"Unbreaking America" - proposed concept on fixing our political system!

[TheWarrior]

Definitely some interesting observations. It's certainly hard for me to disagree with the notion that gerrymandering has gotten pretty abusive in some cases, or ignore the corrupting influence of money in politics. I do wonder a bit about the public support vs likelihood of being passed graph though. It's easy to gain broad support for a general concept, say protecting the environment. Translating that into support for an actual piece of legislation with particular ideas of how something should get done, associated costs, etc. is a different matter entirely.

On another note, I feel like there is some irony in having J-Law as the spokesperson for the video. With a net worth over $100 million, she's a lot closer to the billionaires she mentioned than us peons.

Thank you for bringing up the gerrymandering - I meant to mention that earlier.

It is absolutely absurd that we attempt to pride ourselves on being a democracy, when we actively suppress the ability to vote. The recent GA Governor election is a great example - they closed dozens of polling stations specifically near African American communities. Hell, they even paved the road to the polling station right by me, the night of the election!

But I think it is also important to hear from the super wealthy that are acknowledging their need to contribute more to our country. We only have an interstate system because it was paid for with a 70% tax on the wealthy!

 

[Trell]

What other country allows non-citizens to vote for their representatives?

An EU citizen living as a resident in another EU member state can vote on local elections (municipal, regional in some places): Municipal elections in EU

 

[highfigh]

You're right, we absolutely need to start teaching our children about how effective FDR was despite being the only multi-term President, and what happened to our political system after WW2.

We need to teach them about how recently it was that African-Americans were actually allowed to go to school with white people, or how recently women were even allowed to vote! And not this Eli Whitney BS to try and make slavery sound ok because we made their fingers bleed a little less with the cotton-gin.

But then you selectively roll your IQ back to take the discussion of fixing our political system, to complaining about 'illegals having driver's licenses.'

And then you finish with wanting to be more like Sweden. Huge taxation, nearing guaranteed income for all citizen's, universal healthcare, heavy restrictions on firearm ownership - I am sorry to say sir, but you do not appear to be thinking, critically!

I guess you didn't pick up on the sarcasm.

Does 'multi-term' mean 'more than two terms'? Should he be defined as "a great President', just because he was elected four times? I think not.

WRT integration, you mean court-ordered? If not for the death grip on the idea that Blacks were inferior, it wouldn't have required the courts to order it.

The US has fallen behind many other countries WRT education- if our Congress was doing their job, they would make sure the US remained at/near the top in all categories but I guess they're too busy shuffling their money. I'm not a big fan of regulation, unless it's needed and it was seriously needed before the collapse but nobody seemed to be interested.

I don't know where you live, but in MKE, the Mayor who was in office from 1960-1988 made a point of keeping non-Whites in certain parts of the city and then, he removed a swath of homes from the North-South freeway halfway to the freeway at the West side of the city, to make the area where they could live even smaller. This was called the 'inner core' by the city officials but generally had been a thriving community until that guy was elected and everyone knew what they meant. His Police Chief was more like his enforcer and beatings by the Police were a regular occurrence. The more recent administrations have basically let much of the city rot in place, except where they want to make some kind of grand gesture.

And who mentioned anything about the Cotton Gin and slavery? Just read the words.

However, I totally agree that history (and other subjects) should be taught differently and better- how would you recommend they do this in a way that keeps the students interested? If you have some ideas, please tell the Milwaukee Public School System- they're not very effective in most subjects. Nationally, they still teach to the tests, rather than real life. That needs to change.

 

[highfigh]

Thank you for bringing up the gerrymandering - I meant to mention that earlier.

It is absolutely absurd that we attempt to pride ourselves on being a democracy, when we actively suppress the ability to vote. The recent GA Governor election is a great example - they closed dozens of polling stations specifically near African American communities. Hell, they even paved the road to the polling station right by me, the night of the election!

But I think it is also important to hear from the super wealthy that are acknowledging their need to contribute more to our country. We only have an interstate system because it was paid for with a 70% tax on the wealthy!

The US was also paying for WWII at the time and the country had a general "Can Do" attitude. Now, it's more "What's in it, for me?".

Did they spring that re-paving job without letting anyone know about it?

 

[TheWarrior]

I guess you didn't pick up on the sarcasm.

Does 'multi-term' mean 'more than two terms'? Should he be defined as "a great President', just because he was elected four times? I think not.

WRT integration, you mean court-ordered? If not for the death grip on the idea that Blacks were inferior, it wouldn't have required the courts to order it.

The US has fallen behind many other countries WRT education- if our Congress was doing their job, they would make sure the US remained at/near the top in all categories but I guess they're too busy shuffling their money. I'm not a big fan of regulation, unless it's needed and it was seriously needed before the collapse but nobody seemed to be interested.

I don't know where you live, but in MKE, the Mayor who was in office from 1960-1988 made a point of keeping non-Whites in certain parts of the city and then, he removed a swath of homes from the North-South freeway halfway to the freeway at the West side of the city, to make the area where they could live even smaller. This was called the 'inner core' by the city officials but generally had been a thriving community until that guy was elected and everyone knew what they meant. His Police Chief was more like his enforcer and beatings by the Police were a regular occurrence. The more recent administrations have basically let much of the city rot in place, except where they want to make some kind of grand gesture.

And who mentioned anything about the Cotton Gin and slavery? Just read the words.

However, I totally agree that history (and other subjects) should be taught differently and better- how would you recommend they do this in a way that keeps the students interested? If you have some ideas, please tell the Milwaukee Public School System- they're not very effective in most subjects. Nationally, they still teach to the tests, rather than real life. That needs to change.

Sir, we are having a discussion about fixing our broken political system. We just brought up the issues of imposing term limits and revoking Citizen's United.

You appear to be rambling on like a Trump tweet. Would you like to turn on Caps Lock?

 

[markw]

An EU citizen living as a resident in another EU member state can vote on local elections (municipal, regional in some places): Municipal elections in EU

Please note the bolded text. This assumes they are legally there and are already a citizen of an affiliated member state. I doubt just anyone can waltz in and vote..

 

[Trell]

Please note the bolded text. This assumes they are legally there and are already a citizen of an affiliated member state. I doubt just anyone can waltz in and vote..

Whatever makes you think I meant otherwise, in particular if you bothered to read the link I provided in the post you quoted?

 

[Irvrobinson]

We only have an interstate system because it was paid for with a 70% tax on the wealthy!

To my knowledge this isn't correct, not even a little bit. The Federal Aid Highway Act of 1956, which was the origin of the interstate system, only specified funding by the USG, and later the creation of the Federal Highway Corporation to issue bonds backed by the US Treasury (this is a very common funding strategy for USG agencies) and the implementation of federal fuel taxes.

Very few of the wealthy in those days ever paid a 70% marginal tax rate. There were lots of ways around it.

 

[markw]

Whatever makes you think I meant otherwise, in particular if you bothered to read the link I provided in the post you quoted?

The first words in your link "If you are an EU national living in another EU country"

This means that not just anybody can sneak in and vote. Do you thinik you or I could sneak in and demand to vote? How about an "undocumented visitor" from Central America? I don't think so.

The next paragraph :"If you want to vote in municipal elections in the country where you live, you first need to express your intention to do so and apply to be put on the electoral roll in that country. You will be asked to supply information such as your nationality and address.

Find out where and how to register in your host country"

You don't just show up at the courthouse and say you wanna vote. It looks like you've got to prove citizenship of one of the member states.

Again, since the EU sees the individual countries as the US sees individual states, your stance is still invalid.

We're done here.

 

[Trell]

The first words in your link "If you are an EU national living in another EU country"

The next paragraph :" f you want to vote in municipal elections in the country where you live, you first need to express your intention to do so and apply to be put on the electoral roll in that country. You will be asked to supply information such as your nationality and address.

Find out where and how to register in your host country"

You don't just show up at the voting booth.

I think your defence of your original comment is a bit weird as I never even hinted that anybody can just "show up at the voting booth", just as I (reasonably) assumed that when I wrote about EU citizens it is about legal citizenships.

Since the EU sees the individual countries as the US sees individual states, your stance is still invalid.

This is quite simply very wrong. European Union is not a federation like USA, far from it.

Perhaps your confusion stems from that "EU citizen" is a short hand for "citizen of an EU member country", even though there is a such a thing as "EU citizenship" that is additional to the national citizenship. However, no one except die-hard federalists (a very small minority) even think about their "EU citizenship", in contrast, I think, to an US citizen.

 

[little wing]

Can anybody tell me what "Make America great again" actually means? Obviously this country has good and bad...plenty of bad. But what does this catch phrase actually mean. When did America stop being great according to Frumpt? And what will make it great again??

 

[TheWarrior]

To my knowledge this isn't correct, not even a little bit. The Federal Aid Highway Act of 1956, which was the origin of the interstate system, only specified funding by the USG, and later the creation of the Federal Highway Corporation to issue bonds backed by the US Treasury (this is a very common funding strategy for USG agencies) and the implementation of federal fuel taxes.

Very few of the wealthy in those days ever paid a 70% marginal tax rate. There were lots of ways around it.

I am mistaken! Under FDR the highest tax rate was actually over 90%, but that was before the Federal Aid Highway Act which is responsible for the interstate system - yes thru fuel taxes.

 

[Trell]

This has actually turned out to be semi-productive!

There seems to be a general agreement that people on any side of the table are displeased with congresspeople holding office for life, as well as over turning Citizen's United.

I'm not living in USA, but I would feel uncomfortable with term limiting of congresspeople as some in this thread suggests as I think that citizens should be able to vote on those they want to represent them.

The video suggests that ending gerrymandering (a.k.a. rigged elections), ranked choice voting and automatic voter registration will help against an entrenched party handing themselves "office for life". I think that could be a good way to go, but there will be alot of resistance to these election reforms.

Staying on topic with the video - the fact is, regardless of what your preferred type of government is, the matters I mentioned above are a few of the roots that ensure We the People are NOT being represented by the people we have elected - regardless of public support, Congress has a 30% chance of turning a bill in to a law!

As I understand it the US public is more to the left than congress on several US divisive issues, like single-payer healthcare (Medicare for all?), abortion rights and stricter gun control.

 

[mtrycrafts]

...
Make a law saying that private corporations and associations can not donate more than 10k to government officials or political nominees. Ahhhh they be soo pissed. This would level the playing field big time IMO.
....

You mean you donate 10K now, every year?

If not, the playing field is still tilted. I don't, not even close.

 

[mtrycrafts]

.... The recent GA Governor election is a great example - they closed dozens of polling stations specifically near African American communities. Hell, they even paved the road to the polling station right by me, the night of the election!
..

And GA is not the only one that did it. One of the states and actually perhaps a district with a large population of American Indians changed rules, another state actually relocated the only polling place mile/s out of town; good size town with 1 polling place? Really?

 

[CB22]

You mean you donate 10K now, every year?

Lol, hell no, I donate zero. I’m talking more about people like George Soros and special interest groups who donate mega millions.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Can anybody tell me what "Make America great again" actually means? Obviously this country has good and bad...plenty of bad. But what does this catch phrase actually mean. When did America stop being great according to Frumpt? And what will make it great again??

It seems to me that MAGA was specifically intended not to have an explicit meaning, that it was intended to mean different things to different people. In a way it's a code phrase, intended to imply that Trump will reinstate the clarity of purpose, or the homogeneity of culture, or the greater relative power, or whatever, that the US was perceived to have in the 1950s and 1960s. And, IMO, with that clarity comes a simplicity of values and purpose that Americans didn't question 50 or 60 years ago. Communism and atheism were bad, the founding fathers were saint-like good, the US won WWII, US leadership in the world was dominant and unchallenged, the US was a dominant manufacturing power, caucasian Christians ran the country (with a few notable exceptions, who knew their places),and everyone else was a small minority. This is just my opinion, but I do think there are a lot of US citizens who long for the times when some or all of those things were true, and MAGA is code for any or all of this.

Frankly, I grew up in the 1960s, and I like the US of today a lot better than I did the US of 1965.

 

[little wing]

It seems to me that MAGA was specifically intended not to have an explicit meaning, that it was intended to mean different things to different people. In a way it's a code phrase, intended to imply that Trump will reinstate the clarity of purpose, or the homogeneity of culture, or the greater relative power, or whatever, that the US was perceived to have in the 1950s and 1960s. And, IMO, with that clarity comes a simplicity of values and purpose that Americans didn't question 50 or 60 years ago. Communism and atheism were bad, the founding fathers were saint-like good, the US won WWII, US leadership in the world was dominant and unchallenged, the US was a dominant manufacturing power, caucasian Christians ran the country (with a few notable exceptions, who knew their places),and everyone else was a small minority. This is just my opinion, but I do think there are a lot of US citizens who long for the times when some or all of those things were true, and MAGA is code for any or all of this.

Frankly, I grew up in the 1960s, and I like the US of today a lot better than I did the US of 1965.

Thank you for that Irv. Very interesting and enlightening post. I grew up in less turbulent times, 70s and 80s. The world has indeed changed in many ways. You are right, after the US came out of WWII victorious after so much sacrifice by so many, we were leaders of the free world. Japanese imperialism and Nazism had to be laid to rest. I think you hit the nail on the head when you say caucasian Christians ran the country with a few notable exceptions who knew their place. One thing that strikes me is the affinity to foreign dictators he seems to have. Anyway, I agree, the US is better off today than in 1965. One thing that's not better though, is the fact that we lost so many great musicians.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Lol, hell no, I donate zero. I’m talking more about people like George Soros and special interest groups who donate mega millions.

I figured as much. So, even $10K would not be equal speech. He has it the rest don't.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Thank you for that Irv. Very interesting and enlightening post. I grew up in less turbulent times, 70s and 80s. The world has indeed changed in many ways. You are right, after the US came out of WWII victorious after so much sacrifice by so many, we were leaders of the free world. Japanese imperialism and Nazism had to be laid to rest. I think you hit the nail on the head when you say caucasian Christians ran the country with a few notable exceptions who knew their place. One thing that strikes me is the affinity to foreign dictators he seems to have. Anyway, I agree, the US is better off today than in 1965. One thing that's not better though, is the fact that we lost so many great musicians.

Yeah, and that US-led WWII victory we all learned about? Well, a lot of Americans, like over 400,000, gave their lives for that victory, and Americans did sacrifice a lot to help achieve the victory. I had relatives who were in action. But the Russians lost an estimated 24 million, and without them the war would have probably been lost, more so than without us. I wonder how the story should really be told, but that's blasphemy.