UN-Official Formula 1 Thread

[annunaki]

Agreed


A max budget cap would never work. They'll cook the books. How's anyone gonna be able to prove that a team has over spent.



Yea, STR does well...What happened to Williams is what I want to know???

Williams, while better than last season, does not seem to be very consistent with performance, nor do they seem to be able to keep up on a development front. I think they are having some chasis/aero issues as has been the case for about 5 years now. It all went wrong with the "tusked/walrus" FW26 and they have been trying to get back ever since.

Now that Toyota is proving to be decent on their own merit, a buyout of Sir Frank's team will seem less likely. I would hate to see them fade out.

I think Vettel, combined with a Newey designed car, in a season when aero is going to be critical, may prove a solid combo especially since Webber is a good development driver. Vettel is now proving he can transcend the car some and get better results than the car itself is capable. When he last tested the RB03 he was well ahead of Webber or Coulthard in the same car. What testing program each was on we don't know though.


You have a good point about the max budget, but it would be a step in the right direction. BMW seems to be doing well with their budget. They were reported to have at least $100 million less operating budget than some of the others.

 

[sploo]

I know it has been brought up before, but I will bring it up again. The guy with the most victories should get the title (when all of their other finishes are similar).

In other words more points should be awarded for a win. I feel the gap should be 4 points for a win to second place. If they would have left the scoring gaps alone and simply extended the points down to 8th, we would not be having any conversation as Massa would have clearly won (the title).

Essentially, yes, I agree - there should be a bigger gap for 1st (and maybe 2nd), like there was when points were only awarded for the first 6 placings. The system we have now doesn't incentivise a driver to push for a win, as the difference in points isn't worth the risk of potentially running off the road.

However, we probably would still be having a conversation about the year just gone, as Massa got a victory in Spa that was taken away from Hamilton (not going into the rights and wrongs, just the facts) and that obviously changed the 'win count' for both of them. Also, if the scoring had been different, would either driver have pushed harder - and not settled for a lower place - at some races in the season? I'm thinking of Hamilton finishing third at Singapore, where if there were a larger points gap, perhaps he would've attacked Rosberg harder.

My point is that retrospectively discussing how the season would've gone if the points allocation were different isn't really going to get anyone anywhere. I'm sure that several placings could be swapped round if points were awarded for fastest lap, pole, leading a race lap etc. etc.

What they should have done is offered 100 liters of fuel for the race distance and completely opened the engine formula (if green was the real name of the game) The following season, 90 liters of fuel, etc.

That is a good idea. I believe it's what they're doing in the MotoGP racing. The only odd result of it is that the bikes apparently have a system that manages power according to fuel use. Occasionally it results in a bike having a big drop in power for the last couple of laps, which does makes results interesting, but probably isn't much fun for the rider!

 

[sploo]

Pic of the 2009 BMW

Image number 8...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7734070.stm

Daaaaamn. That's ugly!

 

[ragged]

Wow, that is ugly. I can't believe I missed this thread all season. Oh well. At least I can in on the discussion on the cars for next season.

What about Ecclestone proposing a medal based system instead of points. Gold, Silver, Bronze, ok I get that, but what about the guys who don't finish on the podium, how are you going to keep track of them for the overall driver standings?

 

[annunaki]

The new cars are quite ugly, but I am sure they will grow on me some.

I am sure they will get a little better once the actual '09 cars are released. These interim cars are hideous though.

Here is another look:

http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news/2008/11/18/this-is-the-worst-looking-f1-car-ever/

http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/photolarge.php?photoID=115779&catID=3662

The medal system is kind of stupid. Just award more points for first place.

 

[ragged]

Seriously, if they start next season with those monster front wings, can you imagine all the carbon fiber all over the track. With the way drivers weave around at the start, it's going to be carnage!

 

[ragged]

Well Kubica was quoted a saying he can already feel the difference with the KERS. Rumours say BMW are getting up 80 hp boost. But I can only imagine, as a driver, seeing the mechanics working on a car with elbow length insulated gloves wouldn't inspire confidence!

 

[annunaki]

It will be interesting to see how the KERS scenario plays out. Will KERS be worth it (extra weight and ability to place ballasts)? Will some teams choose to use a KERS equipped car at some tracks (Monza, Spa) and not at others (Monaco, Hungary) where more weight will affect handling and power not being quite as crucial?

Is there anything in the regs to prevent this?

I would think the moveable aero will make as big a difference or more than the KERS on many tracks.

 

[STRONGBADF1]

Moveable aero is huge IMO. I think lap times will drop like a stone.

 

[ragged]

Yeah, I forgot about the adjustable front wing. That is huge. How far are they going to go with that tech, just a handle and wire attached to the wing or a fully motorized front wing

Side note, I'm sure you've seen this before, but this shell/ferrari commercial is awesome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iItzJc-NHI4

 

[annunaki]

Moveable aero is huge IMO. I think lap times will drop like a stone.

BMW was only around .8-.9 sec off from where they were the last time they tested at Barca and they are running a complete 2009 aero package. By the time Melbourne rolls around I assume they will be as fast as they ended the season last year.

Ferrari had a rather odd testing configuration with some weird side pod iteration.

 

[race4aliving]

autosport.com - F1 News: Honda confirms immediate F1 pull out
who's next? If you think about it they have gone the past two years with no primary sponsor and the slip toward the wrong end of the result column has been increasing, this in spite of hiring of Brawn and several other strong technical people.

 

[sploo]

The deep irony being they spent most of 2008 designing the car for 2009!

I suppose it at least means someone buying the team might be getting a reasonable car from the outset. Well, reasonable formula 1 car... Honda... OK. Maybe not.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7766092.stm

 

[annunaki]

I admit, I am surprised. However, with things as bad as they are it is understandable.

It would not surprise me if there was a buyer lined up and ready to go.

What is Ross Brawn going to do now? Ross Brawn back to Ferrari? Ross Brawn to Torro Rosso or Red Bull?

 

[ragged]

Yeah, wow that's a surprise. I'm sure there is a buyer out there. Honda had a lot of great infrastructure. Maybe a Dubai outfit or that guy from Prodrive will buy them.

 

[sploo]

That guy from Prodrive would be Dave Richards, former BAR team principle http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Richards_(racing)

Kinda works doesn't it - Prodrive wanted to go into F1 this year, but couldn't, Richards will almost certainly still know (BAR) people from within Honda F1, and you'd get a large facility with lots of equipment, a hopefully reasonable car, decent drivers, and Ross Brawn.

Rumours on the BBC indicate the team is up for sale for £1. I'd buy that for a dollar... or a pound...

 

[ragged]

Yeah, I think it's just the facilities for a dollar, but still, that's a steal! Especially with Honda saying they will absorb the current debts of the team and pay the employees salaries until there is a buyer. That's very very generous. No wonder I always loved Honda/Acura cars.

 

[ragged]

You can always count on these guys to design a work of art.

 

[sploo]

Wow. That's the only 2009 design (assuming it's a real 2009 design) I've seen that's not made me want to vomit.

Personally, I thought that both the McLaren and Ferrari cars for the 2008 season looked incredible (the Fezza front wing was a work of art). Hopefully the Italians will come up with something similarly attractive for '09.

 

[sploo]

Some 2009 car launch dates

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7812490.stm