Yamaha A- S801 or Arcam SA 20 to drive Monitor Audio Gold 100 5g

[smallboydanger]

I am surprised, the A23+ is listed under $1,500 to $1,600 in the USA.

If the Roksan K3 integrated amp is in your budget then I think it is a winner. I know nothing about it other than its excellent specs, and it has a real HT bypass. Is there a reason why you won't go for the K3 power amp?

They are almost the same price and I figured I will havr more options with the intergrated such sd ability to connect a Turntable directly to it and a streamer snd not use the Yamaha for that

 

[PENG]

They are almost the same price and I figured I will havr more options with the intergrated such sd ability to connect a Turntable directly to it and a streamer snd not use the Yamaha for that

Okay, for the same money then I can see why.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Hi Peng I am doing this because most Avr receivers are great for movies but not as good as stereo intergrated amps when it comes to 2 channel music.

That video is typical audiophile and marketing BS trying to sell equipment.

And that's coming from people like us who have used separates all our lives.

 

[lovinthehd]

I'd recommend the XLS amp no problem, I have several (four XLS1500s and one 2502). I use them for both mains and sub use. I have had no fan noise experience, I have to crawl up to them and get my ear up very close to the unit, nothing that I can hear farther away. They certainly are one of the better contenders for very low impedance demands since they're 2 ohm capable.

 

[smallboydanger]

I would suggest if you are interested in objective views based on facts and data, read more online reviews that include bench test measurements, instead of subjective views. It is not a rule that AVRs are only good for movies. AVRs can be better than integrated amps in specs and bench test measurements, but the reverse can also be true. So again, those who made such claims in a general statement form is simply spreading hearsay. I would also suggest you don't take part in furthering such false claims (false if stated as a general statement, or a rule), and instead focus more on objective views based on facts and figures.

Those who have responded to your question so far also own separates and/or integrated amps, not just AVRs. So we based our opinions on specs (we all tend to read a lot..), bench test measurements, and our own experience accumulated over many years in this hobby. If you are interested in objective views based on science and technology, and specs verified by bench test measurements, you have come to the right place. If you are more interested in, and tend to believe in subjective views then we (me anyway) probably can't help much.

Thank you for your explanation.
In the light of this I am considering starting with my Avr, planning on replacing it with the Marantz Sr7012 any advice on this please?

 

[smallboydanger]

Your experience with the A870 not sounding good with those speakers (which TLSGuy determined to have some difficult loads) may be well justified!
I think it safe to presume that the A870 is the same as the amp section of the A860, which Gene determined to be an exceptionally weak amp and also having marginal pre-amp outputs!
Here is a link to his review and a quote of the relevant comments on the shortcomings of this Yamaha AVR:

Yamaha RX-A860 AVENTAGE 7.2 Atmos/DTS:X A/V Receiver Review

The Yamaha AVENTAGE RX-A860 7.2CH Atmos/DTS:X AV receiver is packed with excellent networking features but it does fall short on power delivery making our recommendation conditional based on usage.

www.audioholics.com

From the last page of this review: "Suggestions for Improvements"

How about replacing the Yamaha 870 with a Marantz SR 7012?

 

[smallboydanger]

The point is there should not be a difference for music (unless you had some processing interfering with the signal)!
To sound their best, your speakers need exceptionally good, strong power, capable of managing difficult loads and the A870 does not provide it. There is no magic secret sauce to your Arcam, it is simply more capable of driving your speakers!
This is a mature science and unless someone decides to deliberately color or distort the sound (which is not something I would expect from Arcam or Yamaha). It seems that your Yamaha is simply underpowered for your speakers. We have had others with similar complaints who solved it by replacing their A860 or A870 AVR.
The review of the A860 I linked (which is based on bench tested performance) states:

TLSGuy made it clear (also based on measurements) that your speakers drop to 2.7 ohms (well below the 4 ohms that Gene cautions about - lower is worse in this case) and the -65 degree phase make those especially demanding speakers!

In the light of this would a Marantz Sr7013 be good replacement for the Yamaha RXA 870?

 

[PENG]

Thank you for your explanation.
In the light of this I am considering starting with my Avr, planning on replacing it with the Marantz Sr7012 any advice on this please?

That's a good one, but timing is bad because the SR7013 was on sale 3 times last year for less than US$900 in Canada.

Do you have good reason to choose the SR7013 instead of the Denon AVR-X4500H or even the AVR-X3600H that will likely cost much less right now. Of all the recent Denon/Marantz models tested at ASR, Denon's measured quite a bit better though in a blind listening test they will likely sound exactly the same.

 

[Pogre]

I agree with Peng. I'm starting to see a few of those Denon models trickle back into the market and they're priced a lot better for same performance. Well, I think the 4500 is pretty close in terms of features, power, etc., but the 3600 isn't far behind and for the difference in price the best value, imo. Has all the features I would need, good power and the amp disconnect feature is really nice if you do add an amp down the road.

 

[smallboydanger]

That's a good one, but timing is bad because the SR7013 was on sale 3 times last year for less than US$900 in Canada.

Do you have good reason to choose the SR7013 instead of the Denon AVR-X4500H or even the AVR-X3600H that will likely cost much less right now. Of all the recent Denon/Marantz models tested at ASR, Denon's measured quite a bit better though in a blind listening test they will likely sound exactly the same.

No particular reason just liked the looks and specs of the SR 8012 but since I cant afford it looked at the model below, co I was told buy a sales guy on the phone today the Marantz is very good for music.
If the Denon 4500 is just as good and more reliable would pick that

 

[Pogre]

No particular reason just liked the looks and specs of the SR 8012 but since I cant afford it looked at the model below, co I was told buy a sales guy on the phone today the Marantz is very good for music.
If the Denon 4500 is just as good and more reliable would pick that

It is, and they're both reliable in my experience. They're both owned by the same company and share a lot of the same internals. The 3600 is a worthy receiver too for sure.

 

[PENG]

They are almost the same price and I figured I will havr more options with the intergrated such sd ability to connect a Turntable directly to it and a streamer snd not use the Yamaha for that

Did you read the review/measurements I linked before? Nothing beats it so far, for use with external amp.

Denon AVR-X3600H AV Receiver Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Denon AVR-X3600H 9.2 channel AVR. It was purchased new by a kind member who drop shipped it to me. It costs US $1,099. From outside the AVR-X3600H seems like any other AVR: But the controls feel a lot better than some other AVRs. The...

www.audiosciencereview.com

If you like the look though, go for it, but the SR6013/6014 may save you some money.

 

[Pogre]

Did you read the review/measurements I linked before? Nothing beats it so far, for use with external amp.

Denon AVR-X3600H AV Receiver Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Denon AVR-X3600H 9.2 channel AVR. It was purchased new by a kind member who drop shipped it to me. It costs US $1,099. From outside the AVR-X3600H seems like any other AVR: But the controls feel a lot better than some other AVRs. The...

www.audiosciencereview.com

If you like the look though, go for it, but the SR6013/6014 may save you some money.

The SR6014 can be had at AC4L for a little over $100 more than the 4500 if aesthetics are a consideration. I think the 4500 for $999 would still be my choice, tho there isn't a huge gap between the 2 is there?

 

[PENG]

The SR6014 can be had at AC4L for a little over $100 more than the 4500 if aesthetics are a consideration. I think the 4500 for $999 would still be my choice, tho there isn't a huge gap between the 2 is there?

As you know the 4500 is the equivalent of the 7013, but the 6014 is just as good imo, the power supply is a little smaller but that's insignificant. There is no way I would pay more for the SR6014 though, it should be the other way around. They are asking for more for Marantz because somewhere hearsay has the Marantz better for music, total BS, but you know how that works, tell it a million times and people will believe it.

 

[lovinthehd]

No particular reason just liked the looks and specs of the SR 8012 but since I cant afford it looked at the model below, co I was told buy a sales guy on the phone today the Marantz is very good for music.
If the Denon 4500 is just as good and more reliable would pick that

Marantz is very good for music is just sales bullshit....they're all good for music. They'd be useless otherwise, no? Listening to sales people is mostly a waste of time IMO.

 

[lovinthehd]

I think smallboydanger just might be in audio sales....or just likes a lot of bullshit.

 

[smallboydanger]

Marantz is very good for music is just sales bullshit....they're all good for music. They'd be useless otherwise, no? Listening to sales people is mostly a waste of time IMO.

Sorry accidentally clicked dislike wanted to click like, I thought Denon and Marantz were the same company and supposed to be very similar
dont know why they would say one is better for music?

 

[lovinthehd]

Sorry accidentally clicked dislike wanted to click like, I thought Denon and Marantz were the same company and supposed to be very similar
dont know why they would say one is better for music?

Okay, forgiven. Because sales bullshit. Marantz had a slightly better rep in the US from their origins (long gone)....they also price Marantz with roughly the same feature set for more, too. Lots of bullshit in audio....

ps Whether that slightly better rep had any actual basis back then either is questionable. Marantz has been passed around like cheap whiskey for a while...

 

[smallboydanger]

I think smallboydanger just might be in audio sales....or just likes a lot of bullshit.

Sorry Im not full of bullshit there is no need for rudeness
here in the Uk when you go to the Audio shops and ask to buy an av Receiver they are fond of asking what you will be using it primarily for movies or music and recommend different makes based on that. I might not be as clever as you and have an advanced understanding on such matters that's why I am trying to learn and make a better choice

 

[lovinthehd]

Sorry Im not full of bullshit there is no need for rudeness
here in the Uk when you go to the Audio shops and ask to buy an av Receiver they are fond of asking what you will be using it primarily for movies or music and recommend different makes based on that. I might not be as clever as you and have an advanced understanding on such matters that's why I am trying to learn and make a better choice

Hey I said you were forgiven for the dislike that generated my response. I still think most audio sales people are useless, tho. You'll get better info here in any case.