Vienna Acoustics Music

[Patrick Butler]

You probably used the Wrong equipment for auditioning Mahler, it need very good amplification....

Well I heard the bass from the Mahler's being sloppy and poor, but that's the case if the amplifier is unable to keep the basses under control
Using a pair of Electrocompaniet AW180 made them sound not good at all, sloppy and poor bass
Changing to Electrocompaniet Nemo (AW600) which is much more powerful and with lower output impedance changed this dramatically, with the Nemo blocks the bass from Mahler is out of this world quality

Hi Haraldo,

Robert Deutsch from the Stereophile review that has been quoted used great amps from Bryston and Krell. He had bass issues, but then he also has a tiny listening room. I know- I've been there. Full range speakers and small rooms are potentially a problem and careful auditioning in-room is recommended. JA mentions that in spite of Robert's bass experience, he could find nothing in the measurements to explain Robert's experience.

Best,

Patrick

 

[KEW]

JA mentions that in spite of Robert's bass experience, he could find nothing in the measurements to explain Robert's experience.

Your statement above is true; however, it is a bit misleading in that it sounds like JA might be saying Robert's observation of bass difficulties is inexplicable. In truth, JA did offer his own explanation for this issue in the last sentence below:

RD consistently noted problems with optimizing the Vienna Acoustics' low frequencies in his room. Try as I might, I couldn't find any particular measured problems in the bass. The midrange units hand over to the woofers below 80Hz or so, with the ports covering the range below 40Hz. I suspect that the limited bandpass covered by the woofers, as well as having six radiating areas all contributing to the speaker's output in the upper bass and below, makes its interaction with the room complex.

 

[TLS Guy]

You probably used the Wrong equipment for auditioning Mahler, it need very good amplification....

Well I heard the bass from the Mahler's being sloppy and poor, but that's the case if the amplifier is unable to keep the basses under control
Using a pair of Electrocompaniet AW180 made them sound not good at all, sloppy and poor bass
Changing to Electrocompaniet Nemo (AW600) which is much more powerful and with lower output impedance changed this dramatically, with the Nemo blocks the bass from Mahler is out of this world quality

The amps available where Mac and Classe, I don't remember which we were using.

 

[Patrick Butler]

Your statement above is true; however, it is a bit misleading in that it sounds like JA might be saying Robert's observation of bass difficulties is inexplicable. In truth, JA did offer his own explanation for this issue in the last sentence below:

I'm fairly certain that JA thinks everything related to audio is explanable. Good policy if you ask me.

P

 

[Alex2507]

I went and listened to a pair of Mozart Grands today with a friend who plays music and tinkers around with recording music and I of course own an SPL meter so we're like speaker experts. He's really a drywaller because that's what gets the babes but that's another matter.

Anyway I listened to 4 different speakers with the One Headlight track from the Wallflowers. I of course left my SPL meter at home so there was no level matching of any kind except what I thought I could get away with ... the louder the better, right? I liked the Mozart Grand speakers. They were selling for $1,500 (big discount according to the BB guy).

I took some notes:

-low end fills out nicely ... "rich" ... warm

-natural vocals

-nice slide guitar (organ)

-snare subdued

My friend thought they were pretty nice sounding as well even though they were the smallest and cheapest ones we listened to but he's big on a speaker being driven no further than where they start to break up. I think that's where the big money speakers distinguish themselves from good sounding cheap speakers but that's not what I came to say.

The size and sound of the Mozarts would make them welcome in many set ups.
I expected them to suck.

 

[walter duque]

I went and listened to a pair of Mozart Grands today with a friend who plays music and tinkers around with recording music and I of course own an SPL meter so we're like speaker experts. He's really a drywaller because that's what gets the babes but that's another matter.

Anyway I listened to 4 different speakers with the One Headlight track from the Wallflowers. I of course left my SPL meter at home so there was no level matching of any kind except what I thought I could get away with ... the louder the better, right? I liked the Mozart Grand speakers. They were selling for $1,500 (big discount according to the BB guy).

I took some notes:

-low end fills out nicely ... "rich" ... warm

-natural vocals

-nice slide guitar (organ)

-snare subdued

My friend thought they were pretty nice sounding as well even though they were the smallest and cheapest ones we listened to but he's big on a speaker being driven no further than where they start to break up. I think that's where the big money speakers distinguish themselves from good sounding cheap speakers but that's not what I came to say.

The size and sound of the Mozarts would make them welcome in many set ups.
I expected them to suck.

I listened to them and I think my surround towers or rear surrounds sound better then them for a lot less.

 

[Alex2507]

I listened to them and I think my surround towers or rear surrounds sound better then them for a lot less.

I took a quick look over at Source and could only find the rears. Not for nothin' but they list for $895 each.
I know you know a guy and all ...

Those rears are dear to me and I know Rick really liked the surround towers. I'm glad I got to hear the Mozarts in comparison to a few other more expensive speakers. They did alright. My buddy was able to show me that all these different speakers quickly lost their sh!t when turned up too loud ... which in your case would be where you begin an audition. I just have visions of you red lining an amp and doing a neutral drop on it like somebody else paid for it.

Bummer ... I just now for the first time thought ill of my Dayton BR-1s ... crap ... shoulda stayed home.
The good news is that my 360's rock ... up until about 85 dBs.
The only thing to walk all over them was the damn $5,700 Matin Logans.

I'll deal ...

 

[haraldo]

Regarding the argument from TLS Guy about reversal of tweeter polarity and HT setup, what to do in a 5.1 setup...... What's the problem to get 5 Mahler's

When I auditioned B&W it was via Classe amplification, and I never liked it, especially the bass seemed muddy and unclear .... it seemed like it was disconnected from the other frequencies;I have been wondering if it's the Classe amplification that's a problem, I never heard VA speakers via Classe, but I'm sceptical about Classe....

The Mahler's can be bass heavy and from what I have heard in my auditioning they may potentially even overload a quite big room, so proper placements is important, no corner placements of these speakers for sure.....

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

...In the room I was auditioning it against a range of B & W speakers, the best of which was the 802D...

...waterfall plot of the B & W 802D...is superior plot to the Mahler...

...There were three of us auditioning and all three of us regarded the sound of the 802D superior by a highly significant margin...

Man, my hearing must be completely messed up because I thought the B&W 800D & 802D sucked big time (NAD amps & pre-pro).

By the way, I thought the B&W 802D had a TERRIBLE off-axis Frequency Response per Stereophile, no???

 

[walter duque]

Those rears are dear to me and I know Rick really liked the surround towers. I'm glad I got to hear the Mozarts in comparison to a few other more expensive speakers. They did alright. My buddy was able to show me that all these different speakers quickly lost their sh!t when turned up too loud ... which in your case would be where you begin an audition. I just have visions of you red lining an amp and doing a neutral drop on it like somebody else paid for it.

I guess you have a valid point. My method of auditioning speakers is not the norm. Not that I listen to high volume all the time, but I do have to know that if needed my system will take me there. I am sure the VA are great speakers for certain applications. For me they just fold bevore I even get started.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Home Theater Magazine

... Just reviewed the Vienna Acoustics Music speakers:

5-point Average +/-15 degrees Horizontal+Vertical On-Axis & Off-axis Response from 200 Hz - 10 kHz is +3.5dB/-6dB, and the -3dB bass is 48Hz.

For $27,000 a pair, I expected A LOT better than that!

 

[Boerd]

... Just reviewed the Vienna Acoustics Music speakers:

5-point Average +/-15 degrees Horizontal+Vertical On-Axis & Off-axis Response from 200 Hz - 10 kHz is +3.5dB/-6dB, and the -3dB bass is 48Hz.

For $27,000 a pair, I expected A LOT better than that!

AcuDefTechGuy - the measurements are highly prejudicial to Vienna Acoustics Music
The reviewer forgot to use AudioQuest cables
Where is the engineering here? No active crossovers, no DSP, nothing.
Still - 27k$ ?????

 

[Alex2507]

For $27,000 a pair, I expected A LOT better than that!

It's like dating a really hot girl ... you think looks don't count?
Let me tell ya ... they count.

 

[Boerd]

It's like dating a really hot girl ... you think looks don't count?
Let me tell ya ... they count.

Ha ha ha - but we're not looking here for an one night stand with a speaker
While that would be perfect with a girl (let's not talk about that on this website) the speaker in the end better sounds good and MEASURES well for the price.
BTW - good taste dude

 

[haraldo]

Hmmmmm

I never liked the B&W 800 series and for me the 802d is just a bad speaker, not musical, bass is disconnected from the rest of the sound spectrum... it sounds muddy and it tells you clearly that what you listen to is an electronic reproduction of music.... I don't get any pleasure listening to them at all ......

To me B&W 802d is the most overrated speaker in the industry......

 

[GO-NAD!]

It's like dating a really hot girl ... you think looks don't count?
Let me tell ya ... they count.

Mmmmmmmm.....librarians.....

 

[highfigh]

It's like dating a really hot girl ... you think looks don't count?
Let me tell ya ... they count.

And, as someone said, "For every really hot woman, there's a guy who's tired of taking her crap".

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

It's like dating a really hot girl ... you think looks don't count?
Let me tell ya ... they count.

Does she come with the speakers?

If so, then HELL YES.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Hmmmmm

I never liked the B&W 800 series and for me the 802d is just a bad speaker, not musical, bass is disconnected from the rest of the sound spectrum... it sounds muddy and it tells you clearly that what you listen to is an electronic reproduction of music.... I don't get any pleasure listening to them at all ......

To me B&W 802d is the most overrated speaker in the industry......

You and me both!

Speaking of great looks, I do love the way the B&W 800Ds look. I think they are one of the best looking speakers out there. They win me over in the aesthetics category. And I am HUGE on aesthetics. I really, really wanted to love those B&W 800Ds.

But like hot girls, looks aren't everything. Looks count for a whole lot, but just not everything.

 

[haraldo]

You and me both!

Speaking of great looks, I do love the way the B&W 800Ds look. I think they are one of the best looking speakers out there. They win me over in the aesthetics category. And I am HUGE on aesthetics. I really, really wanted to love those B&W 800Ds.

But like hot girls, looks aren't everything. Looks count for a whole lot, but just not everything.

Hmmmm.... think there are much nicer looking speakers.... Like Audio Physic Avanti, and finish in cherry is impeccable.... but price