Shrinking woofer sizes for hifi ?

charmerci

charmerci

Audioholic
yeah I’ve heard of them and psa.
Ill never be able to afford those or let alone move them . Oddly there big woofers don’t go below 60-70 hz!!!
I said they do exist but super expensive!!!!
In general most speakers aren’t over 6.5-8” max size .
Some towers have 4-6” woofers, brands charge a ton for small speakers like kef r .
Actually, you'd be surprised at how much bass that most people hear and love comes from 50-80 hz. Below that is mostly things rattling in your room.
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
They got too many cooks in the kitchen and couldn’t decide on the final finishes for their cabinets. But no exact dates yet on when they are available to ship. :D
What? RBH is doing a new speaker line you got me curious bro you gotta hit me with a PM about this
 
H

Hetfield

Audioholic Field Marshall
What? RBH is doing a new speaker line you got me curious bro you gotta hit me with a PM about this
Correct me if I'm wrong but RBH used to have a very affordable line of speakers that were highly rated and reviewed well? I can't remember the model numbers though.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk
 
MalVeauX

MalVeauX

Full Audioholic
Convenience is king. The market is not playing to the enthusiast niche, it's mostly playing to the mass market and the mass market wants small, convenient, inexpensive stuff these days. No more big headphones, they want wireless in-ear monitors. No more big speakers, they want tiny portable bluetooth speakers with zero wires. No more gear, they have a smart phone and the internet. And when any of these types come into a crowd of enthusiasts, they get told their audio equipment and media quality are all essentially garbage and that they need huge, expensive, inconvenient things.

So it's easier to lure in the mass market to the entry point of enthusiast audio with small options that are inexpensive. And while they're sort of meh for an already deep into it enthusiast, the fact that they have a speaker, at all, is a huge change in their audio journey. 20 and 30 year-olds today grew up with 1" tweeters on their TV and whatever came in their vehicle (and they never even thought about it) and never even bought a boom box or anything like that because they grew up with smart phones, TV and internet. Most of these people get a small cabinet speaker in the form of a sound bar because its small, inexpensive and sounds better than their TV's built in drivers and they're content. And they only discovered it due to adds on social media, not because they were actively looking up better audio experiences. And if they can sling their bluetooth to it, all the better. They slowly, if they get into it, creeping into some enthusiast equipment, again, they're likely to bite on small, affordable, not huge cabinet stuff. Going from wireless air pods to huge wired towers and wired subs is a life change and mindset change. And people have less space globally on top of it. And it's heavy and work, so that's also going up against today's cultural norms.

Today's "audiophiles" wear audio-jewelry instead and stream soundcloud, spotify and whatever video service they're subscribed to. It's hard to convince them that they need big drivers in big cabinets and they're not portable and they have to have people over to their place to share a listen, rather than just clicking "share" on their phone and sending it to 5k people on the internet to listen to.

Very best,
 
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Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
Correct me if I'm wrong but RBH used to have a very affordable line of speakers that were highly rated and reviewed well? I can't remember the model numbers though.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk
Yes they did maybe they are restructuring that line
 
Kingnoob

Kingnoob

Audioholic Field Marshall
Convenience is king. The market is not playing to the enthusiast niche, it's mostly playing to the mass market and the mass market wants small, convenient, inexpensive stuff these days. No more big headphones, they want wireless in-ear monitors. No more big speakers, they want tiny portable bluetooth speakers with zero wires. No more gear, they have a smart phone and the internet. And when any of these types come into a crowd of enthusiasts, they get told their audio equipment and media quality are all essentially garbage and that they need huge, expensive, inconvenient things.

So it's easier to lure in the mass market to the entry point of enthusiast audio with small options that are inexpensive. And while they're sort of meh for an already deep into it enthusiast, the fact that they have a speaker, at all, is a huge change in their audio journey. 20 and 30 year-olds today grew up with 1" tweeters on their TV and whatever came in their vehicle (and they never even thought about it) and never even bought a boom box or anything like that because they grew up with smart phones, TV and internet. Most of these people get a small cabinet speaker in the form of a sound bar because its small, inexpensive and sounds better than their TV's built in drivers and they're content. And they only discovered it due to adds on social media, not because they were actively looking up better audio experiences. And if they can sling their bluetooth to it, all the better. They slowly, if they get into it, creeping into some enthusiast equipment, again, they're likely to bite on small, affordable, not huge cabinet stuff. Going from wireless air pods to huge wired towers and wired subs is a life change and mindset change. And people have less space globally on top of it. And it's heavy and work, so that's also going up against today's cultural norms.

Today's "audiophiles" wear audio-jewelry instead and stream soundcloud, spotify and whatever video service they're subscribed to. It's hard to convince them that they need big drivers in big cabinets and they're not portable and they have to have people over to their place to share a listen, rather than just clicking "share" on their phone and sending it to 5k people on the internet to listen to.

Very best,
Yeah Bluetooth, soundbars , micro headphones are all shrinking audio sizes . And most Bluetooth speaker don’t even have woofers just midranges.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
What? RBH is doing a new speaker line you got me curious bro you gotta hit me with a PM about this
The new line just replaces the smaller SV6500, SV661, SV61.

The SV831/SV821/SV1212 are still the flagship.
 
H

head_unit

Audioholic Intern
RTR had speakers in the late-'70s/early-'80s with woofers that were about 26" diameter
A coworker friend had those things! In his bedroom!! Playing a TURNTABLE!!! Yeah, that didn't work too well. His parents were older and I think literally somewhat deaf.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Correct me if I'm wrong but RBH used to have a very affordable line of speakers that were highly rated and reviewed well? I can't remember the model numbers though.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk
You thinking of their former Emp Tek brand?
 
Kingnoob

Kingnoob

Audioholic Field Marshall
You thinking of their former Emp Tek brand?
Wow rbh is expensive, so looks and not sound quality is shrinking woofers of average speakers ? Revel has 7k speakers with baby 6” woofers . Insanity https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwiRrv3l7LvwAhWAOLMAHVWIDMQYABAHGgJ5bQ&ae=2&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAASEuRoXGOwDI1h22bXWActZkupAA&sig=AOD64_3ugl9WvR9_MEB2_Pvp06KBc9-OZw&ctype=5&q=&ved=2ahUKEwin4fbl7LvwAhXSMd8KHQ2jA8YQwg96BAgBECI&adurl=
I’ll probably never be able to afford something that expensive
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Spartan
Stop that. If you don't get out of that mindset you're going to be right about that. That's dumb. Anyone can change their life. They just have to take the first step.

People on here have offered to help. Let them if you don't think you have any other options. Life is simple, people complicate things for themselves.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Spartan
Shrinkflation.
It's infuriating. So much of this is so subtle that people don't even notice.

I hadn't eaten cereal for years and went to get some since my kids asked for it. I couldn't believe how small the boxes had gotten over the years.

We get nickel and dimed to death on stuff like this.
 
Eppie

Eppie

Senior Audioholic
Wow rbh is expensive, so looks and not sound quality is shrinking woofers of average speakers ? Revel has 7k speakers with baby 6” woofers . Insanity https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwiRrv3l7LvwAhWAOLMAHVWIDMQYABAHGgJ5bQ&ae=2&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAASEuRoXGOwDI1h22bXWActZkupAA&sig=AOD64_3ugl9WvR9_MEB2_Pvp06KBc9-OZw&ctype=5&q=&ved=2ahUKEwin4fbl7LvwAhXSMd8KHQ2jA8YQwg96BAgBECI&adurl=
I’ll probably never be able to afford something that expensive
Totem uses two 4" Torrent drivers (of their own design) in their Tribe speakers. These are high excursion drivers that supposedly produce a decent amount of bass. Some reviewers rave about them, but the response is not very flat. The engineering efforts seem to have gone into creating stronger surrounds and magnets that allow for the high excursion needed for these little speakers to reach low frequencies. I don't think they will ever truly match the performance of larger drivers though simply due to the physics involved and the small surface area trying to create a big pressure wave.
 
Kingnoob

Kingnoob

Audioholic Field Marshall
It's infuriating. So much of this is so subtle that people don't even notice.

I hadn't eaten cereal for years and went to get some since my kids asked for it. I couldn't believe how small the boxes had gotten over the years.

We get nickel and dimed to death on stuff like this.
Only get a few bowls of cereal out of most boxes these days ... yet profits rise every year as prices go up and sizes go down.
speakers definitely are smaller but prices haven’t shot up like food. Some speakers costed more in the past , but we definitely get less wooferage .
Klipch heritage has risen significantly!! And vintage styled gear ⚙ .
 
S

stalag2005

Full Audioholic
My system which I do 80%+ of my listening is on my computer system with a pair of bookshelf speakers (Martin Logan LX-16) with a subwoofer (SB-3000 SVS). The Martin Logans can stand on their own, just that I miss that low end rumble. Given this that is the reason for the subwoofer. Most people don't know that there is a significant low end in music much less that you can have it in a movie (bluray, high definition video) and actually hear the music. Small gets you typically down to 50 Hz (rare cases are lower) if the largest speaker is 6 inches or less and it is much harder to do low if the largest speaker has to do midrange as well. This is due to physical limits. You can go low with a small speaker, but it has to be tuned to do so. One of the original subwoofers in that category with tuned small speakers might be the Paradigm Signature Subwoofer but I am certain there are others in this category. In very low frequencies, size does matter to a degree, but how it is output is also a key. Material choice and other parameters can offset small to a degree, but the very low stuff many here obsess about is only seen generally with large surface area.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Overlord
Like I alluded to on the first page, I don't think it's so much a money thing as it is today's drivers are a lot more advanced. My current towers -3 dB is 41 hz with 5.5" bass drivers. I've owned a couple of different speakers with larger drivers that can't dig that deep. My older B&Ws had 8" woofers and wouldn't go down to 41 hz.
 
Eppie

Eppie

Senior Audioholic
Like I alluded to on the first page, I don't think it's so much a money thing as it is today's drivers are a lot more advanced. My current towers -3 dB is 41 hz with 5.5" bass drivers. I've owned a couple of different speakers with larger drivers that can't dig that deep. My older B&Ws had 8" woofers and wouldn't go down to 41 hz.
I was thinking more along the lines of full range speakers, but yes, technology has played a big part in this. I think there have been advancements in cabinet design as well that allow smaller drivers to go deeper. Will be interesting to see if someone eventually gets a 6" or 5" driver to be relatively flat down to 30 or 20Hz. Totem rates their Tribe with its 4" Torrent drivers down to 30Hz but they don't state within what dB range and the response curve is all over the place. Someone could eventually prove me wrong and get those small drivers to behave well over a broader range of frequencies.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Like I alluded to on the first page, I don't think it's so much a money thing as it is today's drivers are a lot more advanced. My current towers -3 dB is 41 hz with 5.5" bass drivers. I've owned a couple of different speakers with larger drivers that can't dig that deep. My older B&Ws had 8" woofers and wouldn't go down to 41 hz.
They do 41Hz @-3dB, but if you compare them directly with something that has a larger woofer in a decently-designed cabinet, it's likely that the larger woofer would cause you to feel frequencies that would only be a slight sensation with the smaller ones. Small woofers don't produce the sound of a kick drum well enough for it to be called 'realistic' because, as a piston assembly, they don't move enough air.
 

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