The Dolby Atmos, DTS-X, and Auro-3D Discussion Thread

MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
I still waffle on the idea of adding Atmos.

100% of my media is either stereo or 5.1 AC3 and that's it. I don't stream anything more than stereo (I live rural, limited internet speeds). I don't have Bluray or anything other than DVD. 98% of that is all AC3 5.1.

Would 4x Atmos channels really add something significant knowing the content is always 5.1 AC3?
Which processor Up-mixer would be ideal for this per everyone's experience so far?
Does anyone have an idea of how the Up-mixer even works, as in, can you predict what it will do?

I ask because I would loathe to put $1k into an AVR and buy 4 more speakers just to hardly ever hear anything coming from them.

Very best,
 
Auditor55

Auditor55

Audioholic Chief
I still waffle on the idea of adding Atmos.

100% of my media is either stereo or 5.1 AC3 and that's it. I don't stream anything more than stereo (I live rural, limited internet speeds). I don't have Bluray or anything other than DVD. 98% of that is all AC3 5.1.

Would 4x Atmos channels really add something significant knowing the content is always 5.1 AC3?
Which processor Up-mixer would be ideal for this per everyone's experience so far?
Does anyone have an idea of how the Up-mixer even works, as in, can you predict what it will do?

I ask because I would loathe to put $1k into an AVR and buy 4 more speakers just to hardly ever hear anything coming from them.

Very best,
The overall content with Atmos encoded sound is abysmal. Netflix offers the most Atmos encoded sound in comparison to other streaming services but its mostly on their own content and even that is minuscule. UHD disc comes with Atmos or DTS-X but optical disc on its way out so that's something to think about as well.
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
The overall content with Atmos encoded sound is abysmal. Netflix offers the most Atmos encoded sound in comparison to other streaming services but its mostly on their own content and even that is minuscule. UHD disc comes with Atmos or DTS-X but optical disc on its way out so that's something to think about as well.
I'm not being a jerk but how can you honestly give him feedback on how atmos tracks will sound when you don't own an Atmos system?
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
I still waffle on the idea of adding Atmos.

100% of my media is either stereo or 5.1 AC3 and that's it. I don't stream anything more than stereo (I live rural, limited internet speeds). I don't have Bluray or anything other than DVD. 98% of that is all AC3 5.1.

Would 4x Atmos channels really add something significant knowing the content is always 5.1 AC3?
Which processor Up-mixer would be ideal for this per everyone's experience so far?
Does anyone have an idea of how the Up-mixer even works, as in, can you predict what it will do?

I ask because I would loathe to put $1k into an AVR and buy 4 more speakers just to hardly ever hear anything coming from them.

Very best,
It sounds like your pretty happy with where you system is at right now am I hearing you correctly?

If so I'm not sure if that upgrade is right for you if your happy with your rig now and are not a huge movie buff it may not be necessary

As many have mentioned in more then one thread it's better to have a high quality 5.1 system Then a sub par or mediocre atmos system if your just not that into it
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
It sounds like your pretty happy with where you system is at right now am I hearing you correctly?

If so I'm not sure if that upgrade is right for you if your happy with your rig now and are not a huge movie buff it may not be necessary

As many have mentioned in more then one thread it's better to have a high quality 5.1 system Then a sub par or mediocre atmos system if your just not that into it
We are definitely movie buffs, but we are slow on tech when it comes to media. So we haven't gone past DVD's at this time. I have a little over 1500 DVD's, so I'm not about to attempt to replace them with Bluray for an "unknown" improvement. Sure I wager its better, but worth the cost better? Not sure.

So mainly I'm wondering, if we were to add Atmos to our system now, knowing all my content is AC3 5.1, what up-mix would be happening commonly and how does it effect 5.1 content and will it be noticeable and pleasing, I realize that's subjective, but figured anyone out there with Atmos could probably weigh in on the idea of how their Atmos sounds when they have non-Atmos encoded media playback and useing up-mix processing to simulate Atmos.

I'm curious how that experience is, and whether they think Atmos is worth it for that scenario.

Very best,
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
We are definitely movie buffs, but we are slow on tech when it comes to media. So we haven't gone past DVD's at this time. I have a little over 1500 DVD's, so I'm not about to attempt to replace them with Bluray for an "unknown" improvement. Sure I wager its better, but worth the cost better? Not sure.

So mainly I'm wondering, if we were to add Atmos to our system now, knowing all my content is AC3 5.1, what up-mix would be happening commonly and how does it effect 5.1 content and will it be noticeable and pleasing, I realize that's subjective, but figured anyone out there with Atmos could probably weigh in on the idea of how their Atmos sounds when they have non-Atmos encoded media playback and useing up-mix processing to simulate Atmos.

I'm curious how that experience is, and whether they think Atmos is worth it for that scenario.

Very best,
That's a great question and one out of my level of knowledge

Hopefully members that own atmos systems like I do but understand upmixing better can give you better feedback
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
I have a modern 4k LED. Nothing special. But no, I'm not that 90's with all my tech. :D

I'm much more into the audible experience as it is. Just seeing what legacy audio (essentially) is like when up-mixed to Atmos simulation with a modern AVR processor. Or if it's not worth it without specific Atmos encoded content.

Very best,
 
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William Lemmerhirt

William Lemmerhirt

Audioholic Spartan
The overall content with Atmos encoded sound is abysmal. Netflix offers the most Atmos encoded sound in comparison to other streaming services but its mostly on their own content and even that is minuscule. UHD disc comes with Atmos or DTS-X but optical disc on its way out so that's something to think about as well.
WHY ARE YOU EVEN HERE???????
Your statements are abysmal.
There are literally HUNDREDS of Atmos and dtsx titles. HUNDREDS!!!!!
Vudu Hulu Disney+ Netflix BD uhd redbox. Yeah, disk has one foot in the grave.
Go piss on your own fukkin parade.
 
T

Trebdp83

Audioholic
Oh, I need a snack for this thread. I've made toast on it, but I wonder if that old Denon would get hot enough to make a pan of Jiffy Pop.
 
William Lemmerhirt

William Lemmerhirt

Audioholic Spartan
We are definitely movie buffs, but we are slow on tech when it comes to media. So we haven't gone past DVD's at this time. I have a little over 1500 DVD's, so I'm not about to attempt to replace them with Bluray for an "unknown" improvement. Sure I wager its better, but worth the cost better? Not sure.

So mainly I'm wondering, if we were to add Atmos to our system now, knowing all my content is AC3 5.1, what up-mix would be happening commonly and how does it effect 5.1 content and will it be noticeable and pleasing, I realize that's subjective, but figured anyone out there with Atmos could probably weigh in on the idea of how their Atmos sounds when they have non-Atmos encoded media playback and useing up-mix processing to simulate Atmos.

I'm curious how that experience is, and whether they think Atmos is worth it for that scenario.

Very best,
Well, as I’ve mentioned before, to me the juice is worth the squeeze. I’m definitely not here to sell you anything, and certainly only you can decide if it’s “worth the cost”. I can sense you’re in a state of analysis paralysis which is common, but anecdotes will only get you so far.
However I’ll try to help and answer this.
So as to what to expect. Unfortunately this you just can’t calculate beforehand. Every track is different and a little unpredictable, but to date I haven’t had a soundtrack sound worse, save for the random sound placed here or there.
DSU and dtsnx work similarly, but differently too. One puts in phase information into the tops/heights and one uses out of phase information.
DSU seems to be a little more atmospheric and dtsnx a little more aggressive, and also louder. Ime DSU is more natural, but dtsnx makes some tracks a little more exciting. So yes, noticeable. Pleasing? Almost always. Also, DSU upmixes the same content to the left side, front and rear, and right side front and rear. Basically 4ch stereo. Dtsnx can do .4 (or .6 with dtsx pro) “discretely”. I air quoted “discretely” to point out that it’s still extrapolating content from the bed layer.
Something else DSU does, is when DynamicEq(Deq) is engaged with DSU, it boosts the bass and treble range as usual, but just as Deq boosts the side/rear surround levels(too much for me) it raises the rear top/height speaker levels too. FWIW, I don’t use Deq. I use audyssey app. And minidsp/REW to build a house curve.
One more thing too. Both upmixers(not including Auromatic here) are an improvement over PLIIX/Z, and offer different, but similar exterior each other. But keep in mind, upmixing legacy tracks that don’t contain objects, can’t replicate that, as there are no XYZ coordinates, and no objects to place. Like all soundtracks and film mixers before, some are definitely better than others. Ymmv. Hope that’s not TLDR...
Again, for me, it was totally worth the upgrade, and imo some Atmos is better than no Atmos. I can’t say if it will be worth it for you. It seems like you are content. Or I might be mistaking reticence for talking yourself out of it! Lol
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
We are definitely movie buffs, but we are slow on tech when it comes to media. So we haven't gone past DVD's at this time. I have a little over 1500 DVD's, so I'm not about to attempt to replace them with Bluray for an "unknown" improvement. Sure I wager its better, but worth the cost better? Not sure.

So mainly I'm wondering, if we were to add Atmos to our system now, knowing all my content is AC3 5.1, what up-mix would be happening commonly and how does it effect 5.1 content and will it be noticeable and pleasing, I realize that's subjective, but figured anyone out there with Atmos could probably weigh in on the idea of how their Atmos sounds when they have non-Atmos encoded media playback and useing up-mix processing to simulate Atmos.

I'm curious how that experience is, and whether they think Atmos is worth it for that scenario.

Very best,
A few points to make.

BD is vastly superior to DVD in picture quality. Even for old movies. I replaced even my old animated Disney films with BD because they really do look that much better.

As far as sound, an extra upgrade. Fidelity is better hands down. Yes, some movies on BD have pretty much the same sound as they always did, but you still get more resolution so it is possible that the result is better.

As for the upmixers, @William Lemmerhirt already went over that, but I'll say it's really a surprise at how well they handle older or non-object based soundtracks. Even our resident purist @TLS Guy likes the upmixer. I was quite surprised at his review honestly given his taste. He's right though, it works and it works well.
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
Well, as I’ve mentioned before, to me the juice is worth the squeeze. I’m definitely not here to sell you anything, and certainly only you can decide if it’s “worth the cost”. I can sense you’re in a state of analysis paralysis which is common, but anecdotes will only get you so far.
However I’ll try to help and answer this.
So as to what to expect. Unfortunately this you just can’t calculate beforehand. Every track is different and a little unpredictable, but to date I haven’t had a soundtrack sound worse, save for the random sound placed here or there.
DSU and dtsnx work similarly, but differently too. One puts in phase information into the tops/heights and one uses out of phase information.
DSU seems to be a little more atmospheric and dtsnx a little more aggressive, and also louder. Ime DSU is more natural, but dtsnx makes some tracks a little more exciting. So yes, noticeable. Pleasing? Almost always. Also, DSU upmixes the same content to the left side, front and rear, and right side front and rear. Basically 4ch stereo. Dtsnx can do .4 (or .6 with dtsx pro) “discretely”. I air quoted “discretely” to point out that it’s still extrapolating content from the bed layer.
Something else DSU does, is when DynamicEq(Deq) is engaged with DSU, it boosts the bass and treble range as usual, but just as Deq boosts the side/rear surround levels(too much for me) it raises the rear top/height speaker levels too. FWIW, I don’t use Deq. I use audyssey app. And minidsp/REW to build a house curve.
One more thing too. Both upmixers(not including Auromatic here) are an improvement over PLIIX/Z, and offer different, but similar exterior each other. But keep in mind, upmixing legacy tracks that don’t contain objects, can’t replicate that, as there are no XYZ coordinates, and no objects to place. Like all soundtracks and film mixers before, some are definitely better than others. Ymmv. Hope that’s not TLDR...
Again, for me, it was totally worth the upgrade, and imo some Atmos is better than no Atmos. I can’t say if it will be worth it for you. It seems like you are content. Or I might be mistaking reticence for talking yourself out of it! Lol
Thanks,

Not trying to talk myself out of it, more into it, I have some time as my home is built to decide if it's worth doing it now or later. It's just hard to find scenarios like stated above (legacy content) and user experiences. As you can imagine it would be a shame to setup a 4 channel Atmos and then not hear it. Unfortunately I read experiences like that a lot and people struggling to find content for it. But it seems there's plenty out there now, so maybe that information was dated. So I'm much more interested in the up-mixing ability to have Atmos enabled in anything put through it and if that experience is decent, then real Atmos content would be good too, but mainly interested in the daily grind with legacy content.

Very best,
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
A few points to make.

BD is vastly superior to DVD in picture quality. Even for old movies. I replaced even my old animated Disney films with BD because they really do look that much better.

As far as sound, an extra upgrade. Fidelity is better hands down. Yes, some movies on BD have pretty much the same sound as they always did, but you still get more resolution so it is possible that the result is better.

As for the upmixers, @William Lemmerhirt already went over that, but I'll say it's really a surprise at how well they handle older or non-object based soundtracks. Even our resident purist @TLS Guy likes the upmixer. I was quite surprised at his review honestly given his taste. He's right though, it works and it works well.
Thanks,

That's helpful; that comment about the upmixer works with older content is the kind of stuff I'm looking for more of.

Very best,
 
William Lemmerhirt

William Lemmerhirt

Audioholic Spartan
And also to ad to @panteragstk ‘s post.

My system is on almost every single day. So everything from judge Judy to the Avengers gets surround treatment. We have a combination of streaming, satellite, and disk formats. I don’t like using dvd unless it’s demo material that I haven’t updated. Some older dts tracks are very good but lossless is generally better, and I hate most of the image quality of dvd. Streaming and satellite are hit or miss naturally, as different channels and streaming services can vary in compression levels.
I much prefer BD and UHD. Downside to that is some studios only release Atmos on UHD(looking at YOU Disney. Bastards). It’s a greedy money grab but eBay has titles usually, and many people don’t keep older titles.
Oh yeah. The point of that was, soooo many things surprise me with upmixing. Songs in commercials, sound effects on random tv shows, even drama shows or ones you wouldn’t expect. I’m surprised often. What gets me the most is things you don’t expect. Sure helicopters and planes and cave scenes are good. But it’s the random stuff that I really appreciate and makes it immersive.
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Audioholic
And also to ad to @panteragstk ‘s post.

My system is on almost every single day. So everything from judge Judy to the Avengers gets surround treatment. We have a combination of streaming, satellite, and disk formats. I don’t like using dvd unless it’s demo material that I haven’t updated. Some older dts tracks are very good but lossless is generally better, and I hate most of the image quality of dvd. Streaming and satellite are hit or miss naturally, as different channels and streaming services can vary in compression levels.
I much prefer BD and UHD. Downside to that is some studios only release Atmos on UHD(looking at YOU Disney. Bastards). It’s a greedy money grab but eBay has titles usually, and many people don’t keep older titles.
Oh yeah. The point of that was, soooo many things surprise me with upmixing. Songs in commercials, sound effects on random tv shows, even drama shows or ones you wouldn’t expect. I’m surprised often. What gets me the most is things you don’t expect. Sure helicopters and planes and cave scenes are good. But it’s the random stuff that I really appreciate and makes it immersive.
Yikes, Judge Judy in Atmos? Not sure I want to go there! o_O

Thanks, that's good to know, I like the idea of the upmixing doing well on random 2 channel to 5 channel content.

Do you use a different mode on the process when using actual Atmos content versus the one that upmixes?

Very best,
 
William Lemmerhirt

William Lemmerhirt

Audioholic Spartan
Yikes, Judge Judy in Atmos? Not sure I want to go there! o_O

Thanks, that's good to know, I like the idea of the upmixing doing well on random 2 channel to 5 channel content.

Do you use a different mode on the process when using actual Atmos content versus the one that upmixes?

Very best,
Yeah, judge Judy isn’t really THAT awesome. Just pointing out that we get a big variety here. And again, not every is super awesome. But the more stuff you go through, the more you find.

For Atmos/DTS-X I just select the Atmos /DTS-x track.
For upmixing, it depends really. DSU for music only. For other stuff I probably use dtsnx more, but it really just depends. You’ll have to spend LOTS of time evaluating content. That’s the best part!
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
I used DSU listening to the latest Tool album and had an interesting experience.

One thing with this album is that it was MUCH louder with DSU engaged. I hadn't really noticed that with Pink Floyd or other things I've used it on. Granted, this is the first rock/metal album I've tried it on so that might be common.

I do like the decisions the DSU made though. Really didn't mess around and sound was EVERYWHERE. Not subtle at all like on other things. Interesting.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I still waffle on the idea of adding Atmos.

100% of my media is either stereo or 5.1 AC3 and that's it. I don't stream anything more than stereo (I live rural, limited internet speeds). I don't have Bluray or anything other than DVD. 98% of that is all AC3 5.1.

Would 4x Atmos channels really add something significant knowing the content is always 5.1 AC3?
Which processor Up-mixer would be ideal for this per everyone's experience so far?
Does anyone have an idea of how the Up-mixer even works, as in, can you predict what it will do?

I ask because I would loathe to put $1k into an AVR and buy 4 more speakers just to hardly ever hear anything coming from them.

Very best,
Some prefer DSU. Some prefer Auro3D. Some (like me) prefer DTS NeuralX. Everyone has a different preference. And the effects differ from content to content. There is no right and wrong.
 

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