotiva XPA 3 channel amp, The tweeter got red hot at a comfortable loud level. The tweeter was replaced and the same thing happened again, I then unhooked the amp and just used my AVR for power, a Denon 4500X, again the tweeter heated up to over 140 degrees before I shut everything down. I need somebody smarter than me to offer their opinion.

I'm not smarter than you... but um... demand a refund.

Emotiva has had some serious QC problems as of late. And a speaker, of all things, should be the most reliable, longest-lasting piece of equipment you ever buy. I just sold a pair of Allison speakers that were almost 40 years old and using original everything. I've got a pair of Von Schweikert's in my living room now that are 20+ years old and problem free. A non-powered speaker is not supposed to be giving you trouble fresh out the box. And sure as hell not supposed to be a fire hazard.

 

[lovinthehd]

Just to be clear, what is "comfortably loud" and at what distance from the speaker?

 

[freefall]

Probably 60 % of volume with both the amp and AVR, My room is 18 wide and 24 long. The music was Gordon Lightfoot, Boston, and Simple Minds lol

 

[lovinthehd]

What does 60% of volume even mean? How far away from the speakers are you? Your avr has a dB scale for volume, what are the typical readings (assuming you've calibrated the avr/amp setup)?

 

[nathan_h]

Or bust out a free app on your smartphone called SPL meter and tell us the number when listening to music at your normal volume.

My buddy says comfortable is 73db on his SPL meter. My wife says 90. Ymmv.

 

[highfigh]

Tweeters mainly die because of only a few factors- excessive amplifier clipping, cheap/wrong parts for the application and improper crossover design or build.

Their website specs for these shows the crossover frequency is 2700 Hz- that's too low for most ribbons and I suspect that's the reason these are failing.

 

[highfigh]

I'm not smarter than you... but um... demand a refund.

Emotiva has had some serious QC problems as of late. And a speaker, of all things, should be the most reliable, longest-lasting piece of equipment you ever buy. I just sold a pair of Allison speakers that were almost 40 years old and using original everything. I've got a pair of Von Schweikert's in my living room now that are 20+ years old and problem free. A non-powered speaker is not supposed to be giving you trouble fresh out the box. And sure as hell not supposed to be a fire hazard.

I have a pair of Jamo J101 from 1979 and they still work fine, although one of the woofers cacked for some reason- I think a dirty control caused it because that's the only driver that has ever failed in all of my time owning audio equipment with normal operation. An Altec 417B voice coil failed when it was connected to a guitar amp, but that was because the amplifier had a problem with intermittent high frequency oscillation.

 

[freefall]

I contacted Emotiva again, they suggested hooking up to different AVR and see what happens, I have a Yamaha which I will dig out and give it a go, this will be the third power source, don't really see why the receiver brand should be the problem ?

 

[ryanosaur]

Silly question... are you bi-amping or bi-wiring these?

 

[freefall]

No sir

 

[nathan_h]

I contacted Emotiva again, they suggested hooking up to different AVR and see what happens, I have a Yamaha which I will dig out and give it a go, this will be the third power source, don't really see why the receiver brand should be the problem ?

Yeah seems unlikely that amplification is the issue since two different amps have had this happen already.

Two different things seem likely:

1. You are playing much louder than we realize. (Hence the need to get more objective measurement of your listening level with a free SPL app.)

OR

2. There is something in the speaker that is wrong, not the tweeter, but maybe something in the crossover or wiring that is not working the way it should.

--

Since you are only having this happen on one of the speakers, I would suspect #2.

If this is happening on both speakers, then I would suspect #1.

 

[freefall]

I will do the SPL, Gotta wait till the better half goes to work, she doesn't appreciate all this scientific testing stuff lol

 

[nathan_h]

tell me about it. i have to reserve time for calibration activity because it is apparently fingernails on a chalkboard to the uninitiated.

 

[TLS Guy]

I have a brand new pair of Emotiva T1+ speakers about a month old. I have gone through two tweeters, they are physically burning up, discoloring the tweeter, temp reached 150 degrees with a heat gun measurement. Customer service has been great, but pinpointing the problem is the issue. The first time the speakers were being powered by the Emotiva XPA 3 channel amp, The tweeter got red hot at a comfortable loud level. The tweeter was replaced and the same thing happened again, I then unhooked the amp and just used my AVR for power, a Denon 4500X, again the tweeter heated up to over 140 degrees before I shut everything down. I need somebody smarter than me to offer their opinion.

If that is happening, one of two things has happened. They have used the wrong value series cap to the tweeter, or they have made and error in the tweeter padding circuit. The other possibility is that components have been missed altogether or miss wired. If you keep replacing tweeters you will keep blowing them. You need to take a hard look at the crossovers before blowing any more tweeters. Obviously there is a balls up of staggering proportions here.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

I have a pair of Jamo J101 from 1979 and they still work fine, although one of the woofers cacked for some reason- I think a dirty control caused it because that's the only driver that has ever failed in all of my time owning audio equipment with normal operation. An Altec 417B voice coil failed when it was connected to a guitar amp, but that was because the amplifier had a problem with intermittent high frequency oscillation.

I'm curious if Emotiva replaced the tweeter under warranty or had him buy a new one. Blown tweeters are almost never covered by warranty due to them being most susceptible to abuse. If it was warrantied, I'd be worried that the company knows something but ain't telling.

 

[ryanosaur]

I'm curious if Emotiva replaced the tweeter under warranty or had him buy a new one. Blown tweeters are almost never covered by warranty due to them being most susceptible to abuse. If it was warrantied, I'd be worried that the company knows something but ain't telling.

This.
Why I suggested requesting a new speaker be sent, not just a tweeter.
Further, their insistence on OP trying a third source of amplification comes across as folly. Perhaps a delay.
Something ain't right, in other words.

(Understatement?)

 

[shadyJ]

Their website specs for these shows the crossover frequency is 2700 Hz- that's too low for most ribbons and I suspect that's the reason these are failing.

The Emotiva speakers are using an AMT tweeter. AMT tweeters are far more robust than ribbon tweeters, and an average AMT should be able to handle a 2.7kHz crossover just fine.

 

[TLS Guy]

The Emotiva speakers are using an AMT tweeter. AMT tweeters are far more robust than ribbon tweeters, and an average AMT should be able to handle a 2.7kHz crossover just fine.

My point is that 2.7K Hz is fine, however obviously the crossover in his speaker is well south of 2.7 K Hz and if getting red hot, I would not be surprised to find there is no high pass crossover at all. I have never in all my life seen, or heard of a tweeter getting red hot before. So whatever is happening here is way out of any reasonable norms, to the point of stretching credulity. However I believe the OP is telling the truth. I now have 67 years of extensive experience of speaker design and building.

Since this is a three way speaker, and the crossover complex, I suspect that the crossover has been miss assembled in the US, or some Far Eastern sweat shop.

From how the OP phrased it, I gather it is just one speaker of the pair burning up tweeters. So that would confirm there is a manufacturing error in the crossover, or both tweeters would be getting hot.

So he needs to sent a new certified crossover and a new tweeter for that speaker. I can be 100% certain the crossover in that speaker has a serious and fatal manufacturing fault.