wah wah red chicklet + politics thread

Midcow2

Midcow2

Banned
The saying about "assumptions"

As I was implying nothing, I suggest you learn not to make assumptions.
Assume

makes an A** out of U and me

Take Care and Peace All :):)

MidCow2

Be Cool :cool:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
C

craigsub

Audioholic Chief
Let's not forget that Hitler was more a conservative than liberal as is the case with the majority of dictatorships historically.
When one gets to a totalitarian state, "conservative" and "liberal" are no longer easily applied.

For example, the NAZI party's full name was "National Socialist German Workers' Party".

Socialist, by definition, is left of liberal. Communism is left of socialism.

A Civics teacher in my high school used to have a great comment ... "You can go so far left that you end up being an ultra right winger, and so far right that you can be an ultra left winger".

Was Stalin more liberal than Hitler ? Was Hitler more conservative than Stalin ?

It can make for some great "over drinks and a cigar" conversation.

Well, for as long as over drinks and a cigar is legal.
 
R

rnatalli

Audioholic Ninja
When one gets to a totalitarian state, "conservative" and "liberal" are no longer easily applied.

For example, the NAZI party's full name was "National Socialist German Workers' Party".

Socialist, by definition, is left of liberal. Communism is left of socialism.

A Civics teacher in my high school used to have a great comment ... "You can go so far left that you end up being an ultra right winger, and so far right that you can be an ultra left winger".

Was Stalin more liberal than Hitler ? Was Hitler more conservative than Stalin ?

It can make for some great "over drinks and a cigar" conversation.

Well, for as long as over drinks and a cigar is legal.
This is a common mistake; people see the word socialist and think left of liberal which is correct purely based on definition. This is completely wrong with regards to Nazi Germany. In fact, it is generally agreed by historians that Nazi Germany was extreme right by today's understanding of the term. The party name was just another way to bamboozle people and it works.
 
Last edited:
jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
It's not just Republicans and it's not just that Obama ran with the Democratic Party. Obama wants to give everyone everything and it's all being paid for by the same people- someone else. Government is taking control of manufacturing, finance, banking and they want more control. The mob we have in Washington think big government and Socialism are good.

Giving people everything they need only takes away any inclination to do things for themselves. Making people dependent on the government only makes them victims to that government's whims. People need to be aware and concerned by how things are changing and they also need to pay attention after the election. Obama said he's make all kinds of changes when he campaigned but in his acceptance speech, he said "It won't happen in a year, it may not happen in one term...". He has lost quite a bit of support from some on Congress and he's doing a lot of tap dancing lately.

You said you're young- that means you should still remember what you learned from American History classes. If you do, I suggest that you read a wider variety on the subject. What they taught isn't the whole story. In anything political, we have a duty to be skeptical of the people in government. They aren't there only for our benefit. Power and influence are a huge part of why they want to be elected.

Obama wants everyone to be equal. The problem is that, rather than make people want to be better because they tried harder, learned more and worked for it, he wants to take from those who have and give to those who need. You should recognize that last part if you paid attention in World History.
I think Pres. Obama is trying to save the USA from a catastrophe. Trust me, big business has made sure A LOT of people aren't equal. I see no reason to not:

1 Get us out of this mess

2 Simplify the tax base

3 Provide a reasonable level of health care for all citizens (Yes the job of
government is to serve her people)

4 Give the Citizens a little more control back

Or, we can take your direction: Knock the controls off of business. No matter the sector and let the system run free. That scares me to my core.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I made a general statement that history is a valuable teacher. What exactly is the problem with that statement ?

The opposite would be that history is an ineffective teacher.
Or, the students weren't paying attention.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
When one gets to a totalitarian state, "conservative" and "liberal" are no longer easily applied.

For example, the NAZI party's full name was "National Socialist German Workers' Party".

Socialist, by definition, is left of liberal. Communism is left of socialism.

A Civics teacher in my high school used to have a great comment ... "You can go so far left that you end up being an ultra right winger, and so far right that you can be an ultra left winger".

Was Stalin more liberal than Hitler ? Was Hitler more conservative than Stalin ?

It can make for some great "over drinks and a cigar" conversation.

Well, for as long as over drinks and a cigar is legal.
You beat me to it- I was going to comment that Hitler was so far right that he could tap the liberals on their left shoulder.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I think Pres. Obama is trying to save the USA from a catastrophe. Trust me, big business has made sure A LOT of people aren't equal. I see no reason to not:

1 Get us out of this mess

2 Simplify the tax base

3 Provide a reasonable level of health care for all citizens (Yes the job of
government is to serve her people)

4 Give the Citizens a little more control back

Or, we can take your direction: Knock the controls off of business. No matter the sector and let the system run free. That scares me to my core.
We already have a catastrophe. He's just trying to control everything and trust me, when the government controls everything, it's time to get out of Dodge. We now have a situation where the Legislative and Executive Branches are in agreement on far too much when it comes to what people can do and how much they can have. They're taking control of manufacturing, banking, finance and since the FCC is a government agency, they can take over the airwaves whenever it suits them. Geitner (sp?) wants much more control over the Treasury than he already has. Does that not trouble you? Does it not trouble you that the POTUS fired the CEO of one of the largest corporations in the world? Does it not trouble you that when the Supreme Court is outnumbered by the Executive and Legislative Branches, they effectively have no power to balance them? These three branches exist to act as checks and balances on each other, they're not supposed to control everything. The Founding Fathers designed our Federal Republic to be as minimally intrusive in national issues as possible and now, they're active in everything from local to global issues. Government is supposed to be for the general well-being of the population, not to control it, give it what it should be able to get for itself legally and take from it when they deem it necessary to give to those who just can't seem to manage to stay in school, live their lives in a way that keeps them out of trouble and support themselves and any family members. "

Keeping people fat, badly educated and dependent is no way for a government to operate.

Does the phrase "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need" mean anything to you? When people are forced to contribute by a government, it's not charity. Increasing taxes on 20% of the workforce, when they already pay over 50% of the tax revenue is not 'giving', it's 'taking'.

"From those to whom much is given, much is expected"

Not in the US. Here, the government has taken the opposite approach. If you give people what they need, they'll eventually expect more to be given to them, especially if you don't ask for something in return.

Your point #4 will never happen when you have people like the ones we have in our govenment.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I think Pres. Obama is trying to save the USA from a catastrophe. Trust me, big business has made sure A LOT of people aren't equal.
Name one classless society that worked.
 
R

rnatalli

Audioholic Ninja
Name one classless society that worked.
I personally have no issues with having classes. It's natural. What bothers me is that we have enough resources on the planet to feed everyone, yet so many starve to death. I'm not talking about the lazy as they should starve, but hard-working people.
 
Last edited:
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
Who AM I? Don't jump to conclusions:D WORTH READING


I was born in one country, raised in another. My father was born in another
country. I was not his only child. He fathered several children with numerous
women. I became very close to my mother, as my father showed no interest in me.
My mother died at an early age from cancer.

Later in life, questions arose over my real name.

My birth records were sketchy and no one was able to produce a legitimate,
reliable birth certificate.
I grew up practicing one faith but converted to Christianity, as it was widely
accepted in my country, but I practiced nontraditional beliefs and didn't
follow Christianity, except in the public eye under scrutiny.
I worked and lived among lower-class people as a young adult, disguising
myself as someone who really cared about them.
That was before I decided
it was time to get serious about my life and I
embarked on a new career.
I wrote a book about my struggles growing up. It was clear to those who read
my memoirs that I had difficulties accepting that my father abandoned me as a
child.
I became active in local politics in my 30's then with help behind the
scenes, I literally burst onto the scene as a candidate for national office in
my 40's.
They said I had a golden tongue and could talk anyone into anything. That
reinforced my conceit.
I had a virtually non-existent resume, little work history, and no experience
in leading a single organization. Yet I was a powerful speaker and
citizens were
drawn to me as though I were a magnet and they were small roofing tacks.
I drew incredibly large crowds during my public appearances. This bolstered
my
ego.
At first, my political campaign focused on my country's foreign policy. I
was very critical of my country in the last war and seized every opportunity to
bash my country.

But what launched my rise to national prominence were my views on the
country's economy. I pretended to have a really good plan on how we could do
better and every poor person would be fed and housed for free.
I knew which group was responsible for getting us into this mess. It was the
free market, banks and corporations. I decided to start making citizens hate
them and if they were envious of others who did well, the plan was
clinched
tight.
I called mine "A People's Campaign" and that sounded good to all
people.
I was the surprise candidate because I emerged from outside the traditional
path of
politics & was able to gain widespread popular support.
I knew that, if I merely offered the people 'hope' , together we could
change our country and the world.
So, I started to make my speeches sound like they were on behalf of the
downtrodden, poor, ignorant to include "persecuted minorities" like
the Jews..
My true views were not widely known and I needed to keep them unknown, until
after I became my nation's leader.
I had to carefully guard reality, as anybody could have easily found out
what
I really believed, if they had simply read my writings and examined those people
I associated with.
I'm glad they didn't. Then I became the most powerful man in the
world. And the world learned the truth.
Who am I?
ADOLF HITLER




Later,

MidCow2
It fails to mention that he was mustard gased in WW I which is why he started hating the Jews. He felt they didn't support Germany's WW I effort enough.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
gmichael

gmichael

Audioholic Spartan
Nope- I did not give you a red chicklet.... and if I did I would have signed it. Needless to say, I didn't think your actions deserved one.

I understood from the start that it was not your writing, and I totally understand why you posted it. There's no reason why we cannot have an intelligent discussion around somebody else's opinion- whether we believe it to be realistic or incredibly stupid.

My responses were to the accuracy of the writing (or lack their of) and how somebody decided to wildly twist facts around to satirically compare our current President to one of the worst human beings to ever walk this earth. No matter how much you may dislike a man's politics, his points of view, or his sports interests, we need to keep our criticisms constructive and our comparisons reasonable.
Huh? Our current pres? Did someone bring him up?
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
We already have a catastrophe. He's just trying to control everything and trust me, when the government controls everything, it's time to get out of Dodge. We now have a situation where the Legislative and Executive Branches are in agreement on far too much when it comes to what people can do and how much they can have. They're taking control of manufacturing, banking, finance and since the FCC is a government agency, they can take over the airwaves whenever it suits them. Geitner (sp?) wants much more control over the Treasury than he already has. Does that not trouble you? Does it not trouble you that the POTUS fired the CEO of one of the largest corporations in the world? Does it not trouble you that when the Supreme Court is outnumbered by the Executive and Legislative Branches, they effectively have no power to balance them? These three branches exist to act as checks and balances on each other, they're not supposed to control everything. The Founding Fathers designed our Federal Republic to be as minimally intrusive in national issues as possible and now, they're active in everything from local to global issues. Government is supposed to be for the general well-being of the population, not to control it, give it what it should be able to get for itself legally and take from it when they deem it necessary to give to those who just can't seem to manage to stay in school, live their lives in a way that keeps them out of trouble and support themselves and any family members. "

Keeping people fat, badly educated and dependent is no way for a government to operate.

Does the phrase "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need" mean anything to you? When people are forced to contribute by a government, it's not charity. Increasing taxes on 20% of the workforce, when they already pay over 50% of the tax revenue is not 'giving', it's 'taking'.

"From those to whom much is given, much is expected"

Not in the US. Here, the government has taken the opposite approach. If you give people what they need, they'll eventually expect more to be given to them, especially if you don't ask for something in return.

Your point #4 will never happen when you have people like the ones we have in our govenment.
If 20% of the people make over 50% of the income why doesn't it make since?

Our system has clearly moved to an equal tax basis. Sales tax and fees are all regressive taxes that balance our income taxes very well.

so your saying if you make 1million and pay 330,000 in income tax and 2,000 in fees

and I make 10,000 and pay 1,000 in income tax and 2,000 in fees that we don't have a fair tax system.

seems to me we both pay the same percentage in taxes. Republicans don't lower taxes they move them from the rich to the poor. Dems move it form the poor to the rich. We swing back and forth between the 2 every 8 years and we have a nicely balanced system.

We need the democrats to kick the system back in favor of the poor again.

In 8 years we will probably need to republicans to kick it back to the rich.

Don't get all fussy. We've lasted 232 years with the current system and there have always been tensions, challenges, and crisis. But somehow we always pull through.

FYI politicians are people too. It's easy to demonize your enemies. But unless you personally know Obama you can't really decide on his character. You only get the Media's idea of him. I suggest you stop listening to conservative radio and maybe broaden your horizons.

But I'm a moderate(swing voter) Swings are so fun.:D If you want to win the white house back you have to convince me.
 
aberkowitz

aberkowitz

Audioholic Field Marshall
It fails to mention that he was mustard gased in WW I which is why he started hating the Jews. He felt they didn't support Germany's WW I effort enough.
That's actually not totally correct- it was a contributing factor though. The history behind Hitler's hatred of Jews dates back to his experiences as a young man. He was raised in a town where the Jews of the time were very assimilated into society (something that Jews learned to do very quickly in European society after the Inquisition, being thrown out of France, the Pogroms of Russia and Poland, etc.), so you were unable to recognize a Jewish person on site- very similar to how in most towns in the US you'd never know if somebody was Jewish/Catholic/Protestant/Muslim just by looking at them. When he moved to a different town he first encountered traditionally orthodox Jews who dressed and acted differently. His hatred of the people didn't come because of their different religious beliefs, but because he believed they were not real Germans (note that Hitler bought into German nationalism at a very young age). "Real" Germans did not dress in long black clothing and grow their hair in such ways- so his beliefs were formed more around racist lines than religious beliefs. If I remember correctly from when I did research on Mein Kampf, he was also very heavily influenced by some of the writings of Martin Luther (who was a rampant anti-Semite).

Going forward, his views further developed to the point where he would "blame" the Jews for any views that he disagreed with- Socialism, being gassed in WWI, the fall of Germany after the war... because they were things that no real German would do.
 
C

craigsub

Audioholic Chief
If 20% of the people make over 50% of the income why doesn't it make since?

Our system has clearly moved to an equal tax basis. Sales tax and fees are all regressive taxes that balance our income taxes very well.

so your saying if you make 1million and pay 330,000 in income tax and 2,000 in fees

and I make 10,000 and pay 1,000 in income tax and 2,000 in fees that we don't have a fair tax system.

seems to me we both pay the same percentage in taxes. Republicans don't lower taxes they move them from the rich to the poor. Dems move it form the poor to the rich. We swing back and forth between the 2 every 8 years and we have a nicely balanced system.

We need the democrats to kick the system back in favor of the poor again.

In 8 years we will probably need to republicans to kick it back to the rich.

Don't get all fussy. We've lasted 232 years with the current system and there have always been tensions, challenges, and crisis. But somehow we always pull through.

FYI politicians are people too. It's easy to demonize your enemies. But unless you personally know Obama you can't really decide on his character. You only get the Media's idea of him. I suggest you stop listening to conservative radio and maybe broaden your horizons.

But I'm a moderate(swing voter) Swings are so fun.:D If you want to win the white house back you have to convince me.
So ... basically ... you are using this thread to announce that you swing both ways ? :D
 
aberkowitz

aberkowitz

Audioholic Field Marshall
So ... basically ... you are using this thread to announce that you swing both ways ? :D
Not that there's anything wrong with that.... :D

Kramer: Aaaah! Enough lying! The lying is through. C'mon, Jerry, the masquerade is over. You're thin, late thirties, single...
 
Nemo128

Nemo128

Audioholic Field Marshall
Name one classless society that worked.
Fundamental flaw in your thinking. There has NEVER been one, period. Every supposed society without class boundaries have proven to be an illusion. For example, people think Cuba is one such society. There are two classes there:

1. The haves, which exclusively consist of the regime supporters, the military, and the government itself.

2. Everyone else who has absolutely nothing and can get absolutely nothing without allying themselves with the haves.

To ask to be shown one that has worked is flawed simply because as soon as those that have existed sway towards the capitalist way of thinking, that those who have the money have the power, they have all turned into failures with respect to the good of their people. NO example has been exempt from this very basic flaw, and our country is no different. We just have even more money at the top and even less opportunity at the very bottom.

Argue that last line with me all you want too, but I know more poor people that have received afforable, quality educations and healthcare in those supposedly shoddy countries than even some of our middle class citizens who have been able to create comfortable, hard-working, successful lives there and abroad.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
Fundamental flaw in your thinking. There has NEVER been one, period. Every supposed society without class boundaries have proven to be an illusion. For example, people think Cuba is one such society. There are two classes there:

1. The haves, which exclusively consist of the regime supporters, the military, and the government itself.

2. Everyone else who has absolutely nothing and can get absolutely nothing without allying themselves with the haves.

To ask to be shown one that has worked is flawed simply because as soon as those that have existed sway towards the capitalist way of thinking, that those who have the money have the power, they have all turned into failures with respect to the good of their people. NO example has been exempt from this very basic flaw, and our country is no different. We just have even more money at the top and even less opportunity at the very bottom.

Argue that last line with me all you want too, but I know more poor people that have received afforable, quality educations and healthcare in those supposedly shoddy countries than even some of our middle class citizens who have been able to create comfortable, hard-working, successful lives there and abroad.
Actually there are classless groups among the world. And when these principles are practiced the results are obvious.

What group(s) main teacher makes all equal?
 
newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top