killdozzer

killdozzer

Audioholic Field Marshall
@ryanosaur I could agree that training your palate only to end up unhappy and not getting any satisfaction from an average bottle is an exercise in making your life miserable, but the same could be said about the ear.
 
HTfreak2004

HTfreak2004

Senior Audioholic
One thing to remember comparing one industry to another is almost equal to apples and oranges. Not everything is cross comparable!
 
killdozzer

killdozzer

Audioholic Field Marshall
One thing to remember comparing one industry to another is almost equal to apples and oranges. Not everything is cross comparable!
Absolutely! I didn't try to say it was apples to apples, it was an illustration to help distinct the "needed" or "necessary" from the wishes and desires which are almost always a surplus, but a lot of our lives make sense through the unnecessary surplus. I don't really NEED to see the Pieta live, I don't NEED to read books, watch movies, listen to music... But if you ask me, it's those things precisely that make my life into something I like.

I don't need wine. I don't need alcohol. Only if it brings a little extra. I don't need to cook my food from scratch... And so on.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Ninja
I drink what I like. Price is not a factor nor is anyone's opinion.

I've had expensive bourbon that tastes terrible, and I've had cheap stuff that's fantastic. Same with beer. Recently bought a $25 bottle of a new Founders beer. It sucked. First beer by them I've ever had that I felt like I paid too much.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Ninja
@killdozzer I think you misunderstood my intention: please don’t confuse my irreverence with disagreement or disdain. As a cook and Chef, I’ve been involved in F&B for over 20 years. My statement above was meant merely from a personal value standpoint.
Just like my speakers, rather than go into debt for a $10000 pair, I shopped for the best quality:value I could find. And I did not go into debt for them, either.
I agree that a well made wine, properly aged and cared for, can offer a veritable cornucopia of complex flavor and aromas. I’ve experienced that at $100 per bottle, and $1000 per bottle. And I’ve seen a grown man cry over a $8000 bottle of undrinkable brown fluid that our Somm was at first giddy over... and was likewise heartbroken and dejected upon seeing the actual condition of the open bottle.
I do not value fine dining at $600 per person, and I do not value overly expensive beer, liquor and wine. I can appreciate all, but rarely will I buy for my perception of the diminished return.
None of this is to say that, given the opportunity to profit from another’s willingness to buy a $600 meal, I wouldn’t sell my services to execute that... and I have! ;)
Regardless. $1000 or $19000 wine is not snake oil. If held at gunpoint and told that to leave alive I must give $1000 for which I will walk away with a 1 meter audio quest bi-wire cable, or a magnificent bottle of Chateaunuef-du-Pape... I will take the wine. And likely enjoy it. ;)
Cheers! :)
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Spartan
The Legendary Study That Embarrassed Wine Experts Across the Globe

There are tons of links about it, and they all read a lot like exotic cables. Change the label on the bottle or use a little food coloring and trained pros can't tell the difference.
I just browsed a little, but I've seen a similar study where the "experts" were fooled by pouring cheap wine into an expensive wine's bottle.

HUMAN BIAS

and, why DBTs are critical to get an unbiased data set.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Spartan
If those wine experts were truly keen on what is and what isn't great wine, there is no way, under any circumstances that they could be fooled.
Here's the thing, human bias is real, and is incredibly difficult to beat.

Maybe a couple of the experts would catch on here, but when human bias comes into play, you are fighting a losing battle.

You get tricked, or you trick yourself into believing what your eyes are telling you, even if what your eyes are telling you does not line up with reality. This is how the human mind works!

I work in a lab, and sometimes I will ask a lab tech to perform a particular task or analysis, precisely because I know that this person does not know the expected outcome. I personally already know what I expect to see in the results, so I have an expectation bias. Send the work to someone that has no clue what to expect, and they won't have the same bias as me.
 
Auditor55

Auditor55

Audioholic Chief
Snake Oil have no bounds!


I wonder if these are made as museum pieces or Expos. I can't believe any self proclaimed audiophiles would by any of those speakers.
 

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