What Happens When You Start Listening To Vinyl Again

KenM10759

KenM10759

Audioholic Samurai
I don't have a CD player. I haven't had one in years and I don't want one. Regardless, 99% of my listening is done via digital source files. Any CDs I own or come across I copy with EAC. I use Roon to access the Lossless FLAC files either stored on my HD or streamed from Tidal. My current DAC is amazing, probably the best sound I've ever achieved from digital files. I control everything remotely via iPad or other device. I never derived joy or a connection from the physical aspect of a CD so I don't miss having to switch them in and out of a transport.

I do have a turntable that is an excellent performer mounted with a nice Stereohedron Stylus (Shibata type- WOW!) going into an impressive phono stage and I do enjoy it very much. The physical involvement of vinyl playback is part of the experience. Tweaking to get everything right, stevenson, baerwald, loefgren cart alignment, azimuth, VTA, scales, tracking force, cart output, compliance, arm mass etc., etc. When all is said and done I often watch the record spin as the diamond is dragged through the grooves and am still amazed how good vinyl can sound. It's definitely not easy to extract all the information in those groves but when you do it can be quite satisfying.

Digital & Vinyl coexist here. It's fun to change it up once in a while.
Same for me, though I do still own a CD player that's there as a backup.

You described better than I probably can how it's the interactive, involved process of playing an LP that is a huge part of the enjoyment. I don't mean all the setup of the TT, as most don't have all those controls, but in actually getting up every 22 minutes or so to flip or change the music is actually fun. :)
 
E

<eargiant

Senior Audioholic
There's time for all of it. I own CD's, vinyl, digital and grew up with a piano in the house. Would do tape as well if I felt like it. Reel-to-reel takes some physical/mental involvement as well, but I don't have the room.

Some of the art on /in CDs is pretty cool too. Some have 3d/holographic art that is pretty interesting to look at.

This one is a hard paper cover, with recording info, mic placement etc. Incredible recording and artist. CD is in a protective sleeve within the cover.






Very nice, thanks for sharing. Your post prompted me to search Tidal so as I type this I'm to listen to Tsuyoshi Yamamoto & Marco Bosco "Live At Brazilian Embassy in Tokyo". Years apart from the album you posted but an excellent and enjoyable recording nonetheless.

These are great times we live in where we have so many high quality music sources at our disposal - and some are just a fingertip away...
 
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MR.MAGOO

MR.MAGOO

Audioholic Field Marshall
At $1700 it's kinda pricey; Cambridge Audio now sells a new direct drive turntable with moving-coil cartridge.. That's what happens now that I'm listening to vinyl again, I go to websites and find this!

https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/en/products/alva/alva-tt

Audioholics reviewed the new Fluance table, do you think they'd take a crack at Cambridge?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
At $1700 it's kinda pricey; Cambridge Audio now sells a new direct drive turntable with moving-coil cartridge.. That's what happens now that I'm listening to vinyl again, I go to websites and find this!

https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/en/products/alva/alva-tt

Audioholics reviewed the new Fluance table, do you think they'd take a crack at Cambridge?
The frequency response of the cartridge is about the worst I have seen, for Moving Coil. The whole reason for using those is the extended high frequency response and many, like the Denon versions, go past 40KHz. While it's true that the LPs don't usually have anything up there, why not be able to produce it if the LP is direct to disc or some other version that is above the rest in quality?

And, if you read up on what audiopiles want in a turntable, this uses direct drive- they prefer belt drive because it doesn't transmit vibrations from the motor. Hell, some manufacturers separate the motor and base completely.

That said, I have come to the conclusion that it's best to keep these as simple as possible- mine has a servo-controlled tonearm and, while the background noise level is extremely low, it occasionally has some hiccups because of dirty switches so, at almost 40 years old, the time may have come to replace it.
 
GrimSurfer

GrimSurfer

Senior Audioholic
The frequency response of the cartridge is about the worst I have seen, for Moving Coil. The whole reason for using those is the extended high frequency response and many, like the Denon versions, go past 40KHz. While it's true that the LPs don't usually have anything up there, why not be able to produce it if the LP is direct to disc or some other version that is above the rest in quality?

And, if you read up on what audiopiles want in a turntable, this uses direct drive- they prefer belt drive because it doesn't transmit vibrations from the motor. Hell, some manufacturers separate the motor and base completely.

That said, I have come to the conclusion that it's best to keep these as simple as possible- mine has a servo-controlled tonearm and, while the background noise level is extremely low, it occasionally has some hiccups because of dirty switches so, at almost 40 years old, the time may have come to replace it.
Not surprising...

I just love seeing people, companies that are good at one thing figure that this gives them the cred to do something else... and charge high prices for it.

Cambridge Audio designs some reasonable DACs. They then moved into entry level and (later) mid range amps and receivers, phono preamps, etc. which makes sense from a circuit design perspective. But turntables are electro mechanical devices, which is a different ball game.

So perhaps their time would have been more productively spent learning about TT design from the ground up... designing simple and inexpensive turntables before moving into a price range within which a lot of very experienced manufacturers reside.

I regard this as something akin to actors or musicians who use their celebrity to start talking about politics. It's their right to say their piece, but nobody's going to take them seriously unless what they say is particularly considered OR steeped in some experience. Their credibility is compromised when they say one thing and do another.

Bono is the an example of a unimath, who thinks he's a polymath. He's also an avowed socialist who has a spotty record of paying his taxes in a country that already boasts a low tax rate, which I find rather odd. Outside of crooning, I'm surprised he's taken very seriously be anyone.

Who knows, maybe this product will cast CA in the same light. Hope not... they should stick to what they're reasonably good at. If they want to expand, they'd be well advised to do so in a measured fashion. Otherwise, they run the risk of becoming the sort of "audiophile" company that sells for more and delivers less.
 
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highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Not surprising...

I just love seeing people, companies that are good at one thing figure that this gives them the cred to do something else... and charge high prices for it.

Cambridge Audio designs some reasonable DACs. They then moved into entry level and (later) mid range amps and receivers, phono preamps, etc. which makes sense from a circuit design perspective. But turntables are electro mechanical devices, which is a different ball game.

So perhaps their time would have been more productively spent learning about TT design from the ground up... designing simple and inexpensive turntables before moving into a price range within which a lot of very experienced manufacturers reside.

I regard this as something akin to actors or musicians who use their celebrity to start talking about politics. It's their right to say their piece, but nobody's going to take them seriously unless what they say is particularly considered OR steeped in some experience. Their credibility is compromised when they say one thing and do another.

Bono is the an example of a unimath, who thinks he's a polymath. He's also an avowed socialist who has a spotty record of paying his taxes in a country that already boasts a low tax rate, which I find rather odd. Outside of crooning, I'm surprised he's taken very seriously be anyone.

Who knows, maybe this product will cast CA in the same light. Hope not... they should stick to what they're reasonably good at. If they want to expand, they'd be well advised to do so in a measured fashion. Otherwise, they run the risk of becoming the sort of "audiophile" company that sells for more and delivers less.
You have Cambridge backward- they have been selling analog equipment for a long time. It's a decent looking table- it would be interesting to see, feel, touch and hear it.


I don't have a problem when celebrities adopt a cause, but I don't want to hear them preaching when they don't know enough about it to say what they do- that goes for members of Congress, too. Bono is good at telling people they should donate to his pet causes, but he's still worth more than half Billion dollars. He can't be THAT much of a Socialist. Oh, wait- they don't want to share THEIR money, though.

There's a story about Bono stepping up to the mic at a concert in Northern Ireland, after they finished a song. He starts clapping his hands slowly and, after about ten seconds, says "Every time I clap, a child dies in Ethiopia". From the back of the room, "Then, stop clapping".
 
GrimSurfer

GrimSurfer

Senior Audioholic
You have Cambridge backward- they have been selling analog equipment for a long time. It's a decent looking table- it would be interesting to see, feel, touch and hear it.


I don't have a problem when celebrities adopt a cause, but I don't want to hear them preaching when they don't know enough about it to say what they do- that goes for members of Congress, too. Bono is good at telling people they should donate to his pet causes, but he's still worth more than half Billion dollars. He can't be THAT much of a Socialist. Oh, wait- they don't want to share THEIR money, though.

There's a story about Bono stepping up to the mic at a concert in Northern Ireland, after they finished a song. He starts clapping his hands slowly and, after about ten seconds, says "Every time I clap, a child dies in Ethiopia". From the back of the room, "Then, stop clapping".
I didn't say analog. I said electro mechanical.

Love the Bono story!
 
E

<eargiant

Senior Audioholic
At $1700 it's kinda pricey; Cambridge Audio now sells a new direct drive turntable with moving-coil cartridge.. That's what happens now that I'm listening to vinyl again, I go to websites and find this!

https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/en/products/alva/alva-tt

Audioholics reviewed the new Fluance table, do you think they'd take a crack at Cambridge?
If someone is looking for a reasonably priced new entry level deck with a built-in phono stage option this is the one to get:

https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1500c/
 
GrimSurfer

GrimSurfer

Senior Audioholic
Technics has been at this a long time and has considerable capacity for R&D, in house manufacturing, and QC, so it's not surprising that their tables wow and flutter would be four times less than the CA one...
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I didn't say analog. I said electro mechanical.

Love the Bono story!
I was referring to the comment about DAC- it reads like you're saying they sold those before analog equipment.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
If someone is looking for a reasonably priced new entry level deck with a built-in phono stage option this is the one to get:

https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1500c/
I see they're selling to people who don't understand what's happening when a stylus is in a groove-

"The tonearm, which is responsible for accurately reading the signal by tracking the groove on the phono record,...".

And all this time, I thought it was the stylus that 'reads' the signal.
 
E

<eargiant

Senior Audioholic
I see they're selling to people who don't understand what's happening when a stylus is in a groove-

"The tonearm, which is responsible for accurately reading the signal by tracking the groove on the phono record,...".

And all this time, I thought it was the stylus that 'reads' the signal.
Even a novice understands that the stylus reads the grooves, it's the obvious point of contact. I think they're actually trying to educate those that are not aware of the importance of the tone arm design (from tube to base) and how it is crucial for conveying the information in the grooves.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Even a novice understands that the stylus reads the grooves, it's the obvious point of contact. I think they're actually trying to educate those that are not aware of the importance of the tone arm design (from tube to base) and how it is crucial for conveying the information in the grooves.
I think they should have gone into the importance of matching the tonearm's mass to the compliance of the cantilever. That seems to have been forgotten, unless someone actually searches for it. It can be explained in a way that's easy to understand- it's very similar to a vehicle's suspension.
 
M

MrBoat

Audioholic Ninja
The Direct Drive on the Hitachi is dead silent. Having the table in the same room as the speakers would be a greater concern than anything a motor could inflict. I thought if I liked this enough, I might would upgrade to something nicer, but considering the crudeness of this format compared to digital, many of these older instruments are still more precise than the task they are asked to perform.

It's nice to splurge on what we like, but many of these older TT's are worth a shot before shelling out thousands. I have seen these sell on ebae for $30-100. Most of which, have maybe worn out the original stylus before being abandoned as junk. Mine had worn about half of one before CDs shelfed it.

When looking at what qualities one should look at in a TT, many of these check most of the boxes.
 
M

MrBoat

Audioholic Ninja
Very nice, thanks for sharing. Your post prompted me to search Tidal so as I type this I'm to listen to Tsuyoshi Yamamoto & Marco Bosco "Live At Brazilian Embassy in Tokyo". Years apart from the album you posted but an excellent and enjoyable recording nonetheless.

These are great times we live in where we have so many high quality music sources at our disposal - and some are just a fingertip away...
This trio is one of jazz's best kept (perhaps not, I may just not get to jazz town much) secrets. I intend to collect as much of their work as I can. I have 3 CDs from them so far, which are a little spendy but I have really enjoyed them. Top 5 of my jazz list. I have been a piano head for most of my life. This scratches that itch. The CD titled, "Midnight Sugar," is a must have.
 
E

<eargiant

Senior Audioholic
I think they should have gone into the importance of matching the tonearm's mass to the compliance of the cantilever. That seems to have been forgotten, unless someone actually searches for it. It can be explained in a way that's easy to understand- it's very similar to a vehicle's suspension.
I disagree, not for a brief marketing page on an entry level table like this that already comes with an entry level cartridge that is a good match for the mass of the tone arm. Information like that will only make a beginners head spin. This is a plug 'n play unit, ready to go.

If an enthusiasts then chooses to delve deeper into the rabbit hole of vinyl playback that information is readily available today more than ever with the internet and many, many forums dedicated to this sub-sect of the hobby. There is a wealth of information out there.
 
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highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
The Direct Drive on the Hitachi is dead silent. Having the table in the same room as the speakers would be a greater concern than anything a motor could inflict. I thought if I liked this enough, I might would upgrade to something nicer, but considering the crudeness of this format compared to digital, many of these older instruments are still more precise than the task they are asked to perform.

It's nice to splurge on what we like, but many of these older TT's are worth a shot before shelling out thousands. I have seen these sell on ebae for $30-100. Most of which, have maybe worn out the original stylus before being abandoned as junk. Mine had worn about half of one before CDs shelfed it.

When looking at what qualities one should look at in a TT, many of these check most of the boxes.
My Sony is dead quiet, too- lots of this depends on the motor's bearing.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I disagree, not for a brief marketing page on an entry level table like this that already comes with an entry level cartridge that is a good match for the mass of the tone arm. Information like that will only make a beginners head spin. This is a plug 'n play unit, ready to go.

If an enthusiasts then chooses to delve deeper into the rabbit hole of vinyl playback that information is readily available today more than ever with the internet and many, many forums dedicated to this sub-sect of the hobby. There is a wealth of information out there.
Then again, it IS $1700. I would think that $50 could go toward the BT transmitter, hard to say how much for the cartridge. I wonder if/how much better it is than an $800 table.
 
MR.MAGOO

MR.MAGOO

Audioholic Field Marshall
If someone is looking for a reasonably priced new entry level deck with a built-in phono stage option this is the one to get:

https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1500c/
The Technics is $1400, per the below website, I suppose that's reasonably priced compared to the $1700 Cambridge.

https://audio-head.com/technics-new-sl-1200mk7-sl-1500c-turntables-ces-2019/

I'm satisfied with my ProJect Debut Carbon Esprit, would like to try a MC (moving coil) cartridge.
 

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