The difference between pro and home-audio TT needles?

[TLS Guy]

Putting an end to a long journey!!! I have very, very good news, but am ashamed just a tad at the same time.

The TT is in perfect working condition. It had no problems to begin with. I was simply dealt a bad hand and all of my testing records had a warp. So, no matter how many different scenarios I tried, I always got the cones pulsating. Different speakers, amps, records, TT in the room, out of the room, behind the speakers, below... It was my records. All of them had a warp.

The guy said that only by looking at strobe, he could see it's not the stator, chips or anything serious. He did open it in front of me (this morning for that matter) and tested the chips just to please me, nothing wrong.

he put a good record on (the one he could vouch for) and there was no pulsating of the cones:
View attachment 30450

This is me!!

I did buy some needed spare parts to justify the trip. I gave him a good bottle of wine. He didn't want money for the repair, he said the wine covers it (it's a good bottle). I paid anyway, I insisted (an hour of work as he specified 15$) and bought some parts to give him some business.

He said not to sweat with it, warped records are warped records, but otherwise the TT works like a charm as he said.

He did show me what I mentioned earlier, the arm really doesn't drag everything on the way; the stop mechanism hooks the arm only when you press stop or it reaches the end of record (at least in this model). He agreed you'd have a hard time making it quiet otherwise.

Thanks to everyone involved. If you ever decide to take your vacation in Croatia, give me shout, I'll try to help in any way I can.


Thanks again!

That is good news, but it was what I was suspecting from the beginning. Almost no records are flat, even right out of a brand new jacket. However playing warped discs on a properly designed turntable, should not make the speakers pulsate. I have noted that so many Far Eastern turntables do. I can assure you none of my four turntables make my speakers pulsate playing a disc with some warping which is most.

 

[highfigh]

Now electric fields are very hard. So if for instance one of those many stator coils became dead, then the turntable would hit a wall as hard as a mechanical obstruction. If it were one coil then the vibration frequency would be 33 1/3 per sec. It would occur at exactly the same place every time. If you don't find evidence of anything mechanical then something like this is your problem.

Incidentally although these turntables are high torque, the torque is not that uniform. There is a "cogging" effect as magnets pass the stator coils. The turntable gets a little shove from each one as it passes with a rise and tail. Many feel this effect is audible and that is why the high end turntables are not direct drive.

But that shove (pull, actually) is countered by an opposite force to smooth the acceleration, so it's not as noticeable as many would think. The main reason I have heard from audiopiles for their hatred of direct drive tables is that the chassis transmits vibrations to the platter and stylus. Apparently, they don't consider the fact that its speed is much more accurate, but even using a rubber belt isn't inaccurate enough to matter unless it slips in one place or is so stretched that it can't drag the platter at a stable speed.

This makes me wonder- how much rumble do you hear from your rim drive tables, or do you have softer drive wheels?

 

[highfigh]

He said not to sweat with it, warped records are warped records, but otherwise the TT works like a charm as he said.

He did show me what I mentioned earlier, the arm really doesn't drag everything on the way; the stop mechanism hooks the arm only when you press stop or it reaches the end of record (at least in this model). He agreed you'd have a hard time making it quiet otherwise.

Thanks to everyone involved. If you ever decide to take your vacation in Croatia, give me shout, I'll try to help in any way I can.
Thanks again!

I don't think your arm is connected to the return mechanism until the lift raises it because the mechanism is told to do something, often (and I think your table has it, too) by an optical sensor. Once the tonearm reaches the end, the light is blocked and the mechanism starts working.

I think I mentioned record clamps- I would try that as a solution to the warped LPs. I would recommend that over a weight, though. The bearing wasn't designed for more weight than one or two (don't put two on it) LPs and the weight of the rubber mat.

 

[TLS Guy]

But that shove (pull, actually) is countered by an opposite force to smooth the acceleration, so it's not as noticeable as many would think. The main reason I have heard from audiopiles for their hatred of direct drive tables is that the chassis transmits vibrations to the platter and stylus. Apparently, they don't consider the fact that its speed is much more accurate, but even using a rubber belt isn't inaccurate enough to matter unless it slips in one place or is so stretched that it can't drag the platter at a stable speed.

This makes me wonder- how much rumble do you hear from your rim drive tables, or do you have softer drive wheels?

As Loricraft have stated many times, a Garrard 301 or 401 in proper working condition does not produce ANY audible rumble from the speakers. They are massively over engineered. I have over half a century of experience with those turntables. Speed is precisely controlled via an eddy current brake. In its hey day Garrard were set up and owned by the Crown Jewelers.

 

[killdozzer]

That is good news, but it was what I was suspecting from the beginning. Almost no records are flat, even right out of a brand new jacket. However playing warped discs on a properly designed turntable, should not make the speakers pulsate. I have noted that so many Far Eastern turntables do. I can assure you none of my four turntables make my speakers pulsate playing a disc with some warping which is most.

I never doubted that for a moment. I know you sent me buying mats and plinths just to mess with me.

 

[killdozzer]

And how's this for a great repair man; he gave me for a present a record that proves to be as flat as it possibly could so that I can test it at home. This on is a keeper!