Please help with AV receiver purchase

[Bad_ben81]

If you're in the US and near a Frys it's worth signing up for their newsletter just to get your daily personal promo codes. For the last couple of months they've been blowing out Denon's AVR-X2400 for $300ish, AVR-X3400H for under $500, and AVR-X4400H for as low as $800 in one-day sales (personalized promo code required). These seem to go on sale every week or two.

Thank you Sholling. I have moved to Atlanta recently and there is a Frys near me. Thank you for the info, I shall sign up for their newsletter.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Altec Lansing model 19 speakers were driven by sony str dh130. I like to listen to moderate to loud music. But the receiver would need to be at around 90%volume level for even a moderate sound to be produced.

Those speakers have a sensitivity of about 100dB/watt/meter, nominal impedance of 8 ohms, power rating of 10W - 350W.

You should Ben able to play them very loud with just 10-40 Watts if your room is about 18x20.

If you listen from 12FT away from speakers, just 10W of power will produce about 105dB of sound. 20W will produce 108dB. 40W will produce 111dB. Extremely Loud with very little power.

That cheap Sony Stereo receiver is rated at 100W x 2Ch at 1kHz 1% THD, so probably 50WPC x 2Ch 20Hz-20kHz.

If you have a “Speaker Channel Level” setting in the receiver, increase it and you won’t need to increase the Master volume knob so much.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Anyway, if you want to try a new cheap AVR, just get something on sale for $200-300.

Your speakers do not need a lot of power.

Increase thae Speaker Channel Levels if you don’t want to crank up the volume knob.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

You probably already know this, but listening to music above 90dB is not great for your long term hearing.

 

[Bad_ben81]

Anyway, if you want to try a new cheap AVR, just get something on sale for $200-300.

Your speakers do not need a lot of power.

Increase thae Speaker Channel Levels if you don’t want to crank up the volume knob.

Hi AcuDefTechGuy, thank you for your reply. I am now wary of buying a new receiver without a good source of recommendation. I bought that Sony receiver for $250, assuming that 135W per channel was sufficient to drive my speakers. It's not that I went too cheap, though I was on the low range. I hope you understand my frustration with Sony.
Also, though the specs say 135W x2, and it doesn't deliver, I am wondering (out loud) if theres anything else I should look at in the specs prior to buying a new receiver!! Once bitten, twice shy.... is where I am at now.
I am sure Sony does have some great receivers, but would like to know if it's a hit or miss situation with them or any other receivers, or if a particular spec will aid me to realize if the receiver i am looking at is worth it.

I shall look tonight and let you know if I can find a Speaker Channel Level in the receiver and the outcome.
Also another question (probably a dumb one), what factor pointed you to the possibility of 50WPCX 2Ch was being delivered as opposed to the stated 135WPC initially specified. As stated earlier I am a newbie, and would like to learn what to look out for.

 

[lovinthehd]

First of all, let me apologize for an incomplete description of my situation. I am a complete newbie and still need to look through the internet for basic info on audio systems. I agree when you say percentage of volume control is a poor way to define volume.
I inherited these speakers with the house that I had bought. I remember the first time I heard those speakers during the house showing. The model 19s were in the basement and we were in the level floor. The owner turned up the volume on these speakers and I could feel the vibration from the floor, not just hear the music. So I know for a fact that these speakers can play real loud (too loud for me).
I was completely clueless on audio systems back then, so I did not bother to see what setup he had. It was these speakers that got me hooked onto audio systems and desire to set one up for myself began. When I looked up on audio systems, I was amazed to see a wider world beyond reciever and home theater systems.
When I look at the specs for the speakers, the amplifier operating range is 10W to 350W, with Long term max acoustic output of 117 dbSPL @ 65W. Forgive my ignorance, since I am expecting this to play at a decent level of volume with good clarity, driven by a 135W per channel receiver at around or a bit above of 50% of volume control to reach the 65W. Currently I need to play the receiver at around 90% of the volume control jacked up, and this causes the receiver to crash or shut down the volume when there's a sudden change in music. I am not expecting the receiver to crash at these levels when playing since I am expecting to use around 65W to power the speakers at a decent level of volume.
At this point, I am assuming either I have not setup the system right, or that the receiver is not capable of delivering 65W without crashing.

The volume control isn't doing what you're assuming it's doing. Your avr is also only rated at 90wpc at 8 ohm (2ch driven, 20-20,000 hz, .09% THD) per the manual, altho the difference between 90 wpc and 135 wpc is only 1.8dB; the power rating could be higher at 4 ohm or 6 ohm but isn't specified. The volume control position isn't relevant to the percentage of power (it could be much less than half power with the volume control at a half way position, or it could be at full stretch depending on source/level). Sony doesn't use a calibrated dB scale like some avrs, so hard to be specific or compare to other units at all.

The wattage really doesn't matter with such efficient/sensitive speakers, tho the impedance swings could be important (your speakers are rated nominal 8 ohm but could swing as low as 4 ohm at parts of the frequency range, too). You might need a beefier amp if low impedance is at play...that Sony likely isn't very capable at 4 ohms. Double check your connections, too.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Hi AcuDefTechGuy, thank you for your reply. I am now wary of buying a new receiver without a good source of recommendation. I bought that Sony receiver for $250, assuming that 135W per channel was sufficient to drive my speakers. It's not that I went too cheap, though I was on the low range. I hope you understand my frustration with Sony.
Also, though the specs say 135W x2, and it doesn't deliver, I am wondering (out loud) if theres anything else I should look at in the specs prior to buying a new receiver!! Once bitten, twice shy.... is where I am at now.
I am sure Sony does have some great receivers, but would like to know if it's a hit or miss situation with them or any other receivers, or if a particular spec will aid me to realize if the receiver i am looking at is worth it.

I shall look tonight and let you know if I can find a Speaker Channel Level in the receiver and the outcome.
Also another question (probably a dumb one),what factor pointed you to the possibility of 50WPCX 2Ch was being delivered as opposed to the stated 135WPC initially specified. As stated earlier I am a newbie, and would like to learn what to look out for.

I didn’t look at the manual. As @lovinthehd pointed out, the actual spec is 90W x 2Ch into 8 ohms from 20Hz-20kHz @ 0.9% THD.

So this is the spec details you would look at: Watts x numbers of Channels into 8 ohms from 20Hz-20kHz @ less than 1.0% THD.

90W is very capable. And your speakers are super sensitive which means they don’t require much power (only 10W-40W) to play extremely loud.

However, it is also possible that the receiver may be defective.

If you are asking which brands of receivers are most reliable, it is probably Yamaha follow by Sony follow by Marantz and Denon.

 

[Bad_ben81]

Hi all, thank you for all the replies. I checked the receiver and couldn't find the speaker channel level. But I found that I could clear all the settings on the receiver. Once I did that, the speakers seemed to sound much louder than before, but the room it used to be in has changed.
Inspite of the louder output from the speakers, I plan to look for a better receiver and moved the Sony receiver to a different room. I shall look for Yamaha, denon or hk receivers in the under $500 range and >135WPC into 8ohms @<1%THDand let you know on what I find before buying it. Thank you all once again for all your help.

 

[lovinthehd]

Hi all, thank you for all the replies. I checked the receiver and couldn't find the speaker channel level. But I found that I could clear all the settings on the receiver. Once I did that, the speakers seemed to sound much louder than before, but the room it used to be in has changed.
Inspite of the louder output from the speakers, I plan to look for a better receiver and moved the Sony receiver to a different room. I shall look for Yamaha, denon or hk receivers in the under $500 range and >135WPC into 8ohms @<1%THDand let you know on what I find before buying it. Thank you all once again for all your help.

The particular room has one of the greatest influences on sound, as much as the speakers themselves. The electronics play a very minor role. Resetting a receiver and starting over is always a good way to go so you know what you've done. You still don't get the importance of wattage apparently, tho. You really should dig into the knowledge side rather than the advertising side....

 

[TLS Guy]

First of all, let me apologize for an incomplete description of my situation. I am a complete newbie and still need to look through the internet for basic info on audio systems. I agree when you say percentage of volume control is a poor way to define volume.
I inherited these speakers with the house that I had bought. I remember the first time I heard those speakers during the house showing. The model 19s were in the basement and we were in the level floor. The owner turned up the volume on these speakers and I could feel the vibration from the floor, not just hear the music. So I know for a fact that these speakers can play real loud (too loud for me).
I was completely clueless on audio systems back then, so I did not bother to see what setup he had. It was these speakers that got me hooked onto audio systems and desire to set one up for myself began. When I looked up on audio systems, I was amazed to see a wider world beyond reciever and home theater systems.
When I look at the specs for the speakers, the amplifier operating range is 10W to 350W, with Long term max acoustic output of 117 dbSPL @ 65W. Forgive my ignorance, since I am expecting this to play at a decent level of volume with good clarity, driven by a 135W per channel receiver at around or a bit above of 50% of volume control to reach the 65W. Currently I need to play the receiver at around 90% of the volume control jacked up, and this causes the receiver to crash or shut down the volume when there's a sudden change in music. I am not expecting the receiver to crash at these levels when playing since I am expecting to use around 65W to power the speakers at a decent level of volume.
At this point, I am assuming either I have not setup the system right, or that the receiver is not capable of delivering 65W without crashing.

Your receiver is broken or your source is suspect. It could be your source is not driving the receiver properly. Exactly what is your source for program? Those speakers come from a time when 10 watts was a lot of power.

A 10 watt per channel amp properly working will drive those speakers to deafening levels. The speakers are 8 ohm with a sensitivity of 102 db at 4 ft, 1 watt! Heck you can deafen yourself with those speakers with a tiny amp!

We need total information and disclosure on your set up. The fact that your receiver is shutting down driving what is a very easy load, makes me suspect your receiver is broken, or your have a speaker wiring error, with an electric whisker some place. A new receiver will only solve this if yours is broken. If not you will have the same problem with the new one.

 

[lovinthehd]

Hi all, thank you for all the replies. I checked the receiver and couldn't find the speaker channel level. But I found that I could clear all the settings on the receiver. Once I did that, the speakers seemed to sound much louder than before, but the room it used to be in has changed.
Inspite of the louder output from the speakers, I plan to look for a better receiver and moved the Sony receiver to a different room. I shall look for Yamaha, denon or hk receivers in the under $500 range and >135WPC into 8ohms @<1%THDand let you know on what I find before buying it. Thank you all once again for all your help.

FWIW, in a 2ch stereo receiver generally you simply have a balance control instead of individual channel levels.

 

[67-79]

Today you can surely buy a complete used car audio system on local ads for 50 dollars paid by one of your friend and install this in your living room and call all your friends and some respectful neighbors that will bring their complete cd lineup of led zeppelin and grateful dead and maybe if they are still in good shaped form , pantera and nine inchs nail and I also recommend gary numan ' the pleasure principle ' that we don't hear nowhere these days...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

We’ll, if you’re buying another receiver, just stick to a 5.1 or 7.1 AVR from Yamaha, Sony, Denon, Marantz. You can still just use 2CH if you want.

Don’t buy another 2CH Stereo receiver.

 

[TLS Guy]

I think you are getting bad advice. If this is going to be a classic two channel rig only with no sub, DO NOT buy an AV receiver.

Receivers really are the bottom end of the audio totem pole. They are really an easy economic solution for the new AV age. If you can avoid a receiver, which unfortunately to many they are an evil necessity, give them a wide berth.

It seems to me your speakers and set up are crying out for good vintage powering of the period.

My son has a nice pair of speakers of my design. Recently his receiver blew up. It is an audio only 2.0 rig. I set him up with a vintage preamp and power amp, and even I was totally amazed at the massive improvement in SQ and so was he.

I would be very careful about putting out cash, for a device with huge complexity done on the cheap, that you will probably never need and with severe skimping on what you really need which is good amplification.

In audio only systems you can use a good external DAC for digital sources.

Those speakers are a classic and a very good example of the "West Coast Sound" of the seventies era. They should be powered as such.

 

[67-79]

Each And every things is recorded in stereo, pantera, elvis, jazz, films, adult videos, etc. any pair of speakers and 2 channels audio amplifiers can play any audio recording, live or recorded. remember that audio, especially music like Madonna, tina turner, even celine dion are only stereo. These high-financials institutions like silicon valley in the late seventees succeeded to irradicate the musicians and the music royalties business with the help of the international electronic manufacturers in implementing horrible music and horrible multi audios channels amplifiers where nothing work. in the past it was elvis and the beatles and deep purple that decided what songs we buy and listen too on normalized stereo sound systems. Now I cancelled all my tv cable fees ( where no good music is played ) and I connected an antenna , and I put the audio volume at zero. Quite often I just close each and everything and sit outside because im old and there is no new good music to listen too. Sometime I go to some bars to listen to some new music and I just like music recorded before 1980, lol.

 

[67-79]

I just discovered a latest generation high power stereo car amplifier of 5 000 watts pyramid that sell for only 104 dollars on amazon. If it cost too much , start to work part-time at macdonnald or borrow the money. This is a carefully digital circuitry amp that shoot short impulse voltage of up to 700 volts without overloading the speakers coils. It just let the speaker cones accelerate in and out, to carefully follow the recorded music at very high outputs. This will prevent any over heat in both the amplifier and speakers. Some peoples can surely buy a hundred of this amplifier to start building digital satellites and air tv signals. I will buy this as soon as I pay my last credit card bill.

https://www.amazon.ca/Pyramid-PB3818-Channel-Bridgeable-Amplifier/dp/B004M9A0M8

 

[PENG]

I just discovered a latest generation high power stereo car amplifier of 5 000 watts pyramid that sell for only 104 dollars on amazon. If it cost too much , start to work part-time at macdonnald or borrow the money. This is a carefully digital circuitry amp that shoot short impulse voltage of up to 700 volts without overloading the speakers coils. It just let the speaker cones accelerate in and out, to carefully follow the recorded music at very high outputs. This will prevent any over heat in both the amplifier and speakers. Some peoples can surely buy a hundred of this amplifier to start building digital satellites and air tv signals. I will buy this as soon as I pay my last credit card bill.

https://www.amazon.ca/Pyramid-PB3818-Channel-Bridgeable-Amplifier/dp/B004M9A0M8

What's your room size and sitting distance?
Hard to figure your amp/receiver power need without the info. And do you want you music really loud, like cinema, live rock concerts?

 

[67-79]

What's your room size and sitting distance?
Hard to figure your amp/receiver power need without the info. And do you want you music really loud, like cinema, live rock concerts?

I listen mostly metallica and slayer at low volume with my friends.This amp can play at low volume too.

I listen At maximum decibel output when im alone
in my car or in my house. Some years ago, i listened deep purple all night long in a car with 2 other friends on a basic old fashion system in 1982 . This new latest amp should play approx 15 more decibel ( 132 db approx max ). At that price, you can surely buy it now before the trump government put 700% trading fees on it.

 

[PENG]

I listen mostly metallica and slayer at low volume with my friends.This amp can play at low volume too.

I listen At maximum decibel output when im alone

Still need you sitting distance from the speakers, preferable approx room dimensions too if you don't mind.
You can also use the linked calculator:

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

According to the specs, your speaker's sensitivity is 99 to 102 dB depending on the adjustment and it is from 4 ft, so to use the calculator that is based on 1 meter, you should use 100.3 to 103.3, but I would suggest you enter 97 dB just to be conservative.

Keep in mind the specs also say the speakers can handle only 65 W maximum, long term broad band, recommended amp power is 10-350 watts.

 

[PENG]

This new latest amp should play approx 15 more decibel ( 132 db approx max ).

What latest amp, which post?