Rob Babcock
Moderator
<font color='#8D38C9'>Hey, what's wrong with picking the pretty one!?
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"Let our rigorous testing and reviews be your guidelines to A/V equipment – not marketing slogans"
rgriffin25
Moderator
<font color='#000000'>Shinerman,
Maybe you need to relax a bit. I was not at all trying attack you or insult your knowledge about Home Theater products. Or anyone else for that matter.
I just felt that most responses that recommended the Yamaha receivers were not very informative. I thought that members such as yourself might give a better response if provoked to do so.
So instead of nit-picking each of my posts in hope of running me off, share with us your experiences with different products. So that we all may be better informed when spending thousands on our dream system.
By the way "Beauty" is not skin deep with my receiver.</font>
Maybe you need to relax a bit. I was not at all trying attack you or insult your knowledge about Home Theater products. Or anyone else for that matter.
I just felt that most responses that recommended the Yamaha receivers were not very informative. I thought that members such as yourself might give a better response if provoked to do so.
So instead of nit-picking each of my posts in hope of running me off, share with us your experiences with different products. So that we all may be better informed when spending thousands on our dream system.
By the way "Beauty" is not skin deep with my receiver.</font>
Z
zumbo
Audioholic Spartan
<font color='#000000'>You can put pearls on a pig, but it's still a pig.
I am sure your receiver is a great receiver, sorry you are not as certain about your purchase as we are.
P.S. Not trying to run anyone off. I am here for the learning experience. Nothing wrong with a little good humor. I certainly took no offense with your comments!
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I am sure your receiver is a great receiver, sorry you are not as certain about your purchase as we are.
P.S. Not trying to run anyone off. I am here for the learning experience. Nothing wrong with a little good humor. I certainly took no offense with your comments!
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I
im timmy
Audioholic Intern
<font color='#A8A8A8'>I like the sound of the 2400 period. Clear, well defined, ands sounds powerful to me without any problems. I don't use the dsp's, I do like the features on this unit, and that does play into a decision to some. I like the look of the unit, nice finish. I am not biased towards yamaha, I really compared the 2400 to the denon 3803, and onkyo. All of these manufacturers sound good to me, but they do sound different. The denon and the onkyo to me are warmer, they are well defined to my ear as well. The sound of my 2400 seems more edgy, I like it. Speakers paired with these units have alot to do with how they sound to many also. This is all just my opinion, I have posted here that if the 3805 were out the same time I may have gone the denon route just for a change of sound. From the looks of the 3805, i'm sure many will buy it, it is sharp looking. And lets all keep it real in that Company reputation does play a role in decision making. I would be confident buying a denon or an onkyo or a few others for that matter based on reputation and other reviews. Try listening to a yamaha and some others and decide for yourself what you like, and keep inmind the speakers that you will pair the unit with.
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rgriffin25
Moderator
<font color='#000000'>Shinerman,
Perhaps my description of the Pioneer was not as technical as you like. The last time I checked, several magazines consider the asthetics of a product to be important. Some even use it when calculating the overall score. In my opinion the yamaha's build quality is not on par with the pioneer. The front panel looks cheap and the remote is a nightmare.
When making the comparison between the two receivers I compared the spec sheets thouroughly. There were only minor differences in the two.
The Yamaha upconverts to component video.
(which with my tv I do not need that feature.)
The Yamaha has DPL IIx
For those keeping score that is 2 points for Yammy!
Pioneer Elite
Multiple EQ settings- allows users to use MCACC or 2 other custom settings for different sources.
Hi-Bit audio conversion - Converts all audio sources to 96/24 resolution
Build quality and ergonomics
Then if you consider I bought the Pioneer for $680 shipped, it was the best value at the time.
Pioneer 3 points for performance and with the price factored in, +1 it receives a 4.
So on that particular day the Pioneer won. I have no regrets on my purchase. With all the other specs compared there is no reason at all anyone shopping for a good "value" receiver should disregard the Pioneer VSX-53TX.
About the comment " I also try not to talk above my head about things I don't understand" You couldn't be further from the truth. I work at an electronis store and have hands on experience installing several brands of Home Theater receivers. A majority of the time spent at work is installing HD/ Home theater equipment purchased at our store.
On several occations I have installed Higher-End Home Theater receivers such as the Denon 5803. I have experience connecting Yamaha, Onkyo, and Pioneer Elite receivers.
I am not claiming that I am an expert in the field. But I can say that I have been around the various brands enough to make a good decision on what brands are a good choice.</font>
Perhaps my description of the Pioneer was not as technical as you like. The last time I checked, several magazines consider the asthetics of a product to be important. Some even use it when calculating the overall score. In my opinion the yamaha's build quality is not on par with the pioneer. The front panel looks cheap and the remote is a nightmare.
When making the comparison between the two receivers I compared the spec sheets thouroughly. There were only minor differences in the two.
The Yamaha upconverts to component video.
(which with my tv I do not need that feature.)
The Yamaha has DPL IIx
For those keeping score that is 2 points for Yammy!
Pioneer Elite
Multiple EQ settings- allows users to use MCACC or 2 other custom settings for different sources.
Hi-Bit audio conversion - Converts all audio sources to 96/24 resolution
Build quality and ergonomics
Then if you consider I bought the Pioneer for $680 shipped, it was the best value at the time.
Pioneer 3 points for performance and with the price factored in, +1 it receives a 4.
So on that particular day the Pioneer won. I have no regrets on my purchase. With all the other specs compared there is no reason at all anyone shopping for a good "value" receiver should disregard the Pioneer VSX-53TX.
About the comment " I also try not to talk above my head about things I don't understand" You couldn't be further from the truth. I work at an electronis store and have hands on experience installing several brands of Home Theater receivers. A majority of the time spent at work is installing HD/ Home theater equipment purchased at our store.
On several occations I have installed Higher-End Home Theater receivers such as the Denon 5803. I have experience connecting Yamaha, Onkyo, and Pioneer Elite receivers.
I am not claiming that I am an expert in the field. But I can say that I have been around the various brands enough to make a good decision on what brands are a good choice.</font>
Shinerman
Senior Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>Relax rgriffin25,
I just thought it was funny that you went on and on about wanting more in depth reasons why Yamaha is better and stated that the ordinary reasons would not cut but then stated the deciding factor for you was a glossy finish. See, that's still funny.
And my not talking over my head comment was not about you. It was about me. Sorry. I in no way questioned your expertise which is clearly more than mine.
Remember, just because someone elses opinion does not match yours, that does not mean the other opinions are not valid. You know that they say, "Opinions are like A^%*$#@, everyones got one".
Shinerman
</font>
I just thought it was funny that you went on and on about wanting more in depth reasons why Yamaha is better and stated that the ordinary reasons would not cut but then stated the deciding factor for you was a glossy finish. See, that's still funny.
And my not talking over my head comment was not about you. It was about me. Sorry. I in no way questioned your expertise which is clearly more than mine.
Remember, just because someone elses opinion does not match yours, that does not mean the other opinions are not valid. You know that they say, "Opinions are like A^%*$#@, everyones got one".
Shinerman
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G
Guest
Guest
<font color='#000000'>Over the last 25 years I have owned three Yamaha receivers. My first one was a 2 channel receiver that I owned for 15 years.
I have been pleased with the build quality and the sound. Another reason I have purchased my last two Yamaha recievers is that I have established a great relationship with the local dealer that sells Yamaha.</font>
I have been pleased with the build quality and the sound. Another reason I have purchased my last two Yamaha recievers is that I have established a great relationship with the local dealer that sells Yamaha.</font>
S
stiletto pat
Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>I just had the opportunity to extensively A/B test a Yamaha Z-1 against a B&K AVR-507 on my choice of speakers - Sonus Faber Grand Pianos (also had Bost Acoustics, Monitor Audio Golds and Martin Logans, but the Sonus Fabers sounded the best to me on both receivers), and determined that the B&K provided markedly better sound, at about the same price (at least currently). I like the look of the Yamaha and all the extra options/settings/features/gimmicks they provide, but let's face it, when I want to really listen to music, I want it to sound the best. That's why I'm leaning towards the B&K right now, unless someone can tell me otherwise......
Pat</font>
Pat</font>
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Shinerman
Senior Audioholic
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One thing to consider. Since your spending that kind of money, you might consider going with separates. That way you have money invested in your amps that will last for a long time and are not really going to become outdated anytime soon. You can simply upgrade your Pre/Pro as technology advances.
Just a thought. I personally can't bring myself to pay that kind of money for something that will be outdated in 3 to 5 years. Although, if ya got the money, go for it.
Shinerman</font>
<font color='#000000'>Oooo yeah, Those B&K receivers are nice. A bit out of my range. OK, a big bit.stiletto pat : <font color='#000000'>I just had the opportunity to extensively A/B test a Yamaha Z-1 against a B&K AVR-507 on my choice of speakers - Sonus Faber Grand Pianos (also had Bost Acoustics, Monitor Audio Golds and Martin Logans, but the Sonus Fabers sounded the best to me on both receivers), and determined that the B&K provided markedly better sound, at about the same price (at least currently). I like the look of the Yamaha and all the extra options/settings/features/gimmicks they provide, but let's face it, when I want to really listen to music, I want it to sound the best. That's why I'm leaning towards the B&K right now, unless someone can tell me otherwise......
Pat</font>
One thing to consider. Since your spending that kind of money, you might consider going with separates. That way you have money invested in your amps that will last for a long time and are not really going to become outdated anytime soon. You can simply upgrade your Pre/Pro as technology advances.
Just a thought. I personally can't bring myself to pay that kind of money for something that will be outdated in 3 to 5 years. Although, if ya got the money, go for it.
Shinerman</font>
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S
stiletto pat
Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>I understand your point, and it is well taken. I too, have always been a separates kinda guy. My issue now with separates is cost and simplicity, as well as sound. The separates cost a good bit more, not to mention the additional big dollars for quality interconnects!!! Plus, with the price decrease on the AVR-507, it is much more affordable.
Actually, what I didn't mention previously was that I really did an A/B/C test, which also included the B&K Ref 50 Processor and 200.7 Power Amp. I could not tell a difference between the AVR-507 and the pre/amp combo until it was turned up to around +10 db (which was getting pretty dang loud - much louder than my wife would ever let me listen before divorce papers began to fly....
), and at that point, the receiver started to run out of gas while the amp continued to shine. For the extra +-$2000 plus interconnects, it becomes a matter of swallowing my pride and understanding that I'm getting old - thus, the receiver wins this battle.
Also, B&K makes it a point to allow one to upgrade their products. For example, you can upgrade the prior model 307 to a 507 for about $500, and everything is upgraded except for the video processing. Oh well, you can't have it all.
Thanks guys....
Pat</font>
Actually, what I didn't mention previously was that I really did an A/B/C test, which also included the B&K Ref 50 Processor and 200.7 Power Amp. I could not tell a difference between the AVR-507 and the pre/amp combo until it was turned up to around +10 db (which was getting pretty dang loud - much louder than my wife would ever let me listen before divorce papers began to fly....
Also, B&K makes it a point to allow one to upgrade their products. For example, you can upgrade the prior model 307 to a 507 for about $500, and everything is upgraded except for the video processing. Oh well, you can't have it all.
Thanks guys....
Pat</font>
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Shinerman
Senior Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>Good point. I was thinking the diff. was around $700 to $1000. I forgot that B&K dropped some of their prices on the 507. $2000 is a bit steep to justify the upgrade.
Shinerman</font>
Shinerman</font>
S
stiletto pat
Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>I know - I'd really like the separates, but I have to exercise some reason.
Anyway, can anyone think of any other reasons that I might be making a big mistake by taking the plunge on the B&K? I'm getting ready to buy, and it's hard to keep holding back. Same problem on a DVD - Universal Player - can't get anyone to make a definitive recommendation - Denon 2900, Yamaha 2300 Mk II or Marantz DV-8400?? (I do understand that no one on the forum has seen both units side by side) I hate to make a large mistake, but I'm also anxious to get on with other things....
Pat</font>
Anyway, can anyone think of any other reasons that I might be making a big mistake by taking the plunge on the B&K? I'm getting ready to buy, and it's hard to keep holding back. Same problem on a DVD - Universal Player - can't get anyone to make a definitive recommendation - Denon 2900, Yamaha 2300 Mk II or Marantz DV-8400?? (I do understand that no one on the forum has seen both units side by side) I hate to make a large mistake, but I'm also anxious to get on with other things....
Pat</font>
Z
zumbo
Audioholic Spartan
<font color='#000000'>rgriffin25. You have caused me to research your receiver, & I have concluded that it does not even compare to the RX-V1400. Your receiver only has 100wx7. The RX-V1400 is 110wx7. That, my friend, is 70 more watts. And you can get one all day long for around 70 dollars less than you paid for yours! I can see why you are upset! The RX-V2400 is 120wx7. That, my friend, is 140 more watts. You can find one of these for about what you paid for yours!
here:</font>
here:</font>
zipper
Full Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>I've been drooling over a B&K 507 that's on sale for $3K. If I could afford it,I'd buy it over any other flagship.Actually,I can afford it but it would mean no vacation this year.
Pat,any chance your finding this @ Magnolia?</font>
Pat,any chance your finding this @ Magnolia?</font>
S
stiletto pat
Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>I'm sorry, what do you mean by "@ Magnolia"?</font>
zipper
Full Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>Up in the area I live (30 miles N of Seattle),the best hifi store we have is called Magnolia A/V. They happen to carry almost all the brand names you mentioned in your original post. They have the 507 on sale for $2999(floor model). Like I said,I'd take it over the flagships.</font>
Shinerman
Senior Audioholic
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Shinerman</font>
<font color='#000000'>In terms of DVD players. I have heard and read very good reviews of the Denon 2900. Seems to be a great player. Of the three, I don't think you would be sorry with any of them. They are all top notch players. Might come down to the best deal.
Shinerman</font>
G
Guest
Guest
<font color='#000000'>rgriffen,
Like I asked in my first response, if you have any specific questions about yamaha products, we will make our best attempt to answer your questions. Otherwise, this just turns in to a couple of guys defending the products they purchased. I hope you enjoy your unit!
Oh yeah, yamaha rules all
!!!
best,
</font>
Like I asked in my first response, if you have any specific questions about yamaha products, we will make our best attempt to answer your questions. Otherwise, this just turns in to a couple of guys defending the products they purchased. I hope you enjoy your unit!
Oh yeah, yamaha rules all
best,
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rgriffin25
Moderator
<font color='#000000'>zumbo,
Please do not assume that I am upset over my purchase. The sarcasm in my earlier posts was towards the people who use generic comments to recommend a receiver. Not discontent for the products I own.
This reminds me of the movie Spinal Tap..
Does your volume knob go up to 11??
I think mine only goes up to 10
If so yours is 1 louder than mine!</font>
Please do not assume that I am upset over my purchase. The sarcasm in my earlier posts was towards the people who use generic comments to recommend a receiver. Not discontent for the products I own.
This reminds me of the movie Spinal Tap..
Does your volume knob go up to 11??
I think mine only goes up to 10
If so yours is 1 louder than mine!</font>
S.R. Johnson
Junior Audioholic
<font color='#000000'>HI my name is Sarandon and I would like to add some things in this discussion. Yamaha has involved in music and making products for over 100 years!! Yamaha has brought some things that you would never had if they had invented such as the IC chip and the Digital Soundfield Processor just to name a few. Now I know that there are some receiver brands out there that can beat the Yamaha hands down in certain areas but does not mean that the Yamaha can beat them at their own game! You just have to understand that Yamaha is a world wide brand name that is BOTH respected and sometimes feared! But that is IMO! And if I cant the sound out of an Yamaha receiver that I want (which i seriously doubt!!!!) I would go to my other number one brand, and that is Marantz!</font>
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