Some words regarding Neal Young removing his music from Spotify.

[SithZedi]

Part of the problem in many topics is the fact that the 'science' is presented by people who aren't part of the scientific community as absolutely true, when they neither fully understand the info nor could they argue for or against it in a debate. Some of these people are hypocrites- Algore is one example. Preach the gospel of CO2 emissions being bad, then come up with some ferkakta plan for trading carbon credits so one person/entity can use as much as they want as long as they find some rube to use as a statistical playmate that acts to balance the output or consumption. Gore's house in Tennessee was in the 16K square foot range and used a ridiculous amount of energy.

Then there's going on about CO2 as if it's the only thing causing climate change when water vapor and Methane are at least as bad. They come up with deadlines for 'Carbon Neutrality' that are impossible to achieve, then act like they saved the whole world when other countries clearly don't give a rat's a$$.

Funny you mention the self righteous Gore's hypocrisy. Remember he makes money off it:

Blood And Gore: Making A Killing On Anti-Carbon Investment Hype

Mr. Gore, “Are you ready to change the way you live?”

www.forbes.com

 

[Pogre]

Then there's going on about CO2 as if it's the only thing causing climate change when water vapor and Methane are at least as bad.

Well to be fair the way I understand it is that CO2 warms it up enough to to thaw ancient methane deposits and the warmer climate puts more water vapor into the atmosphere.

 

[highfigh]

Well to be fair the way I understand it is that CO2 warms it up enough to to thaw ancient methane deposits and the warmer climate puts more water vapor into the atmosphere.

That's part of the Methane problem but with 7 billion people and every other animal with a digestive system, we all contribute. The amount of Methane that's released by rising temperature is minute in comparison.

Greenhouse gases act like a blanket to some extent because they're heavy enough that they don't float away. I fail to see how this causes warming at altitude > several hundred feet above seal level. Them, there are the canyons that can hold more, although wind prevents CO2 being the only gas in them, which is a good thing because I wouldn't be here now (been on three rafting trips in the Grand Canyon, which is a mile from the top in some places).

I want to see some accountability for hacking & slashing the Rainforests.

 

[highfigh]

Funny you mention the self righteous Gore's hypocrisy. Remember he makes money off it:

Blood And Gore: Making A Killing On Anti-Carbon Investment Hype

Mr. Gore, “Are you ready to change the way you live?”

www.forbes.com

I guess he disagrees with Obama on (paraphrased) " once they have ten or fifteen million, I guess they have enough"- Gore's net worth is about $330M-

How Al Gore Achieved a Net Worth of $330 Million

Al Gore's Net Worth in 2020 Revealed: An American Politician and environmentalist. Find out how much money Al Gore makes and how he did it?

moneyinc.com

For that matter, Obama must have forgotten or changed his mind on that comment-

Barack Obama's Net Worth - How Wealthy is the 44th President?

Just how rich did Barack Obama get? Read the story of Barack Obama's net worth, how he makes money and what he spends it on.

finty.com

 

[highfigh]

I wonder if, when Young was writing all of those songs about the common man, etc, did he ever think he would be worth $200 Million?

Neil Young Net Worth

What is Neil Young's net worth?

www.celebritynetworth.com

 

[SithZedi]

I guess he disagrees with Obama on (paraphrased) " once they have ten or fifteen million, I guess they have enough"- Gore's net worth is about $330M-

How Al Gore Achieved a Net Worth of $330 Million

Al Gore's Net Worth in 2020 Revealed: An American Politician and environmentalist. Find out how much money Al Gore makes and how he did it?

moneyinc.com

For that matter, Obama must have forgotten or changed his mind on that comment-

Barack Obama's Net Worth - How Wealthy is the 44th President?

Just how rich did Barack Obama get? Read the story of Barack Obama's net worth, how he makes money and what he spends it on.

finty.com

Obama has done well. Netflix = 50 M, Random House = 65 M, Hypocrisy = Priceless.
"According to an estimate by Analytics@American, American University’s business analytics program, however, Barack and Michelle Obama could make as much as $242.5 million post-presidency. "

Normally I do not begrudge anyone making an honest, million or billion but this is Obama. 242 M is probably a low end estimate for someone who "Didn't build that". I just hope he shares the wealth.

Pretty good for the guy that was the Spicoli of his high school.

 

[Pogre]

The amount of Methane that's released by rising temperature is minute in comparison.

I think you're right for now, but once it warms up enough to thaw major deposits of frozen methane we're gonna be in deep, deep trouble. Those deposits are enormous, and research shows it's already begun.

30,000 year-old carbon deposits are thawing in Siberia

Carbon, freeze-locked under ice over 30,000 years ago, is now thawing and being released into the climate as greenhouse gases

www.openaccessgovernment.org

Dreaded Methane Deposits in Arctic Start to Escape; Scientists Warn of Abrupt Climate Change in Future | Weather.com

The 60-member international team of Russian research ship R/V Akademik Keldysh have made this discovery. The scientists are part of a multi-year International Shelf Study Expedition and say that their findings are preliminary. - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com

weather.com

 

[SithZedi]

I think you're right for now, but once it warms up enough to thaw major deposits of frozen methane we're gonna be in deep, deep trouble. Those deposits are enormous, and research shows it's already begun.

30,000 year-old carbon deposits are thawing in Siberia

Carbon, freeze-locked under ice over 30,000 years ago, is now thawing and being released into the climate as greenhouse gases

www.openaccessgovernment.org

Dreaded Methane Deposits in Arctic Start to Escape; Scientists Warn of Abrupt Climate Change in Future | Weather.com

The 60-member international team of Russian research ship R/V Akademik Keldysh have made this discovery. The scientists are part of a multi-year International Shelf Study Expedition and say that their findings are preliminary. - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com

weather.com

Deep trouble indeed. It's part of the cycles of the planet, the Norse were farming in Greenland 1,000 years ago but we still can't do that now. We've had snowball earth and we have had completely ice free earth.
Humans are going to have to stop fighting each other and adapt.

 

[highfigh]

I think you're right for now, but once it warms up enough to thaw major deposits of frozen methane we're gonna be in deep, deep trouble. Those deposits are enormous, and research shows it's already begun.

30,000 year-old carbon deposits are thawing in Siberia

Carbon, freeze-locked under ice over 30,000 years ago, is now thawing and being released into the climate as greenhouse gases

www.openaccessgovernment.org

Dreaded Methane Deposits in Arctic Start to Escape; Scientists Warn of Abrupt Climate Change in Future | Weather.com

The 60-member international team of Russian research ship R/V Akademik Keldysh have made this discovery. The scientists are part of a multi-year International Shelf Study Expedition and say that their findings are preliminary. - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com

weather.com

One question that needs an answer- "Where does it go after it's released?". Again, it doesn't just float into the atmosphere, so some of it must find low-lying areas to go to. Also, the depth of the thaw has to be considered and the top layers haven't decayed as much as the deeper ones, so their Methane content would be lower.

 

[Pogre]

One question that needs an answer- "Where does it go after it's released?". Again, it doesn't just float into the atmosphere, so some of it must find low-lying areas to go to. Also, the depth of the thaw has to be considered and the top layers haven't decayed as much as the deeper ones, so their Methane content would be lower.

Well... air currents, warm air interacting with cold air... it gets spread throughout the atmosphere. Like gases and ash from volcanic eruptions. They spread and cover the entire planet. Big eruptions can and have caused global winters that last for decades.

 

[SithZedi]

One question that needs an answer- "Where does it go after it's released?". Again, it doesn't just float into the atmosphere, so some of it must find low-lying areas to go to. Also, the depth of the thaw has to be considered and the top layers haven't decayed as much as the deeper ones, so their Methane content would be lower.

Remember reading methane released into the atmosphere breaks down in 7 to 12 years into CO2 and Water.

 

[Pogre]

Remember reading methane released into the atmosphere breaks down in 7 to 12 years into CO2 and Water.

Something like that. Might have something to do with algae taking it out of the atmosphere for photosynthesis iirc, but it can only break down so much at a time. I'm definitely not a climate scientist or expert at all on the subject, but I do know the ocean is a critical part of the carbon cycle.

 

[SithZedi]

Something like that. Might have something to do with algae taking it out of the atmosphere for photosynthesis iirc. I'm definitely not a climate scientist or expert at all on the subject, but I do know the ocean is a critical part of the carbon cycle.

Same here, no expert, but I do find it a fascinating subject, especially Paleoclimatology. Read all the books I can on the subject. When you read how cycles occured in the climate in the past, before humans had any influence on the climate, it's like studying deep space. I.e., humans are a grain of sand on a beach.

 

[Trell]

Is this thread going to turn into a "Global Warning is a Hoax"-thread?

 

[Pogre]

One question that needs an answer- "Where does it go after it's released?". Again, it doesn't just float into the atmosphere, so some of it must find low-lying areas to go to. Also, the depth of the thaw has to be considered and the top layers haven't decayed as much as the deeper ones, so their Methane content would be lower.

I seem to remember reading a story about a low valley with a natural CO2 seep that just pooled in the bottom and the entire area was deadly to life. Anything that wandered in there would pass out and die.

I'm so fuzzy recalling details on that one it might even been fiction, but it sounds like it could be a thing..?

 

[Pogre]

Is this thread going to turn into a "Global Warning is a Hoax"-thread?

Lol. Not necessarily. I'm just hopped up on coffee and feeling chatty this morning.

 

[SithZedi]

Lol. Not necessarily. I'm just hopped up on coffee and feeling chatty this morning.

LOL, same here. I'll do that if you like, I can argue both points.
I'm a light beer from miller guy at heart..

 

[John Parks]

I seem to remember reading a story about a low valley with a natural CO2 seep that just pooled in the bottom and the entire area was deadly to life. Anything that wandered in there would pass out and die.

I'm so fuzzy recalling details on that one it might even been fiction, but it sounds like it could be a thing..?

Lake Nyos in Camaroon - fascinating stuff.

Lake Nyos - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Pogre]

Same here, no expert, but I do find it a fascinating subject, especially Paleoclimatology. Read all the books I can on the subject. When you read how cycles occured in the climate in the past, before humans had any influence on the climate, it's like studying deep space. I.e., humans are a grain of sand on a beach.

And to @highfigh's point about rain forests, of course all trees and plants along with algae process CO2 to fuel photosynthesis and release O2 back into the atmosphere. Rain forests are getting destroyed at an alarming rate.

That's a whole 'nother ball of wax tho and again, like you said, I'm not an expert. I don't know enough to die on any hills over it, but the evidence points to something pretty scary if we don't come together and work toward a solution.

 

[Hobbit]

Southern man don't need him around any how.

I think it's great that people stand up for what they believe. We should all do that. I try and do this all the time.

For instance, I saw a local business owner, a fairly good size business, on the news. I was floored about what he had to say about something he, his business, had done (nothing about covid or current politics). Now I won't support his business. IMO, I'm saddened that most people didn't like what his business did but will keep supporting him because of "convenience."