Top Ten Signs of Cable Vendor Snake Oil

[pam]

Guest : Apparently it is their belief that different audio frequencies travel at different speeds through the cable, and that conductor geometry can change this.

It is true...
They have special speed traps in the geometry of the cable that catches the electrons that are faster. While they get their tickets they are slowed down.

You should see how much energy Monster are spending to do those pico-meter traps. Much smaller than Nano-technologies! With this technology I don't understand why they don't sell their cables at 100K per meter.

BTW, Can anyone refer me to a good specialist in Telekinesys/Telepathy I need to contact the extra-terrestrial. My karmic path has to be enhanced. And I need something before my monition.

Also, for those interested, I have some Nano-Wawa cables to sell at only 375$ per meter.

 

[gene]

<font color='#000000'>I just cut into a $1200 component video cable from an alleged high end company that is nothing more than a simple rat shack patch cord ($.30/ft) with a center conductor wrapped in plastic and the return wire surrounding it. &nbsp;It DOESN&quot;T have any shielding, not enough dielectric to maintain 75ohm characteristic impedance and very poorly designed banana plugs. &nbsp;Yet the manufacturer claims they minimize &quot;eddy currents&quot;. &nbsp;This is probably the worst exotic cable I have ever seen. &nbsp;It caused ghosting in my HDTV connection between my Satellite Box and Display. &nbsp;It amazes me that people still buy into this hype and I have to continue on writing about it. &nbsp;Am I sounding like a broken record?</font>

 

[Guest]

gene : I just cut into a $1200 component video cable from an alleged high end company

Hmmm...it must be nice to be able to afford to do that...

Quotewith a center conductor wrapped in plastic and the return wire surrounding it. It DOESN&quot;T have any shielding, not enough dielectric to maintain 75ohm characteristic impedance

It's magic plastic, Gene..

How did you determine it's not 75 ohm??

How does a return wire surround the center conductor without being a shield?

Quoteand very poorly designed banana plugs.

Banana plugs? Why would a video cable have banana plugs?

Quote Yet the manufacturer claims they minimize &quot;eddy currents&quot;.

They do..especially after someone cuts it in half..

Quote It amazes me that people still buy into this hype and I have to continue on writing about it.

It doesn't amaze me..especially when they can read of &quot;informed&quot; opinions of &quot;engineers&quot;, &quot;high end designers&quot;, and &quot;professors&quot;, who write diatribes about this stuff. The typical layman looks at these &quot;major players&quot; with ALL THAT EXPERIENCE, and believes them..without question.

What DOES amaze me is the fact that that vendor can't get the hype correct..like the vendor who claimed inductance increases 3 db/oct as skin effect happens...

Cheers, John

PS..
Quote Am I sounding like a broken record?

What's a record?

 

[Guest]

pam :

Apparently it is their belief that different audio frequencies travel at different speeds through the cable, and that conductor geometry can change this.

That does happen..why would you think otherwise?

It was necessary to understand it via the telegraphers equations to eliminate the problem..major distortion for long line tel..

<table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">BTW, Can anyone refer me to a good specialist in Telekinesys/Telepathy I need to contact the extra-terrestrial.</td></tr></table>

Yah, right.....if you need a referrel, ya ain't gots it..

<table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">monition.</td></tr></table>

Ya got me on that word...is that the tail end of &quot;am&quot;.

<table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, for those interested, I have some Nano-Wawa cables to sell at only 375$ per meter.</td></tr></table>

Nano-wawa??..sure, I'll buy a nano meter of it..

Cheers, John

 

[gene]

<font color='#000000'>I shouild have know you would show up to ask more questions John.  Fly in the ointment

As you know, a simple equation based on dielectric material and spacing of center  and return conductors determines characteristic impedance.

Coax Cable Impedance

I should have said, it doesn't have an effective shield.  Frayed return wire does not a good shield make

A good shield for a video cable is a combination braid and foil, or at least multiple braids.  Braids typically provide 60-98% coverage alone.  They are move effective at magnetic shielding than electric.  The reason is the braid distorts the uniformity of the shield current.  As you know at high frequencies, the braid becomes less effective, b/c the braid holes become larger than the wavelength of the signal.  Thus it is good measure to implement an additional foil shield.  

Unfortunately consumer industry settled on RCA long ago.  Fortunately however, the connector is electrically small compared to the wavelength of video (30MHz Bandwidth) so it really doesn't matter.  However, when your cable starts approaching lengths greater than a meter, the cable charactersitic impedance does matter (IE. 1/6 (3*10^8m/s/30*10^6MHz) = 1.67meters.  

In this case, the cable I was using from the company in question was 2 meters long, had about 30-40 ohm characterstic impedance and very poor shield.  

I haven't even started to write about video cables (not enough time in the day!), but I may after this experience.

Record, whats that?  Exactly

[edited: spelling]</font>

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

<font color='#000000'>Hey after reading this mes,, I just wanted to ask a real world question...

Is a monster video 3 component cable any good?</font>

 

[Rip Van Woofer]

<font color='#000000'>This article in Forbes a few years back is a classic on Monster. It explains a lot about them and is relevant to the subject of cable voodoo in general.

I thought eddy currents only happened in air and water!</font>

 

[pam]

gene : I just cut into a $1200 component video cable ... It caused ghosting in my HDTV connection between my Satellite Box and Display.

Gene

If you get twice the signal then it is normal to pay more, you are having extra signals magically added.

 

[ThA tRiXtA]

<font color='#000000'>Good article on the monster cables, but it really never gets down to whether they are worth it, not worth it etc.

It does say that guy is richer than a skunk and the cables have a lot of markup on them...

I was more looking for a specific answer to &nbsp;has anyone ever had any experiences with the monster video 3 component cable ?

[quote from article]

Early in the program, one Midwest salesman almost totaled a Ferrari by driving it off a cliff, but was saved from the Pacific Ocean by construction netting. For Lee, it was just another cost of doing business.

[end of quote]

Must be nice to write that one off!</font>

 

[Dan Banquer]

<font color='#000000'>&quot;I just cut into a $1200 component video cable from an alleged high end company that is nothing more than a simple rat shack patch cord ($.30/ft) with a center conductor wrapped in plastic and the return wire surrounding it. It DOESN&quot;T have any shielding, not enough dielectric to maintain 75ohm characteristic impedance and very poorly designed banana plugs. Yet the manufacturer claims they minimize &quot;eddy currents&quot;. This is probably the worst exotic cable I have ever seen. It caused ghosting in my HDTV connection between my Satellite Box and Display. It amazes me that people still buy into this hype and I have to continue on writing about it. Am I sounding like a broken record?&quot;

I love it; but I keep hearing about this one cable vendor who proclaims that kosher chicken fat smeared on his cables will get you better performance.
d.b.</font>

 

[A. Vivaldi]

gene : <font color='#000000'>I just cut into a $1200 component video cable from an alleged high end company that is nothing more than a simple rat shack patch cord ($.30/ft) with a center conductor wrapped in plastic and the return wire surrounding it. It DOESN&quot;T have any shielding, not enough dielectric to maintain 75ohm characteristic impedance and very poorly designed banana plugs. Yet the manufacturer claims they minimize &quot;eddy currents&quot;. This is probably the worst exotic cable I have ever seen. It caused ghosting in my HDTV connection between my Satellite Box and Display. It amazes me that people still buy into this hype and I have to continue on writing about it. Am I sounding like a broken record?</font>

<font color='#000000'>Are their anti-defamation laws or something against exposing this cable manufacturer by name so that others may not get scammed? If they can't be called to account for their mediocrity, then the knowledge you've gained is useless to us. No offence.

 

[Dan Banquer]

<font color='#000000'>If you look at the companys advetising and what's posted I think you will be able to put two and two together. If this cable is tested and Gene posts the results then it should become extremely obvious.
                 d.b.</font>

 

[Guest]

<font color='#000000'>Hi Gene. &nbsp;Got the pics of that cable..coupla notes..

First, the frayed outer shield is frayed only after you cut it and splayed it out. &nbsp;Prior to it being dissected, what did the shield look like? &nbsp;Ten to one it was a nicely spirally wrapped, uniform coverage shield...Not 100%, mind you, but certainly uniform.

Second, by spiralling the inner wire around a plastic core, they eliminate the internal inductance of the inner conductor..for all non tubular wires, the internal inductance is 15 nanohenries per foot...this inner wire construction eliminates that internal component. &nbsp;The inner wire inductance will actually be 15 nanohenries divided by the number of strands the inner wire is composed of. (that correction factor accounts for the non zero thickness of the tube).

However, there is one thing that is wrong in the design, one which should probably not be used for hf signals, even though it may be ok for audio stuff.

They wound each conductor in a spiral fashion..In doing so, they have created a solenoidal component of magnetic field. &nbsp;The outer spiral is opposite pitch from the inside..

What this does is create a solenoidal field component that is not cancelled by the coaxial geometry. &nbsp;And it causes deviation from the ideal equation L*C=1031*DC.

In other words, this cable will have external sensitivity, will have too much inductive storage...

It may be of the correct dimensions for 75 ohm impedance, but by spiralling both (either) of the conduction paths, they have a horrible hf response..consistent with your ghosting experience.

Cheers, John</font>

 

[gene]

<font color='#000000'>Hi John;

The conductor spacing does not allow for a 75 ohm characterstic impedance. &nbsp; They openly admit it is 50oohms and claim it will result in less signal attenuation for video then a standard 75 ohm cable. &nbsp;They also feel that matching characteristic impedance for cables at video frequencies is irrelavent for lengths shorter than 24', yet their marketing literature dictates otherwise for their speakercables. &nbsp;We should probably go offline and discuss via email. &nbsp;I am preparing an article about this and would like to use some of the info you posted herein.</font>

 

[greatfidelity]

there is alot of snakeoil but......

I have been trying different cables for interlinks for years and there is at most minor differences at the high end of the spectrum, definitely not a dollar value.
there are two exceptions that have come out one is stealth audio,the other is mine.
I have made a cable that has blown away all who have listened to it in blind tests,I only measure to fix problems as if it sounds great it is.
here are some of the losing cables, acoustic zen silver reference II/silver matrix/stealth audio indra/metacarbon/purist audio design colossus/hdi/elco gi 999/ z cable live/nbs/sraight wire/ monster various models/and many more.
The cables I made are a rare find no techno bs just listen to them ,they take 9 skilled hours a pair to make and no snake oil I am looking to compare them to the king cobra ( transparent opus mm bal) I am also considering a cryo test, but it might be junk in short most cables have a poor transmission function and that is key. forget the techno bable terms and evualuations as in pear cables brief just listen as the power of marketing is the one factor most people get sucked into.

 

[xcapri]

What's wrong with just using the cheap #14 CU lamp cord wire available at the hardware store. What special properties doesn't it have other than high price?

 

[gene]

I have been trying different cables for interlinks for years and there is at most minor differences at the high end of the spectrum, definitely not a dollar value.
there are two exceptions that have come out one is stealth audio,the other is mine.
I have made a cable that has blown away all who have listened to it in blind tests,I only measure to fix problems as if it sounds great it is.
here are some of the losing cables, acoustic zen silver reference II/silver matrix/stealth audio indra/metacarbon/purist audio design colossus/hdi/elco gi 999/ z cable live/nbs/sraight wire/ monster various models/and many more.
The cables I made are a rare find no techno bs just listen to them ,they take 9 skilled hours a pair to make and no snake oil I am looking to compare them to the king cobra ( transparent opus mm bal) I am also considering a cryo test, but it might be junk in short most cables have a poor transmission function and that is key. forget the techno bable terms and evualuations as in pear cables brief just listen as the power of marketing is the one factor most people get sucked into.

Don't forget to soak your cables in kosher chicken fat blessed by a Rabi.