This dude makes good points in totally trashing Dolby Atmos...

[HTEnthusiast]

I consider Atmos ceiling speakers one of my favorite upgrades in the evolution of my dedicated (now 9.5.6) home theater. I initially did a lot of A/B comparisons with various movies after installing them. I find the Atmos speakers round out the experience, making everything more natural. I also prefer Neural X and Virtual Atmos to them being off. They certainly have more positive impact than the “wides” that I added.

I started with 4 ceiling speakers, then added the final middle pair. The first 4 had a nice impact. The 3rd pair was incrementally better, but to a lesser extent. I certainly wouldn’t want a theater without them. I’m fortunate to have dedicated room in my basement, but more important… I’m glad I designed it in a way that the equipment shelves are built into the wall with the back open to a storage area. When you have a dedicated processor running a 9.5.6 system… it’s a “snake pit“ of wires, even after zipping everything.

 

[Auditor55]

This is the tearing into it part however. Now you have to cut drywall, fish cable, install mounting brackets, patch drywall, paint. I've been there and done that and it's a pain in the arse.

Atmos was meant for the commercial cinema, period, and end of story. I've said so many times for many years on this forum. Atmos was bound to fail as a home system. Most people would be unable to implement a home Atmos system per Dolby recommendations, i.e. ceiling speakers. Dolby knew it out the gate that's why they came up with Atmos-enabled speakers, what Gene calls bouncy house. The Dolby recommendation for speaker placement is simply a challenge for most.

 

[Auditor55]

James, you must be fun at parties Without the mass appeal to Atmos, it probably would have been off the radar of even serious audio enthusiasts. I do agree that Dolby really watered it down, similar to what THX did by certifying everything but breakfast cereal. But, we are getting more and more spatial audio content these days and the fact that we can stream it was something I never thought would see the light of day only a decade ago. Embrace it my friend. Drill some holes in your ceiling and install some speakers.

That spatial audio is completely awful in how it's being delivered.

 

[Tankini]

Seriously? So ONE movie defines success vs failure?

Why don't you look at the other ONE THOUSAND movies with ATMOS?

Box office:
1. Avatar $2.92 billion - ATMOS (Remastered)
2. Avengers Endgame $2.79 billion - ATMOS
3. Avatar 2 $2.3 billion - ATMOS
4. Titanic $2.25 billion - ATMOS (Remastered)
5. Star Wars VII The Force Awakens $2.06 billion - ATMOS
6. Avengers Infinity War $2.05 billion - ATMOS
7. Spider-Man No Way Home $1.92 billion - ATMOS
8. Jurassic World $1.67 billion - DTS-X
9. The Lion King $1.66 billion - ATMOS
10. The Avengers $1.52 billion - ATMOS

Top Gun Maverick $1.5 billion - ATMOS
Avengers Age of Ultron $1.4 billion - ATMOS
Star Wars The Last Jedi $1.3 billion - ATMOS
Iron Man $1.2 billion - ATMOS
Captain America Civil War $1.16 billion - ATMOS
Aquaman $1.15 billion - ATMOS

PRACTICALLY EVERY big movie released today has an ATMOS soundtrack.

But no, let's not look at ALL the movies. Let's just look at ONE movie that doesn't have ATMOS! Must be joking.

@AcuDefTechGuy, I just stole your list! Thanks for posting up a great list of movies with Atmos soundtrack moves!

 

[Auditor55]

Failed or just evolution passed them by.
Not much will be the standard for a long time.

Auro-3d is a better-conceived home system for Immersive audio than Dolby Atmos. Dolby monopolized the market and kept Auro-3D out of the US market. Auro-3D is much easier to implement for someone wanting to evolve from a 5.1/7.1 to an immersive audio system, as their systems don't require ceiling speakers, the single overhead speaker in the Auro-3D system (so-called Voice of God) is optional.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Atmos was meant for the commercial cinema, period, and end of story. I've said so many times for many years on this forum. Atmos was bound to fail as a home system. Most people would be unable to implement a home Atmos system per Dolby recommendations, i.e. ceiling speakers. Dolby knew it out the gate that's why they came up with Atmos-enabled speakers, what Gene calls bouncy house. The Dolby recommendation for speaker placement is simply a challenge for most.

Atmos probably was conceived for commercial cinemas, but surely they thought of home adoption. IMO it’s not a failure as home cinema. It’s actually pretty amazing. Its failure is widespread implementation, wow, that’s a new thing lol. For ME it’s successful because I’m fortunate enough to have a nice Atmos system, and you can’t tell
Me it wasn’t worth it.

Auro-3d is a better-conceived home system for Immersive audio than Dolby Atmos. Dolby monopolized the market and kept Auro-3D out of the US market. Auro-3D is much easier to implement for someone wanting to evolve from a 5.1/7.1 to an immersive audio system, as their systems don't require ceiling speakers, the single overhead speaker in the Auro-3D system (so-called Voice of God) is optional.

Why is auro better conceived?
Also, Atmos supports height speakers which are pretty close to the Auro recommended locations. So if you wanted both, you could split the difference with heights vs tops. FWIW, the VOG is also a ceiling speaker. That makes it about the same as Atmos for difficulty. Plus there’s no optional VOG, but still pans across the ceiling.

And furthermore Auro is channel based, while Atmos is object based. IME objects placed IN the room is crazy good and more immersive than simply mirroring the bed layer in the surround heights.

 

[Danzilla31]

Atmos was meant for the commercial cinema, period, and end of story. I've said so many times for many years on this forum. Atmos was bound to fail as a home system. Most people would be unable to implement a home Atmos system per Dolby recommendations, i.e. ceiling speakers. Dolby knew it out the gate that's why they came up with Atmos-enabled speakers, what Gene calls bouncy house. The Dolby recommendation for speaker placement is simply a challenge for most.

LMFAO how is Atmos a failure it's everywhere now.

 

[TLS Guy]

Auro-3d is a better-conceived home system for Immersive audio than Dolby Atmos. Dolby monopolized the market and kept Auro-3D out of the US market. Auro-3D is much easier to implement for someone wanting to evolve from a 5.1/7.1 to an immersive audio system, as their systems don't require ceiling speakers, the single overhead speaker in the Auro-3D system (so-called Voice of God) is optional.

An absolutely terrible system and is dead. It should never have seen the light of day.

 

[TLS Guy]

LMFAO how is Atmos a failure it's everywhere now.

I think it all depends on how you define success and failure. Sure there are stacks, wall to wall of Atmos sound bars in every Target store. Bouncy speakers abound. That is not success, but deception.

The fact is that to realize the results the technology promises, then you have to consider a costly complex system. There is a vast amount of design, wiring and equipment installation required to achieve any benefit from such a complex sonic architecture. So, as I have maintained all along, most would obtain far more satisfying results from better, higher quality simpler systems. That photograph from HTEnthusiast tells the whole story. My system has 650' of speaker cable alone, and that is just a small part of it.
Then when you get to room layout, you get into the realms of the absurd. I just can't see the benefit fulfilled, unless equipment and room are considered and designed as a whole. I think you can get good results from 2 and three channel systems plus a sub or two in most domestic spaces. My contention is that very few domestic spaces justify channel counts above that. Worse, I strongly suspect adding channels is often a counter productive downgrade.

I have a couple of very typical domestic spaces, one with a 2.2 system and one with a 3.1 system. I can only imagine the havoc that would be created trying to shoehorn in more channels, other than adding a center to the 2.2.

The 7.2.4 system is a total system design with the room an integral part of the design concept.

 

[Danzilla31]

An absolutely terrible system and is dead. It should never have seen the light of day.

ACTUALLY Auro-3D when used as an upmixer on music on a proper Dolby Atmos system sounds really good and I'm not alone in that experience

It's one of my favorite ways to listen to music now

 

[Danzilla31]

I think it all depends on how you define success and failure. Sure there are stacks, wall to wall of Atmos sound bars in every Target store. Bouncy speakers abound. That is not success, but deception.

The fact is that to realize the results the technology promises, then you have to consider a costly complex system. There is a vast amount of design, wiring and equipment installation required to achieve any benefit from such a complex sonic architecture. So, as I have maintained all along, most would obtain far more satisfying results from better, higher quality simpler systems. That photograph from HTEnthusiast tells the whole story. My system has 650' of speaker cable alone, and that is just a small part of it.
Then when you get to room layout, you get into the realms of the absurd. I just can't see the benefit fulfilled, unless equipment and room are considered and designed as a whole. I think you can get good results from 2 and three channel systems plus a sub or two in most domestic spaces. My contention is that very few domestic spaces justify channel counts above that. Worse, I strongly suspect adding channels is often a counter productive downgrade.

I have a couple of very typical domestic spaces, one with a 2.2 system and one with a 3.1 system. I can only imagine the havoc that would be created trying to shoehorn in more channels, other than adding a center to the 2.2.

The 7.2.4 system is a total system design with the room an integral part of the design concept.

Honestly it's not as complex as one thinks or expensive to do a decent Atmos system. You don't even have to use in ceiling speakers on wall speakers can be used instead fitted to the ceiling

A company like RSL or Monolith from Monoprice you can get a really decent setup for not much at all

 

[Auditor55]

An absolutely terrible system and is dead. It should never have seen the light of day.

No, it's not a terrible system. Anyway, my point is that it's way more consumer-friendly than the ridiculous home Atmos.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

@AcuDefTechGuy, I just stole your list! Thanks for posting up a great list of movies with Atmos soundtrack moves!

You mean the list of movies that I think has great Atmos soundtracks?

Moonfall 2022 8K Red Monstro Atmos **************
Twister 1996 Atmos
Leave the World Behind 2023 6K Sony Venice Atmos
Dungeons & Dragons 2023 4.5K Atmos
Transformers Rise of the Beast 2023 4.5K Atmos
65 2023 4K Atmos
Ant-Man Quantumania 2023 Atmos
The Batman 2022 4K Atmos
13 Hours 2016 4K Atmos
2012 2009 4K Atmos
Alita Battle Angel 2019 4K Atmos
Another Life 2019 4K Atmos (Netflix TV series)
Atomic Blonde 2017 4K DTSX
Batman v Superman Ultimate Edition 4K Atmos
Blade Runner 2049 2017 4K Atmos
Blade Runner 1982 4K Atmos
Black Hawk Down 2001 4K Atmos
Cloverfield Paradox 2018 Atmos
Dredd 2012 4K Atmos
The Equalizer 2014 4K Atmos
Godzilla 2014 4K Atmos
Godzilla King of the Monsters 2019 4K Atmos
Gravity 2013 Atmos
The Great Wall 2016 4K Atmos
Harry Potter franchise (8 movies) 2001-2011 4K DTSX
Hunter Killer 2018 4K Atmos
Jupiter Ascending 4K Atmos
Jurassic World 4K DTSX
Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom 4K DTSX
Kong Skull Island 2017 4K Atmos
Lucy 2014 4K Atmos
The Matrix Trilogy 1999, 2003, 2003 4K Atmos
Oblivion 2013 4K Atmos
Pacific Rim 2013 4K Atmos
Pet Sematary (2019) 4K Atmos
Pride and Prejudice and Zombies 2016 4K Atmos
Ready Player One 2018 Atmos
Robin Hood 2018 Atmos
Salt 2010 4K Atmos
Sully 2016 4K Atmos
Terminator Genisys 4K Atmos
Twilight 2008 4K Atmos
Underworld 2003 4K Atmos
Underworld Blood Wars 2016 4K Atmos
X-Men Dark Phoenix 2019 4K Atmos
Edge of Tomorrow 2014 4K Atmos
Resident Evil: Welcome to Raccoon City 2021 4K Atmos
POTC Dead Men Tell No Tales 2017 4K Atmos
Eternals 2021 4.5K Arri Alexa Atmos
Lost in Space 2018 TV Series
Spider-Man 2 2004
Spider-Man 3 2007
The Amazing Spider-Man 2012
Doctor Strange-2 2022
Man of Steel 2013
The Dark Tower 2017
Avatar 2 The Way of Water 2023

 

[TLS Guy]

ACTUALLY Auro-3D when used as an upmixer on music on a proper Dolby Atmos system sounds really good and I'm not alone in that experience

It's one of my favorite ways to listen to music now

My experience is the same as Gene's. Auro D is basically multichannel stereo. Both he and I can cut out amps without unplugging anything, so we can tell what these upmixer really do. The Dolby DD up mixer is the only one that actually does what it says on the tin.

 

[TLS Guy]

You mean the list of movies that I think has great Atmos soundtracks?

Moonfall 2022 8K Red Monstro Atmos **************
Twister 1996 Atmos
Leave the World Behind 2023 6K Sony Venice Atmos
Dungeons & Dragons 2023 4.5K Atmos
Transformers Rise of the Beast 2023 4.5K Atmos
65 2023 4K Atmos
Ant-Man Quantumania 2023 Atmos
The Batman 2022 4K Atmos
13 Hours 2016 4K Atmos
2012 2009 4K Atmos
Alita Battle Angel 2019 4K Atmos
Another Life 2019 4K Atmos (Netflix TV series)
Atomic Blonde 2017 4K DTSX
Batman v Superman Ultimate Edition 4K Atmos
Blade Runner 2049 2017 4K Atmos
Blade Runner 1982 4K Atmos
Black Hawk Down 2001 4K Atmos
Cloverfield Paradox 2018 Atmos
Dredd 2012 4K Atmos
The Equalizer 2014 4K Atmos
Godzilla 2014 4K Atmos
Godzilla King of the Monsters 2019 4K Atmos
Gravity 2013 Atmos
The Great Wall 2016 4K Atmos
Harry Potter franchise (8 movies) 2001-2011 4K DTSX
Hunter Killer 2018 4K Atmos
Jupiter Ascending 4K Atmos
Jurassic World 4K DTSX
Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom 4K DTSX
Kong Skull Island 2017 4K Atmos
Lucy 2014 4K Atmos
The Matrix Trilogy 1999, 2003, 2003 4K Atmos
Oblivion 2013 4K Atmos
Pacific Rim 2013 4K Atmos
Pet Sematary (2019) 4K Atmos
Pride and Prejudice and Zombies 2016 4K Atmos
Ready Player One 2018 Atmos
Robin Hood 2018 Atmos
Salt 2010 4K Atmos
Sully 2016 4K Atmos
Terminator Genisys 4K Atmos
Twilight 2008 4K Atmos
Underworld 2003 4K Atmos
Underworld Blood Wars 2016 4K Atmos
X-Men Dark Phoenix 2019 4K Atmos
Edge of Tomorrow 2014 4K Atmos
Resident Evil: Welcome to Raccoon City 2021 4K Atmos
POTC Dead Men Tell No Tales 2017 4K Atmos
Eternals 2021 4.5K Arri Alexa Atmos
Lost in Space 2018 TV Series
Spider-Man 2 2004
Spider-Man 3 2007
The Amazing Spider-Man 2012
Doctor Strange-2 2022
Man of Steel 2013
The Dark Tower 2017
Avatar 2 The Way of Water 2023

I am not a big movie watcher. I do have a number of movies on BD Atmos discs though. What I find is that the producers are scared to put any real power on the overhead speakers and especially the surrounds and backs. The only movie I have that really puts power all round. I think they are afraid of being accused of blowing up speakers and receivers. My impression is that the discs are not put together as nearly impressive as they could and should be.

I have one SACD that really puts power all round especially when coupled with the Dolby Upmixer. I have heard that disc has brought death to some systems however.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

ACTUALLY Auro-3D when used as an upmixer on music on a proper Dolby Atmos system sounds really good and I'm not alone in that experience

It's one of my favorite ways to listen to music now

I can see that for music, although DSU has been good for me. PLIIx was better but I digress… For an Atmos FILM mix, I think using Auro on it is a horrible idea. I’ve been through a few threads on avs where people were excited about it. But imo, they just want all their speakers working all the time. Big whoop. Lol

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

...What I find is that the producers are scared to put any real power on the overhead speakers...

I agree 100%.

It's definitely a drawback. I do have to increase the speaker-channel levels for my ATMOS ceiling speakers most of the time to get good effects.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

No, it's not a terrible system. Anyway, my point is that it's way more consumer-friendly than the ridiculous home Atmos.

All you have to say is that you think Auro3D is more "user setup/install friendly" than Atmos.

Many people would agree with you. All nice and peaceful about it.

Instead, you use unnecessary strong derogatory words like "RIDICULOUS" and other bitter words to describe ATMOS, which makes you sound like a total sour grape.

It's understandable that not everyone wants to install 4 ceiling speakers in their attics because it can be a PITA. It was horrible for me in the attic at 100F+ degrees temp. I had to cut through a bunch of THICK heavy FOAM insulation in my attic. It was a total PITA. Say no more.

Don't need to sound so spiteful/bitter about it. OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER again YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

All you have to say is that you think Auro3D is more "user setup/install friendly" than Atmos.

And EVERYONE would agree with you. All nice and peaceful about it.

Instead, you use unnecessary strong derogatory words like "RIDICULOUS" and other bitter words to describe ATMOS, which makes you sound like a total sour grape.

It's understandable that not everyone wants to install 4 ceiling speakers in their attics because it can be a PITA. It was horrible for me in the attic at 100F+ degrees temp. I had to cut through a bunch of THICK heavy FOAM insulation in my attic. It was a total PITA. Say no more.

Don't need to sound so spiteful/bitter about it. OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER again YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR.

Except it’s NOT more user friendly to install, so I won’t agree. He won’t respond to my post #86, but if you use the “height” locations it’s basically the same…..
Completely agree with everything else. I also installed my ceiling speakers in insane temperatures, and it was a PITA. But so are other things in life. So if you want something, pull up your boot straps and get it done. If you don’t, then you can sit on an Internet forum and piss and moan because you’re Fukkin lazy.
Maybe the ol curmudgeon will stay in his cave for a while now.

 

[Cos]

All you have to say is that you think Auro3D is more "user setup/install friendly" than Atmos.

And EVERYONE would agree with you. All nice and peaceful about it.

Instead, you use unnecessary strong derogatory words like "RIDICULOUS" and other bitter words to describe ATMOS, which makes you sound like a total sour grape.

It's understandable that not everyone wants to install 4 ceiling speakers in their attics because it can be a PITA. It was horrible for me in the attic at 100F+ degrees temp. I had to cut through a bunch of THICK heavy FOAM insulation in my attic. It was a total PITA. Say no more.

Don't need to sound so spiteful/bitter about it. OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER again YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR.

I 100% agree but after all this time, you seem surpised by his posts?....