Vinyl News

[afterlife2]

I mean get a good cart and you’re all set. Sure there are better tables, but to me if it plays well and in good condition why do I have to pay over 300 buckets? Plus vinyl can be gotten for 1-3 bucks at the thrift stores. I can conceive paying for vinyl $35 and up they go for now. I’ve had TT all my life and love em.

 

[killdozzer]

If you want to mount a low compliance cartridge onto a medium mass tone arm, is adding a weight/shim to make up for the difference going to solve the problem as efficiently as a high mass tone arm would? Is there a way for the cartridge to, so to speak, react to the difference between a heavy tone arm and a medium tone arm with a weight.

Is there ANY SIGNIFICANT difference in performance of the two?
*significant here meaning that it is audible or somehow detrimental to the gear

 

[Mikado463]

'kd', it's not quite as simple as putting a 'nickel over the needle' of the tonearm like we used to do as kids with our record players. There's the effect of mass in relation to the pivot point of the arm to take into account as well

 

[highfigh]

I say unless you already have a vinyl collection there is little reason to start one. Outside of the very real warm fuzzies you get from handling and admiring the discs and equipment (a very well- balanced and engineered turntable really is a pleasure to watch an action), it just doesn't compare to the fidelity you can get with digital.

Have you really listened to clean LPs on a really good turntable/cartridge combination, or are you using your memory of taping a nickel or quarter to the tonearm in an attempt to get it to stay on the record?

Not saying it's the best or anything, but there's a characteristic to the sound that's hard to verbalize- unfortunately, that's exactly what we hate about claims made by cable and accessory manufacturers. On some of the music I listen to, the bass has a realness/fullness that sounds more real to my ears, as someone who has played various instruments for over 50 years.

Gene did a podcast with a recording engineer and they were discussing the lack of dynamic range on CDs and other digital files. The use of dynamics is a large part of the difference and many LPs have better dynamic range. The information that's missing from some files was amazing, too- he showed that songs mixed to compressed/lossy versions were still identifiable when mixed with full-res versions and the signal from one was inverted. OTOH, that was years ago and I would hope that more care is put into the mix now, but I guarantee that's not the case with all of the new music coming out- it's a product and sales don't generate the income they once did, so the cost has to be reduced.

 

[highfigh]

If you want to mount a low compliance cartridge onto a medium mass tone arm, is adding a weight/shim to make up for the difference going to solve the problem as efficiently as a high mass tone arm would? Is there a way for the cartridge to, so to speak, react to the difference between a heavy tone arm and a medium tone arm with a weight.

Is there ANY SIGNIFICANT difference in performance of the two?
*significant here meaning that it is audible or somehow detrimental to the gear

Think of the stylus compliance as if it was the springs of a car, truck, motorcycle, etc- if you put a highly compliant spring on a heavy vehicle without something to dampen the movement, it will move too far with changes in the surface and the whole thing will continue to bounce for too long and eventually, it will be out of control. Light tonearms can use a high-compliance stylus, a heavy one can't. The resonant frequency moves lower with increased mass or compliance and when you increase both, problems occur.

 

[killdozzer]

'kd', it's not quite as simple as putting a 'nickel over the needle' of the tonearm like we used to do as kids with our record players. There's the effect of mass in relation to the pivot point of the arm to take into account as well

I was kinda hoping you'd chime in. So it's the spread of the mass along the shaft as oppose to concentrating it on top of stylus?

How big of a problem is this? What would you hear different using a weight?

 

[Mikado463]

I was kinda hoping you'd chime in. So it's the spread of the mass along the shaft as oppose to concentrating it on top of stylus?

How big of a problem is this? What would you hear different using a weight?

highfigh explain it well and I will add that how the mass is distributed throughout the tone arm has the same effect with cartridge compliance on a horizontal plane. This can have detrimental effect on the cantilever. Think in terms of mass vs. distance from the pivot point.

 

[afterlife2]

The Best Turntables Under $500 | Digital Trends

A good turntable can bring out the best in your aging vinyl, but it doesn't have to cost a small fortune. Here are the best decks to be had for under $500.

www.digitaltrends.com

..

 

[highfigh]

I was kinda hoping you'd chime in. So it's the spread of the mass along the shaft as oppose to concentrating it on top of stylus?

How big of a problem is this? What would you hear different using a weight?

It's a matter of mass, inertia vs compliance and resonant frequency. The weight at the stylus can be statically balanced by adjusting the weight at the opposite end of the tone arm, but that only relates to balancing it- it has little to do with how it will track the record or stay in the groove. High compliance with a heavy tonearm/cartridge prevents the tonearm from moving up and down with the record's surface because it's similar to having weak legs when running on uneven ground- the upper body really want to stay on its course in a straight line in the direction of travel. At some point, the stylus will be pushed into the bottom of the cartridge body if the record is badly warped, but that also equates to higher output of the information that comes with the vertical undulations.

I don't know when the change happened, but stylus compliance used to be expressed as Dynes/cm and now, it's shown as µm/mN . I guess it really doesn't matter if the measurements and conversions are accurate.

Imagine holding a lightweight pipe that has unequal weights at each end- it wouldn't balance by holding it in the middle. so you would have to find the point on the pipe where it balances and that would be far from the center which, in the case of an turntable, prevents the need to have the tonearm sticking out farther at the rear. If someone violently moves the far end, a lightweight assembly is easier to control (you would be acting as gravity) but this depends on how they manage their hands- 'soft' hands would exert less force on the pipe and that is similar to a high compliance stylus.

I don't know if this link will help, but it doesn't use the stupid language of audiophiles in the description of the difference in sound, as the audio forum responses did, so I won't post them.

Find the right cartridge

Ortofon

www.ortofon.com

 

[lovinthehd]

I don't know when the change happened, but stylus compliance used to be expressed as Dynes/cm and now, it's shown as µm/mN . I guess it really doesn't matter if the measurements and conversions are accurate.

Handy converter https://www.translatorscafe.com/unit-converter/en-US/surface-tension/4-1/

 

[highfigh]

Handy converter https://www.translatorscafe.com/unit-converter/en-US/surface-tension/4-1/

I'm not trying to make it float!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hope this doesn't lead anyone to invent a new adjective for the sound of their LPs, e.g., 'floaty-sounding', 'takes me on a magic carpet ride of sound',.......

 

[afterlife2]

View attachment 34019
View attachment 34020
Got this super cheap than the retail price on fleabay. Perhaps for a future buy of a Denon MC cart.
Thanks Mikado for your patience and help.
Pro-Ject
Product Research
Features
Phono (MM/MC) Preamp: The Pro-Ject Phono Box allows you to connect a turntable with either a MM (moving magnet) or MC (moving coil) cartridge to today's home receiver's and amplifier which do not offer a dedicated phono input. There is a button on the back of the unit which allows you to switch between MM or MC mode.
Metal Case: The Phono Box's metal case shields the electronics from vibration and electromagnetic interference.
Dual-Mono Circuitry: The Phono Box provides optimal channel separation through dual-mono circuitry and low-noise ICs.
RIAA Equalization: The Pro-Ject Phono Box provides amplification and RIAA equalization for both MM and MC cartridges.
RCA Connections: The Phono Box features gold-plated stereo RCA connections. A stereo RCA input connects your turntable, and a stereo RCA output connects your home receiver or amplifier. RCA cables sold separately.
Ground Terminal: The Phono Box also has a turntable ground, in case your turntable has a separate ground lead. This provides shielding to the tone-arm and the sensitive circuitry in the turntable.
Outboard Power Supply: The Pro-Ject Phono Box operates off of standard household AC current, using the supplied AC power adapter. The external power adapter is separate from the phono preamp to further improve sound quality.

• Input: 100-240V~50/60Hz, 0.6A
• Output: 15V - 500mA (18V)

I think it’s time I hook this up today. I didn’t get the Denon cart yet. Hopefully things will get better and I’ll be able to own one.

 

[John Parks]

Speaking of hooking up, I finally set up my turntable that has been in semi-storage since my d-i-v-o-r-c-e- last year:

 

[afterlife2]

^^bout time. Look who’s taking. What ya gonna spin first? Does it have a cover when not in use?

 

[John Parks]

^^bout time. Look who’s taking. What ya gonna spin first? Does it have a cover when not in use?

Atomic Blonde soundtrack

Yeah, I have a black fabric cover I got on Ebay.

 

[Mikado463]

Yeah, I have a black fabric cover I got on Ebay.

just be careful of the cantilever/stylus !

 

[afterlife2]

Got it going. Carole King is on. I guess when I get the MC I will hear a difference. Sounds good though but no difference. In case you can’t see the Phono Box it’s on top of the Yamaha. Zoom in. Don’t worry I’ll move the Phono Box on the side after pics.
DCM books providing the analog amazing sounds.

All carts ready if I wanna change them.

 

[afterlife2]

Just ordered a used Billie on Vinyl. Can’t wait!

 

[afterlife2]

Speaking of hooking up, I finally set up my turntable that has been in semi-storage since my d-i-v-o-r-c-e- last year:
View attachment 36880

Just noticed. Man that Billie Vinyl would perfect match on your cool plate.

 

[John Parks]

Just noticed. Man that Billie Vinyl would perfect match on your cool plate.

Yeah, it would!